Film Courage: ESCAPE ROOM is a movie that you wrote is that right? Did you also direct it? Peter Dukes, Horror Writer/Director: I did.
I had written several spec screenplays that were very ambitious, very...my you
know my HEREDITARY or my BABADOOK, my LET THE RIGHT ONE IN, something bold, and
different and atmospheric and so on and a lot of my specs would get optioned but
not financed it always scared the financers they want something you can
pitch in one line something that can easily be marketed in one job maybe two
so I said okay well I'm getting older here I need to write something for the
first time in my life I need to write something for them something that
they're looking for something with all the bullet points or all the marketing
you know keys I said so my game will be what can I write for them that I'm still
proud of something that walks the line that's something for them and something
for me also so I you know they like something that's got a strong hook
that's high concept that can be produced easily all these things so I had been to
an escape room and saw that it was kind of blowing up and getting more and more
popular I said okay well I'm gonna form a story around that long story short I
found an angles that I wanted to tell that story I wrote it very quickly sold
it very quickly first script I ever sold that got financed immediately because it
hit all their points I went maybe there's something learned from this and
it was again it was off to the races what they financed it it moved very
quickly but my game since then has been to balance writing I'll say for them but
writing what's really marketable versus maybe some other types of stories that I
really want to tell also I try to oscillate and kind of go between them a
little bit without going too far into any it's it's it's a fine dance that I'm
still learning and will continue to learn a little bit more but it's
interesting because there's a lot of super talented writers I've seen out
there who've never had a single script financed even optioned because they have
written these bold screenplays that you know doesn't isn't a great fit
for say abroad audience or just a just a very key demographic that can be sold to
investors and investors like safe bets like anybody else so you know God bless
them I hope they get financed because some of these scripts are fantastic
scripts but if you are a new script writer and you are looking to be like
gosh I want to get I do anything to get optional at one time let me get optioned
it is something worth considering keep fighting the good fight but you know if
you're gonna be in the business of filmmaking there is a business aspect to
it and that includes marketable material what's currently trending right now it's
you know female-driven ground and thrillers or IP content whatever it is
but keep your finger on the pulse and at times give them what they want but
inject enough of yourself into it that it's something you can be really proud
of so what was the process like once you finished writing escape room how are you
knowing where to send it out I mean that's that's really fascinating so you
go to this escape room yo oh okay this is cool I've been to one it's really
neat it's kind of cool to hear with strangers like trying to figure
something out and there's just a lot of fun to it but you you go okay so I've
got a hit on these beats great okay so you finish it probably have it maybe one
or two people look at it I don't know I'm just assuming I may have had my
younger sister Aubrey read it okay but not many what some people will do and
listen I haven't done everything the way some real professional other
screenwriters would do some guys there's certain routes you might go when you
take it to prestigious breakdown services and they cover it and they go
this is amazing or this is great but you really need to fix X Y and C there's a
number of things you can do that are legitimate ways to get it properly
prepared early on I just never did that never did that
I certainly not with a scape room I have with some of my scripts since then and
it's been actually pretty valuable and getting them optioned but with a scape
room I just wrote it for as simple as it was I was like I don't need to take the
time or the money to get so unprofessional to cover it I know what
it is I wrote it for the people I know what they want this is enough this is
what it is and and it turned out it was in terms of how I got it out
for people to see there's different routes I've learned along the way for
many years I literally put scripts out on God Craigslist
online free sites Craigslist which might waste your time 99% of the time in what
section screenwriters I believe Oakland writers they've changed since escape
since that one got done now it's a paid site and I've adjusted some of their
rules a little bit so I don't know if they can do it anymore but and I went on
Craigslist to hire crew I used it for years oh sure anyways I put scripts out
there for years nothing but the right guy saw it on the right day on
Craigslist on Craigslist and said let's hop in the phone and we hopped in the
phone conversation went well met in person conversation went well
sold it do you still have the post did you do like a screenshot no I don't have
to pose I'm still in touch with the guy all the time and other guys I have
another picture that's coming together now I I can't divulge details they're
keeping it all under wraps but I'm hoping it's my game-changer it's going
at an a-list level far bigger budget than anything I've ever done that the
seedling of that deal began through I think LinkedIn some guy the right guy on
the right day saw post of mine or saw my page and went hey you got anything and I
said sure and I pitched him a bunch of concepts he picked one or two or
whatever I sent it to him he goes okay this is cool let me read this script and
usually they'll say that you'll hear from him never again or six weeks down
the road he called me two hours later and said I want it I know exactly what
I'm taking it to and it was off to the races
so these sites that don't cost any money that's another thing I picked up through
my years is it takes a lot of time but get yourself out there
Craigslist LinkedIn Instagram Facebook Twitter build yourself a brand and and
network my first several years making short films I'm so busy making films I
never networked never marketed the films barely ever well I made posters but I
didn't do a whole lot with him I've chain
my ways since then I've definitely focused certainly when I was ready to
jump into the feature world I started reaching out to anyone and everyone I
could that I knew was a mover and a shaker or someone who could make a big
difference in my career and you reach out to him for an introduction and you
might get you will get rejected or no answer a thousand times
but all you need is that one if you can get one person to get you back and you
can pitch your ideas to them you might just catch them on that day and that has
worked for me again and again and again now it's buried within years I'm not
hearing anything but that's where it was I didn't have CEA representing me I
didn't have zero gravity or some of these big management companies I just
had me and most filmmakers who were working their way up just have
themselves so you have to put yourself out there you got to put your material
out there and with my screenplays I started putting them into all the most
prestigious screenwriting contests I could find only the most prestigious
because that's really the only ones that agencies and people are looking out for
and if you finished in the top three or the top five nothing below that usually
but the top three are top five you'll get a call from these people so anyways
you can you could there's a number of ways to get your scripts out there to
producers or whatever just got to find it when you were driving to meet this
person from this Craigslist post what's going through your mind you know I
wasn't nervous I wasn't excited I've been in the business long enough to be
very even keel whether I get news that would be considered a blow or whether
it's news that would be considered life-changing I always take it even keel
because you know anything could happen in this town and usually if it's really
good it comes down to earth a little bit if it's really bad it's not ever that
bad I mean so when I was on the way to meet this guy I'd had so many meetings
with past producers on different projects and I'd had so many of my
scripts optioned that it wasn't I it just wasn't a big deal to me I went
there prepared for however it might go he liked the script I'll have a meeting
with him see if he's a nice guy he'll say yes I'll say no I'm
excellent you do it enough time over so many years you know it it kind of ceases
to affect you it ceases to affect me as much and I think part of that is a
defense mechanism because if you're living and dying by the rejection or the
success of each project that's a hard way to live life because in the film
business you're going to be rejected for years I don't care how famous you are
and you'll have some successes to enjoy them you know Greve philosophy have but
I mean I you know you got to kind of you know keep your head on your shoulders
so then once you realize that this person was legit and they really did
want to option your script what were the steps they drew up a contract and they
presented it to you yeah it was a couple years ago with this particular producer
was less formal than most with many deals I've done since then you've got
legal teams involved very comprehensive contracts there's various protocols and
steps that they take with this guy fun-loving guy nicest guy he's like okay
I'll type up something you want to do it I want to do it here's one here's your
signature here's my signature that's good now move on and it was it was a
short form agreement it's basically what it was and the longer form agreement
came later on once the production company had had technically optioned
slash purchased the script more contracts were signed but at first it
was varied from one and a lot of these I've learned a lot of these producers
and filmmakers who kind of live within this million dollar in under budget
world it's it tends to be very informal you know sometimes a little bit more
than I would like I would like to kind of cover the bases a little bit more but
by and large you're not talking about millions and millions of dollars these
are people who just want to make a movie and many times in the past that was me
so I said okay fine this is fine you know if I get screwed on this I'm not
gonna get screwed by much and I get a movie under the belt so and but I to my
recollection was a very simple agreement based largely on
you know in good faith we do this and we promise to do this and talk later and I
don't recall the exact amount of days anymore but it just compared to my past
experiences where it's like all option for a year you hear nothing for a year
just nothing ever really happens this was just like I've got this guy know
we'll give it to him he knows these guys who are looking for this material
they're kind of a start-up and they're really doing a lot of pictures right now
and went to them I had one meeting with them I I mean the
money was there within days Wow and it was jumping straight into
pre-production it was a very very fast production so it was you know
head-spinning ly fast but you know it was it was in all those new experiences
are always good experiences to me I've found that in all especially in the
feature world is you encounter different people and different deals and each
feature is always a different organism unto itself both in terms of the
personnel and the contracts and all the variables involved that both the good
and bad experiences are beneficial to you because you learn from both of them
so it was an interesting process so with the bad are there certain red flags that
when you let's say go to a meeting with someone and you you keep an even keel
and you're driving there and you're like okay
it could happen maybe not yes but then somebody says something something
happens and you go BAM this is okay you know I'm certainly not special a lot of
filmmakers have been around for a long time but I was going I know I've been
saying I've been doing this long enough time that I have a good instinct for all
that stuff the red flags are usually very obvious and very fast and very
early on so you have a decision at that point to make is it worth it some of
these flags to continue onward or not and and as I've built my currency in my
leverage and and the kind of people I would work with them the kind of
projects I want to do more and more and more I will avoid working with those
types of people are getting involved in certain types of productions and I have
years ago I may not have done it but certainly in the last couple years I've
turned down several projects I've turned down offers
right movies feature movies I've turned down directing jobs I've turned down
option agreements cuz I went you know what I spotted the red flags I want no
part of it sorry what are some of the red just maybe just a hand all like well
it's hard to really get into it some of them are so specific I'd rather not you
know get some of them could be as simple as personality the type of people you
want to work with how grueling it's going to make the experience I think for
most for me when I want to get involved in a feature production which is kind of
like going to war you're getting deeply involved in this stuff being on sets a
pressure cooker you know time and money's on the line all the time you
wanna I want to work with people that I have a positive synergy with we all have
a singular vision of what we want this film or that project to be this isn't to
say that you have to get along with everybody but there are certain
personality types and certain procedures I've seen put in place that you know
just make things harder than they need to be some of its crossed into legal
issues some of it is just simply you know I just don't want to work for a
bully I can yeah and the issues can be large or small but whatever it is you
know it's it's something that you can only attain through experience you know
you you start to just pick up on it like anything else in life you just get a gut
reaction and and again most of these guys and most of these deals the flags
are are numerous obvious and and demonstrated earlier you pick a minute
early like first meeting usually you'll know okay I've see some things here and
now I have my decision to make delay grind through do I make it work or do I
detour off the left to take the next project but you know for everyone
watching I mean they able as they start to get into more and more deals
especially feature deals you know you'll you'll pick it up I mean most of its its
most of its in plain sight well aside from someone maybe being a social
bullier or just an abrasive personality or whatever
are other other things like you know I like hey how about it's a handshake sure
they don't want to put anything in an email they only want to call you yeah
they don't want anything and right like we're putting morning about them so no
that's just totally fine short having people who are working with a team you
trust is important working with a team that you're comfortable with and you're
cohesive with it's difficult to be on a production some filmmakers white might
sign on to a feature deal because I just want to get a feature made and they sign
on with a team that maybe wasn't the best fit for their script they have a
different vision than you now you're like this the whole production and
usually at the end you get a picture that's muddied if there is no singular
vision now it's a mash of both so you should always know who you're going into
business with get a fill form that's what those meetings are for figure out
who you're comfortable with and who you're not comfortable with a lot of the
time it's also not the kind of flags that are raised once you're deep into
production it's like the first caller to for instance you'd ask for examples for
me very quickly now I'll know a producer who's going to waste my time for six
months and never get anything done mind you a lot of these guys are totally
decent people not a malicious bone in their body but I know enough now that
when I hear certain things or I see the way they do certain things and what
their planners are lack thereof for their production in terms of getting
financing or putting together a pitch deck or where they're gonna do their
business so on and so forth I know this person is never gonna get this picture
made they'll try but they're never gonna get
it made so you know and again it's hard to explain how you pick that up it's
fairly basic stuff but for me I just kind of figured it out a long time ago
so I try to work with people where I go this guy is serious business he knows
what he's doing I've heard his plan it's sound this is a man with experience or
woman this is someone who has their saying all the right things I know
exactly what they're talking about I visualize what their business proposal
is they do everything legit none of its lazy or incomplete or rushed you know
simple little things like that but I try my best to work with people who I'm
confident have the ability to actually get my scripts made otherwise I won't do
this otherwise I'll turn down the option offer I guess if you will and that's the
most important step the second of course is sure I'd love them to be people that
we have a good synergy together we can talk about the project and move
forward in a way that's not only healthy for the relationship and leads to more
features down the line more collaborations but also is in the best
interest of the script itself because you never want to sign on to one of
these things and see this script that you bled for to kind of create and bring
it to life kind of turn into this kind of flat you know haphazard completed
project but you're just like I don't even want my friends to see it like I
don't want anyone to see it I luckily haven't had anything that severe but but
I can see how it can get there very quickly if you're not careful so I guess
the lesson would be especially early on yes you need to get a feature under your
belt and sometimes you might have to sacrifice a little bit to get it done
but you know don't throw all your eggs in one basket just to get your project
made make sure it's made with the right people find the right people people that
you're comfortable with and you know go for that it's perfectly fine to pass on
a few potential parties and and find the right fit
you