I'm Chanté, and you're watching my show, Anything Goes.
Today's guest star is the talented actress Sian Clifford.
You know and love her from TV shows like Fleabag, Quiz, and Two Weeks to Live.
Listen along as we discuss all things uncertainty, friendship and channeling creativity.
Today, today, we are here with the incredible actress Sian Clifford.
What's happening?
So thrilled to be here.
Sat in my shell.
I'm literally so happy you're here.
Just thank you for sharing your gifts with the world.
We really don't deserve you.
Don't, you'll embarrass me. I'll start blushing.
So how are you? How are things and how have you been coping during this pandemic?
The biggest challenge for me has been sort of dealing with the uncertainty of everything.
But I feel like that can only be a good thing that we sort of start getting comfortable with that.
I'm a real like a control freak.
It's the aeries energy.
I mean, I feel like everyone kind of is to some extent.
I think that's totally human to want to do that.
But my whole philosophy throughout this entire madness has been to soften the grip,
and to just allow and surrender to what is and let's see, you know, where we are at the end of it
and really examine what the positives that we really should and could take with us.
Yeah, I think the biggest challenge has been a mental one. For sure.
But you are obviously very big into not mindfulness, but self inquiry.
Yeah.
Have I got that right? So like, what is that practice and what does that mean to you?
Well, I also refer to as like conscious living.
Yeah.
Which because I think mindfulness for me, I think it's we actually need to get out of our heads and into our bodies because it's about the feeling space for me.
So that's what we like,
what's really supported me is becoming much more conscious of that.
And I always describe it as almost like turning up the volume on your intuition but in every aspect of your life.
Obviously, like there are some areas of my life where it's at ten and there are some where it's a two.
And yeah, I think self inquiry is a more empowering word than like self improvement, because that tells you you're not good enough as you are, which I think everyone is.
It feels a bit like a capitalist scam, you know.
When I think of a lot of the mindfulness industry and the self improvement industry.
Yeah.
It's all about priming you and prepping you to be better equipped in the workforce or better equipped to contribute to the economy,
as opposed to getting to know yourself as an individual and figuring out the ways in which you can live a happier, more fulfilled life outside of how productive you are. Do you know what I mean?
Exactly. I think that industry has been commodified massively in the last sort of five to ten years.
You're absolutely right.
It's almost in the same way that advertising seeks to undermine you in order to sell you the thing that you need to make yourself better.
I think there's been a sort of danger around sort of spiritual and self-help.
In a world that that's happened.
I was coming off the back of, like, one of the busiest periods of my life. So actually,
I didn't have much left in the tank.
And like we have to get into it, because you have just been on our screens serving.
Stop it.
[Chanté] Fleabag, Quiz, Two Weeks to Live.
Like you have been doing the damn thing.
But this is all kind of come like in a short period of time.
And I'm wondering, before everything kicked off, did you anticipate that this would be happening?
What sort of headspace were you in?
No, I feel like really lucky because I filmed so much last year that I have got, like, stuff coming out throughout this year.
It's very,
it's been quite weird and also a bit of a gift.
[Chanté] Yeah.
Because I've been able to like still carry on with work essentially from home because it was a lot of press engagements and stuff like that.
Fleabag is obviously sort of the seed of all of the fruits of those opportunities.
So that has changed my life astronomically.
I'm beyond,
I'm not able to articulate it really.
Obviously, like Quiz was just an amazing job.
Like when that landed on my doorstep, I couldn't even believe I was being asked to be involved in it.
Like it just felt so huge and beyond me.
And then Two Weeks to Live working with Maisie, who I absolutely love.
Yeah. And they're such different things.
Range sis. You have range.
Oh stop it.
[Chanté] That's what the girls call it.
Yeah. So it's been, it's been like a ride, it's been a wild ride.
I think part of being an actor is this constant neurosis and fear of what comes next.
Yeah.
I definitely would love to do more producing on the right thing and I'm writing as well and I've, I've done that for a long time.
I'm following where the flow is right now.
And that's definitely, definitely with acting so.
I have like lovely people that I'm working with.
Phoebe Waller-Bridge is someone who pushes me so much and is constantly like.
Yeah.
"What have you done today?"
That is so good like an accountability partner.
[Sian] Yeah, exactly.
You need to, like, find your champions.
[Chanté] Yeah.
That's you know what I think of her as, is my greatest champion.
[Chanté] Yeah.
And you've got to find those people that invigorate and inspire you and that back you, you know.
And that's also been life changing for me is finding your collaborators.
The people that will get you to where you want to go.
Yeah.
And believe in you in places and spaces where you don't believe in yourself maybe as much.
I mean that was such a huge thing for me with fleabag that Phoebe really believed in me as an actor, definitely more than I, than I did myself at that stage in my career.
It's actually given me back a lot of confidence in lots of things, not just my acting, but also my writing.
You know.
Why do you think you ever lost confidence?
I think because any industry kind of wants to pigeonhole you and box you.
I don't think that's just specific to what I do.
I think that's what anyone does.
I think we, labels make people feel safe, but actually I think they restrain us, actually.
Yeah the more creative you can allow yourself to be in terms of your thinking, not necessarily in terms of your vocation,
the more fulfilled your life will be.
And even just going back to talking about the relationship between you and Phoebe,
I really love it because I feel like women in the media are often, like we're often pitted against each other and our friendships are used as content.
Oh yeah that's amazing you said that.
They tried to with the BAFTA because, of course, we were in the same category.
There was no question.
We were both just like backing the other.
[Chanté] Exactly.
And a win for one is always a win for the other because of all the stuff that you've done together.
And I can't tell you the joy that she had for me winning.
She was happier than anyone.
Aw I love that.
[Sian] She was the happiest.
She was like, "No this is, this is how the Fleabag journey ends."
Yeah.
Makes me emotional.
But it was just like and we spent that on our own.
It was just us like saying goodbye to that show.
So, yeah, no, it's really,
it's really special, and we have known each other for such a long time now.
How did you meet? In drama school?
Drama school yeah seventeen years ago.
I don't know why I asked that question. I answered it myself.
Yeah. Yes.
And did you just know from the moment that you were just going to be mates for life?
Well, like initially so there's like this three day initiation period and we're both from Ealing.
We're both from West London and but we're both from very different backgrounds.
So I think we were a little wary of each other initially.
Yeah.
And I can't remember if we were in the same groups or not in those first three days.
But no, on the on the third day they had, there was this kind of party.
We happened to leave at the same time I guess, and we were both stood on the platform at Goodge Street.
And we were like, "Oh God."
And of course, you know that feeling when you're getting on a tube and you know, it's a forty five minute journey.
And you're like, "oh God."
Yeah.
But by the end of that journey, then, yes, I knew I had a firm friend for sure.
I had an ally in that environment.
I love that.
As an actor, you meet new people all the time.
Like on a set, you meet like a hundred new people.
Like it's amazing.
And that's every, you know, few months or, you know, even in a job or wherever.
There's just, there are new fresh faces all the time.
Yeah, I love connecting with people, but I think now as I've got older and definitely with how my life has changed in the last couple of years, I'm really particular.
And also what I was saying about, you know, surrounding yourself with the people that you love and that love you is so important.
So I'm really I'm much more specific now about like,
who I make those connections with or sustain those connections with, I should say.
Yeah. Do you think that just comes of time as you get to know yourself better, you know what you want in the people around you?
Yeah, definitely.
And of course, a human can always surprise you.
Yeah, that's true actually.
Yeah, no I do. I love meeting new people.
I love that.
You have played some really incredible women across all of your roles.
And it would be interesting to know where those kind of inspirations come from.
I'll always approach every character differently.
With some characters, they immediately leap off the page.
I mean, usually, to be honest, they're the jobs that I go for because then the writing is doing so much of the work for you.
I mean, Fleabag like that character was fully formed the second it left Phoebe's pen like that's the-
Claire was, Claire was Claire.
It was so obvious to me how to play that character, which is why Phoebe and I constantly have this back and forth about like,
I give her all the credit and she throws it back to me because I'm like, "No, no, it was on the page."
I didn't have to do anything because for me I used to be so intellectual about it
or I used to intellectualize and overthink and be really in my head about characters and my scripts would be covered in notes and beats and breaking it all down.
And I have totally binned that, like that's gone. I don't do that now at all.
Softening in the grip.
Soften the grip.
I realize it's much more about embodying and a feeling.
I don't think I can play a character until I can feel them in my body.
So it really is about it's about feeling. It's about an energy.
And that's why the text can give you so much, because you can feel their rhythm.
And when you can feel that it's like their heartbeat, and then you, and then you can hold space for them in your body and you can feel it.
And then it's really clear how, you know, the rest will just follow.
And that's why I always want a different feeling.
Yeah. Yeah.
And that's why I want to play as many different humans as I can.
Yeah.
Because then you get to stretch a different muscle.
Yeah.
It's really exciting and it,
and I really think it cultivates your own empathy around that person's values, whether you share them or not.
That we all have these tells.
Yeah.
We all have these little things that give our true selves away, no matter how many masks we try to put on,
which is why I've tried to do away with as many as I can. But it's it's hard because of the world we live in.
But I do, the more sort of self inquiry that I do,
the more sort of I think I evolve, the more I want to get closer to that true version of myself.
And then and that's what I share with the world.
I love that.
And if you could give some advice to your younger self?
What would you say?
Soften the grip.
Love it. To the point.
Let's play some games.
Okay.
Oh.
Rowing, skiing.
Yeah yeah yeah.
Getting dressed.
Yeah.
You're so good at this.
I was going to say, where do they even live?
They live in the ocean.
A fish.
Sleepwalking. Ghost.
A zombie.
Yeah.
Sleepwalking.
Yeah.
Tennis.
Badminton.
Skip it skip it. I don't know
I'm too broke.
No.
A whale.
A shark.
No.
The opposite of false.
True...
lies.
Yeah.
Oh my God.
Oh my God. There's also a singer with the same name.
A Cher.
I don't know.
Something Bradshaw.
Carrie?
[Chanté] Yeah.
that's it.
Oh, yeah. Horror film.
Argos without the "s".
Argo.
You can't say that.
Gosh, that was hard. What's Argo?
Oh a seal. Why did I say Cher?
I was like I can't make that noise.