- Welcome back to another episode of
Scenic Fights - Fight Scene Breakdown!
I'm Logan Lo.
- Chad Vázquez.
- Today We're looking at the prison fight scene
from the second season of Daredevil
with the Punisher played by Jon Bernthal
in this really like crazy fight scene
- Yup.
with melee weapons, improvised weapons. Really cool.
I'm excited about this.
- Yeah, it's actually,
it's a very good fight scene.
- All right let's check it out.
- [Logan] Castle knows something's up.
- Look at that stare.
- He's ready to give punishment.
- Here we go. Bam.
Just going through these guys.
This is a good use of terrain, right?
We've seen this before in Raid 2,
- Yeah.
- with Hammer Girl where they make
use of this narrow corridor.
You have a melee fight with these numbers that could
overwhelm Frank, but because he's fighting
them essentially one at a time
- Can't get flanked.
- Exactly.
That's an interesting hip throw. That's a type of
Filipino hip throw they call the Filipinos call
they're kind of
grappling art Dumog.
And it's basically used for weapons.
So you have an attacker with a weapon and you use your Dumog
to take him to the ground and leave them with the
weapon, which is exactly what Frank did here.
I'm actually going to do a take-down to Chad.
I'm super excited about this.
Been dreaming about this moment for ages.
- Payback time.
- So Chad's coming in and Castle stopped him
by coming in closer
Observe what happens if I don't come in close.
Do it again. I don't come in close and boom,
I get struck. One major difference between people that know
how to fight and people that don't know how to fight is they
understand where is their safe area.
So Chad, where would be a safe area for you?
- Okay. Well definitely
- Definitely here, right?
- Here.
- And the other safe areas is
- Far away.
- Here. Right?
So safety is in the extremes.
Safety is far away or super close.
And we see that in this perfect example here
where Castle sees that he's about to get hit and
he doesn't want to back away.
He presses the fight forward,
knowing that there's safety in being close.
So we're doing this again. Castle sees what's happened.
He stops him immediately capturing the arm,
doing a headbutt and coming in,
coming around and doing a hip throw. Bam here.
Now for me, I would probably come down with my knee here,
but Castle comes down here like this,
having one knee up one knee down.
I would like to note how nice my throw was to Chad
versus how Chad throws me when he does his
breakdowns. So now Castle takes the weapon and
this guy is done, he's not moving for
some reason. And now Castle is armed with a stick
and can now fight.
He's an assailant, armed with a weapon.
- [Logan] Armed. Love it.
Ooh.
- [Chad] Ooh. Okay. He stabbed him.
- Yeah. So that's a number five attack.
So the number five is the first of three stabs.
So you have the number five, the eight and the nine.
Let's go further. We'll break down the
five for sure. But let's see what else
we have here.
- [Logan] Strike to the knee.
He took a stab to his forearm
- Yeah. Oof.
- and he got clocked in the face.
That is brutal.
- Man, prison style baby.
- Okay. So here, Castle now has a shiv and he,
he struck the guy with the number five attack.
In this context, it's also called a sewing machine attack.
We'll talk about that too.
- [Logan] Comes up.
He stabbed him in the groin and then the chest.
Castle knows someone's behind him. Boom.
Finishes him. Okay.
We have our second stab, number eight stab.
We're going to talk about that one too. So here,
we're going to talk about the number five attack.
We're actually going to talk about it twice.
There's a stick version and a knife version.
They're very similar,
but are slight differences that we need to talk about in our
system. There are mostly slashes, but there are three stabs.
Number five, the number eight and the number nine.
So unlike in fencing where there's this big lunging attack
thrust, we don't have that.
It's sort of more of a, of a short stabbing motion.
When a proper number five attack happens,
it's generally here.
And then I can stab this in. Why?
Because now I have the force. Now,
Chad, when you fight, have you ever thrown a punch
like this before?
- No.
- Right. It's a ridiculous looking thing. Right?
- Yeah
- But we have this
and people are like, well, why are,
why is your arm back? There's a reason.
I don't want you to grab my weapon.
I need to keep you at bay so I can get into the right
position. And then shove this up.
That is the number five attack.
I want to come in.
It's almost like a Pitchfork. I'm going to
shove this in him. And my goal is to throw it behind me.
Of course, that's not going to happen with
his weight. So I'm just plunging it in.
- And plus it's a bladed weapon.
It doesn't need that much force to work anyway. So.
- Well, the thing is, is that it wasn't a blade.
It was a pointy weapon. He penetrated
through the guy. So Frank just shoved it
into the person and just went on his
Merry way. So that was a great number five stab
It's a great introduction to it.
- [Logan] Here. We have a number five again,
but we have it in a way that's called
the sewing machine attack. It's barbaric.
It is not very refined, but it's very effective.
You know? - Hmm.
- And sometimes the best attacks are the
simple attacks. Now in this scene,
Castle and the assailant were on the ground.
We're going to do it standing up just so you can see how
dangerous this is. Let's say I have Chad here.
He knows I'm going to do a number five.
I'm telling him I'm gonna do number five right now,
but we'll see what happens.
Here we go. You ready Chad?
- Yup. - Here we go.
- Yeah, that's hard. Yeah, got me.
- At some point, it's going to penetrate.
So you just have to get out of there.
You need to unlock yourself and not be.
- And I felt it was tough to like catch your wrist.
So if you're really going super fast there,
that the chance of me holding a wrist is very difficult.
- That was a very realistic thing for Castle to do
in that scene. That's a realistic thing to
happen in prison, frankly. You have to be very careful
about these types of weapons, these shivved weapons,
which are not refined at all. But effective.
- Just based off the top of my head what I would do in this
scenario, I would remove this grip ASAP.
There's different ways of doing it. I mean,
I can quickly maybe use a Russian tie up to
slip with and create distance.
I don't think I would ever want to stay even near Logan with
that type of weapon. And that type of movement.
- This is where reality hits into theory.
I've been doing knife work and weapons work
you know, 17 years, really long time. And Chad,
how long have you been doing fighting?
- About 13 years,
- About 13 years.
- We've been doing this for a long time,
but here's the thing - against someone that is
truly dedicated and wants that stab,
these very simple motions are lethal
and they're dangerous even for trained people.
If I had someone that was attacking me with a number five
sewing machine, I would take that seriously.
That is dangerous.
That is very dangerous for anyone.
- [Logan] We've touched on two versions of the
number five stab. And now we're going to talk
about the number eight stab.
Chad is there is there, there's no punch like this, right?
- Not that I know of. No,
- This is there's no punch like this. Why?
Because there's not enough force generated.
I'm going to hit you as hard as I can on this
shoulder with this.
- Okay.
- Tell me, tell me what it does, right?
- eh
- Not doing anything.
I mean, he's laughing that off.
Here's what a number eight is. So Chad,
I'm going to hit you here.
- Okay.
So here we go. Go on here.
Right?
So wherever I come in, boom,
- Yeah
I'm telling him to stop me here. So stop me here.
Stop me here. Right?
- Oh.
- Number eight stab with a weapon
is incredibly hard to see
for someone that's not trained in the number eight
and I am trained in the number eight and I'm scared of it.
It's because it's so unorthodox.
Chad is used to things like this.
He's used to things like this.
He's not used to a lead hand coming in from the outside
left side,
his right side.
That is something foreign to him.
And that is why the number eight stab is so dangerous
because it is so unorthodox.
It is actually one of my favorite attacks with a tool.
With a weapon
because I can shoot it from any angle.
I can shoot it from the outside right.
I can shoot it from the middle.
I can shoot it from here.
I can shoot it from any angle in ways that
my assailant is unprepared for.
In this particular scene, Castle sees that
another number one is coming.
He stops it. Kind of hard to see what's happening,
but I'm assuming he throws a number eight to the body
and then staying in the blender,
he throws the number eight to the neck,
finishing his assailant and then pushing him into a cell
Great move. Very simple, very effective.
- What's also is very impressive was that it was
the actual guy's cell. That was actually where he's-
that's - that his number.
So Castle good job!
- [Logan] Throws him into the cell.
- Okay. So here front headlock.
Guillotine, Okay.
So he uses a, a front headlock.
- Does that, is that real?
- Cracking the neck? No.
Let's break that down. Let's go over what you can
do with that position.
- Don't break my neck.
- Well, you know, we'll, we'll see,
I'll let the director and we'll, we'll,
we'll get a cue on that.
- Fight's moving on, Castle does what he does best.
He's Punishing people. And now he gets a front headlock
on one of the assailants and he essentially
breaks their neck, which is not real.
So, okay. What would you do?
Assuming there's not other people here and
I want to proceed to finishing this person.
The quickest way I can go about it is a strangle.
Particularly a guillotine strangle.
Now there are different types of guillotines.
The one I'll perform is a high elbow guillotine.
So what that means is as I connect my hands like so,
I'm going to move my head over to the far shoulder
and lift my elbow and hand up high
getting the hand as high as I
can over the shoulder line.
Could I strangle Logan on my feet?
Possibly, but with someone truly resisting, even untrained,
it's tough. It's going to take a while and
tell you the truth, guillotine strangles do take
a bit of time to work.
The best way,
to get the quickest results of strangling someone
with a guillotine is by taking the fight to the
ground and using your legs.
I apply the high elbow position.
I step towards my training partner,
my bottom leg pivots and then I slide
right into this clamp, pulling my partner in,
I push into the carotid.
Applying a strangle and using my legs
and applying this type of motion for the squeeze.
However, within this context, Castle's fighting multiple
assailants with weapons.
Now, I understand why the neck breaking
move was applied there.
It was a means of getting rid of the guy ASAP
to move to the next person.
That makes sense, even though in reality,
it's not a real means of dealing with that person.
Another realistic option
is taking the head and smashing it against a jail bar.
- Sure
Hoping that that knocks the guy out and
allows Castle to move on to the next person.
- I agree.
- [Logan] Oh, slow motion punched in the face.
Bam.
Oh. - Okay.
- Looks like another Fireman's carry.
- Okay. So it looks like Castle did modern style of a
Kata Guruma
Which we referenced off our Kengan Ashura episode.
Why don't we look at how Castle performed his takedown.
- Okay.
- And how it would realistically work compared to
let's say a modern Kata Guruma
In the battle, Castle,
He drops down and what is believed to be his right arm,
he goes over to grab behind the leg.
I'm assuming with the momentum that he created,
he used this tripping mechanism and his force
going forward to knock the guy down. And when
and what happens, he rolls over the legs and
comes to top position like so and
proceeds to a punching action.
Two issues here.
There was no upper body control that created kuzushi.
Also known as off-balance-ment.
To set up a connection like that.
He just went in, grabbed the leg and pushed through.
I would think even with a untrained person
who had some decent balance, it wouldn't be
that easy. So I don't, I don't think that's valid.
Two.
If you're going to punch someone without any protection,
it's recommended you don't use a closed fist.
You could fracture your hand.
So what are ways to replace that?
Open Palm or Elbows?
Those are two means of striking the face
effectively with reducing the chance of you
fracturing anything in your arm.
- [Logan] Frank's just going wild on this guy's face
Yeah picks up his weapon and
bam, goodnight Gracie.
So if given the option to use a tool
versus your bare hand,
use the tool.
- [Logan] He's just eating those punches.
- Yum.
- [Chad] All right.
- Oh.
- Okay.
- No, no, no.
- Ugh.
- So Castle just did an eye gouge.
- Yes, he did.
- Uh. That's really gross, but it is
also very effective. And here's the thing -
you learn a lot of eye pokes when it
when it comes to self-defense.
Eye pokes and eye gouges are very different things
and one is very not effective. And one is
very effective if you can get yourself to do it.
And it's pretty gross. I don't know many people
that can do it, but we'll talk about that.
This is one of my personal pet peeves,
as someone that teaches martial arts
and has taken martial arts
for pretty much his whole life.
There are so many self-defense teachers who would say,
you know, just hit the eye, just hit the eye.
If you and I are truly in a life and death fight,
and I poked you in the eye.
- I gotta eat that and move forward.
There's there's no pausing.
- Having said that, an eye gouge will absolutely stop them
Frank Castle basically shoved his thumb
into the assailant's eye socket.
It is incredibly brutal.
In fact, even just doing that,
I felt how brutal it was.
However, it's very realistic for Castle's character,
He's done some brutal things,
both in this series and in the comic books.
- That is, that is Frank Castle.
- That is Frank Castle right there.
So is that a valid move? 100%.
Could you do it? I do not want to meet you if you could.
- [Logan] Okay. But that guy is not stopping.
He's not stopping. He's got his weapon.
He's going in.
- [Chad] Oh.
- Oh, that is brutal.
- [Logan] Castle is punching the knife into the neck.
That is devastating enough.
But then he tears the knife out.
- Yeah
- Like that would have finished it, but not for Castle.
He wants to make sure.
- Yeah
- Oh yeah, let's make it as gross as possible.
- Oh yeah.
- If Chad's coming towards me,
I'm pushing out this knee as he's coming forward. Boom.
I catch him and notice that it's a perfect shot here.
Gravity itself. It's going to help me push that weapon out.
Not only penetrating, but also slicing through.
So I have his own body weight helping me slice through.
And that is definitely going to be a fight finisher.
I've always been a huge fan of the Punisher.
And I felt that this character really came out in this
scene because you can see he's focused
on what he needs to do.
He knows he's in trouble. He's just like, screw it.
I'm going to do this thing.
Great really good use of weapons.
We saw the number five attack
the number eight attack. We saw sewing machine attacks.
It is exactly how I would envision a
fight scene that happened in the narrow
confines of a prison like that.
I thought that was great.
- With regards to the grappling,
they do exist to a certain degree in the
realm of reality. Obviously there are certain points
where that, I just don't think it's real,
like breaking someone's neck that easily
and maybe the takedown, but I understand why
they chose those actions. So that's cool.
- That's why, because of all these things,
I give it a B plus.
It was a very good scene. It wasn't perfect,
but it was very good.
And I feel that for this universe and Frank Castle,
it was very appropriate.