JOINING US. >> THANKS.
>>> WELL, DONALD TRUMP, IT TURNS OUT, IN IOWA, ANYWAY, IS
INDEFENSIBLE. THAT'S WHAT IT CAME DOWN TO
TODAY FOR REPUBLICAN SENATOR JONIE ERNST AT A TOWN HALL.
SHE FINDS DONALD TRUMP COMPLETELY INDEFENSIBLE AS A
PERSON, AND SHE HAS A VERY SERIOUS POLICY DISAGREEMENT WITH
PRESIDENT TRUMP. THEY WERE IN THE OPPOSITE SIDES
OF OF THAT POLICY TODAY. HERE IS SOME OF JONI ERNST'S
VERY LONG ANSWER TODAY WHEN SHE WAS ASKED HOW SHE COULD SUPPORT
A MAN WHO TREATS WOMEN THE WAY DONALD TRUMP DOES.
>> I THINK I SUPPORT A MAJORITY OF THE POLICIES VERSUS THE
ACTUAL PERSON. BUT I DECRY, YOU KNOW, I WOULD
DECRY ANY TIME -- ANY TIME A PERSON IS UGLY TOWARDS ANOTHER
PERSON. I DON'T THINK THAT'S
APPROPRIATE. SO HOW DID I FEEL ABOUT HIM?
AGAIN, POLICYWISE, WE DISAGREED ON POLICIES.
BUT HE TREATED ME -- HE WAS VERY NICE TO ME WHEN I MET HIM
FACE-TO-FACE. SO GOING BACK TO ACTUAL
POLICIES, IF WE AGREE ON POLICIES, I'M GOING TO BE
SUPPORTIVE. IF WE DISAGREE ON POLICIES,
WE'RE GOING TO DISAGREE. PERIOD.
BUT I THINK I'M A STRONG WOMAN, AND I THINK I'M A STRONG WOMAN,
AND I THINK THERE ARE A LOT OF STRONG WOMEN OUT THERE THAT WILL
COME OUT AND ANY TIME HE MAKES COMMENTS, WE'RE GOING TO SAY
THAT'S NOT APPROPRIATE. IT'S NOT APPROPRIATE.
>> THE ONLY THING THAT DONALD TRUMP HAS WON SO FAR IN HIS
PRESIDENCY IS THE CHAMPIONSHIP FOR WEEKEND TRAVEL SPENDING BY A
PRESIDENT. AND WHEN JONI ERNST WAS ASKED
ABOUT THAT TODAY, SHE SOUNDED LIKE A VERY POLITE DEMOCRAT.
>> WITH THE TRIPS TO FLORIDA, I DO WISH THAT HE WOULD SPEND MORE
TIME IN WASHINGTON, D.C. THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE THE WHITE
HOUSE FOR. WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE MORE OF
THOSE STATE DEPARTMENT VISITS IN WASHINGTON, D.C.
I THINK IT'S SMART THAT HE DOES BUSINESS IN WASHINGTON, D.C.
SO I HAVE HAD THOSE SAME CONCERNS MYSELF.
SO I AGREE. >> WHEN SHE WAS ASKED WHY DONALD
TRUMP AND HIS DAUGHTER STILL MANUFACTURE GOODS THAT THEY SELL
OVERSEAS, SHE SAID THIS. >> MAYBE HE PUTS HIS MONEY WHERE
HIS MOUTH IS AND BRINGS SOME OF THOSE JOBS HERE.
>> MAYBE. INDEFENSIBLE.
JONI ERNST WILL NOT DEFEND ANYTHING ABOUT DONALD TRUMP THE
PERSON. DONALD TRUMP THE BUSINESSMAN.
SHE SAID LAST MONTH THAT DONALD TRUMP SHOULD RELEASE HIS TAX
RETURNS. SHE SAID BASICALLY WHAT
ELIZABETH WARREN SAID ABOUT THAT TODAY.
>> HE PROMISED DURING THE CAMPAIGN THAT HE WOULD REVEAL
HIS TAXES. IN FACT, HOW MANY CLIPS HAVE YOU
GOT HERE? HE'D REVEAL THEM AFTER THIS.
HE'D REVEAL THEM AFTER THAT. OH, THEN HE'D PUT IT OFF.
>> DO YOU THINK HE EVER WILL? >> I DON'T KNOW, BUT I'LL TELL
YOU THIS. PEOPLE ARE GOING TO KEEP
DEMANDING IT AND MAKING THEIR VOICES HEARD ON THIS.
>> JONI ERNST IS ONE OF THE REPUBLICANS IN THE SENATE
DEMANDING THAT WHO WANTS DONALD TRUMP TO RELEASE HIS TAX
RETURNS. SENATE REPUBLICANS LIKE JONI
ERNST KNOW THAT PASSING THE BIG TAX CUT THEY WANT TO PASS IS
GOING TO BE MUCH MORE DIFFICULT WITH VOTERS WONDERING WHICH OF
THE TAX CUTS ARE A GOLD MINE FOR DONALD TRUMP AND HIS FAMILY.
AND ON POLICY, JONI ERNST COULD NOT HAVE DISAGREED MORE WITH
WHAT DONALD TRUMP HAD TO SAY TODAY IN WISCONSIN.
>> NAFTA HAS BEEN VERY, VERY BAD FOR OUR COUNTRY.
IT'S BEEN VERY, VERY BAD FOR OUR COMPANIES AND FOR OUR WORKERS.
AND WE'RE GOING TO MAKE SOME VERY BIG CHANGES OR WE ARE GOING
TO GET RID OF NAFTA FOR ONCE AND FOR ALL.
CANNOT CONTINUE LIKE THIS. BELIEVE ME.
>> JONI ERNST AND MOST PEOPLE IN IOWA WANT NAFTA TO CONTINUE
EXACTLY LIKE THIS. WHY?
IN IOWA, THE ANSWER IS ALWAYS CORN.
CORN IS KING. AND MEXICO LOVES IOWA CORN.
MEXICO IMPORTED 13.8 MILLION TONS OF AMERICAN CORN LAST YEAR.
AND MEXICO WAS PLANNING ON IMPORTING AT LEAST THAT MUCH,
MAYBE MORE THIS YEAR AND THEN DONALD TRUMP HAPPENED.
AND NOW MEXICO IS TRYING TO MAKE DEALS TO IMPORT ITS CORN FROM
ARGENTINA. AND OTHER COUNTRIES.
AGRICULTURAL OFFICIALS FROM ARGENTINA ARE VERY EXCITED ABOUT
THIS. THEY'VE BEEN HAVING MEETINGS
WITH MEXICAN GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS.
MEETINGS TO WHICH DONALD TRUMP IS COMPLETELY OBLIVIOUS.
THOSE MEETINGS ARE SCARING PEOPLE IN IOWA.
>> MY CONCERNS IS WITH NAFTA AND WHAT'S YOUR FEELINGS WITH THAT
AND HOW TO CONTINUE WITH THAT. >> FOR NAFTA, ACTUALLY, IOWA HAS
BENEFITED A LOT BECAUSE OF OUR COMMODITIES.ITIES.
PERHAPS WE COULD DO SOME TWEAKS AND RENEGOTIATION WITH NAFTA,
BUT WE CERTAINLY WANT TO PROTECT OUR IOWA INTERESTS AND MAKE SURE
THAT WE ARE EXPORTING THE COMMODITIES THAT WE ARE RAISING
ON OUR FARMS. >> TURNS OUT THERE'S SOMEONE
WORKING IN THE WHITE HOUSE WHO KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT JONI ERNST IS
TALKING ABOUT. >> AS THE NATION'S SIXTH LARGEST
CORN PRODUCER, INDIANA BENEFITED DIRECTLY UNDER THE NORTH
AMERICAN FREE TRADE AGREEMENT. UNDER NAFTA, MEXICO ELIMINATED
IMPORT LICENSING AND IS PHASING OUT TARIFFS FOR WHEAT
ALTOGETHER. WHEAT EXPORTS TO MEXICO HAVE
DOUBLED FROM INDIANA SINCE 1994. YOU CAN SEE THAT OUR EXISTING
TRADE AGREEMENTS HAVE TRULY BENEFITS INDIANA.
AND THE ENTIRE UNITED STATES. >> SO WHAT IS DONALD TRUMP GOING
TO DO ABOUT NAFTA? EXACTLY WHAT HE DID TO
OBAMACARE. NOTHING.
BECAUSE WHAT DONALD TRUMP WANTS TO DO TO NAFTA IS INDEFENSIBLE
IN IOWA AND CALIFORNIA AND ALL THE OTHER BIG AGRICULTURAL
STATES. NOTHING.
THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN ON NAFTA.
JOINING US NOW, PETER, SENIOR FELLOW AT THE ETHICS AND PUBLIC
POLICY CENTER. HE WORKED IN THE LAST THREE
REPUBLICAN ADMINISTRATIONS AND WAS A SENIOR AIDE TO PRESIDENT
GEORGE W. BUSH. ALSO JOSH BARROW, SENIOR EDITOR
FOR "BUSINESS INSIDER" AND AN MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR.
JOSH, JONI ERNST IN THAT TOWN HALL TODAY, WHENEVER THEY WERE
TALKING ABOUT DONALD TRUMP THE PERSON, NOT A SINGLE POSITIVE
THING TO SAY. AND IT WAS MORE THAN A STRUGGLE
TO FIND POLICY AGREEMENTS FOR HER WITH DONALD TRUMP,
ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU CONSIDER JUST HOW IMPORTANT NAFTA HAS
BEEN IN THE TRUMP WORLD OF PROMISES.
THAT WE HEARD HIM REMAKE TODAY. >> ON THE PERSONAL STUFF, I
DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY MORE REPUBLICANS DON'T TAKE THIS
STRATEGY. THEY GO DOWN THESE BLIND ALLEYS
DEFENDING HIS DECISIONS NOT TO RELEASE HIS TAX RETURNS.
I DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO DEFEND THAT.
PEOPLE DIDN'T VOTE FOR DONALD TRUMP BECAUSE THEY LOVE HE
DIDN'T RELEASE HIS TAX RETURNS. I UNDERSTAND WHY REPUBLICANS
DON'T WANT TO GO OUT AND ATTACK HIM VICIOUSLY BUT IT SEEMS EASY
ENOUGH TO SAY, I THINK HE SHOULD RELEASE HIS TAXES.
BUT I AGREE WITH HIM ON THIS AND ON THIS.
BUT IT ALSO REFLECTS SHE'S HAD A LONGSTANDING PRACTICE OF KEEPING
THE PRESIDENT AT ARM'S LENGTH. SHE WITHDREW HERSELF FROM
CONSIDERATION AS A RUNNING MATE. >> SHE WAS ONE OF THE PEOPLE WHO
SAID NO THANK YOU. >> SHE WAS THE ONLY WOMAN ON
THAT LIST. SO I THINK SHE HAS REALIZED
THAT, YOU KNOW, TRUMP DID WELL IN IOWA.
BUT SHE'S ABLE TO KEEP HIM AT ARM'S LENGTH.
ON TRADE, THERE'S THE SPLIT IN THE MIDWEST.
TRUMP DID WELL IN THE MIDWEST, BUT THE MIDWEST BREAKS DOWN INTO
TWO ECONOMIC REGIONS. THE RUST BELT WHERE THE TRADE
HAS HURT LABOR MARKET. PLACES LIKE IN MICHIGAN.
BUT IN IOWA, IT'S REALLY CLEAR THAT TRADE HAS BEEN GOOD FOR
THEM. ALSO UNEMPLOYMENT IS LOW IN
THOSE AREAS. IT'S NOT AS MUCH OF A CONCERN AS
TO WHETHER JOBS ARE BEING SHIPPED OVERSEAS.
>> PETER, ON THE TRUMP TAX RETURNS, WE'VE SEEN REPUBLICANS
IN TOWN HALLS WHERE THEY TRY TO SAY SOMETHING DEFENSIVE ABOUT
IT. WE SAW TOM COTTON SAYING TO HIS
AUDIENCE THE OTHER DAY. WELL, I UNDERSTAND THEY'RE UNDER
AUDIT. EVERY PRESIDENT WHO HAS
SUBMITTED -- WHO MADE HIS TAX RETURNS PUBLIC HAS BEEN UNDER
AUDIT BECAUSE IT'S AN AUTOMATIC IRS POLICY TO AUDIT THE
PRESIDENT'S TAX RETURNS. YOU SEE TOM COTTON GET BOOED
WHEN HE DOES THAT. WHAT I HAVE NOT SEEN IS WHENEVER
A REPUBLICAN SAYS, YEAH, HE SHOULD RELEASE HIS TAX RETURNS.
I'VE NEVER HEARD ANY BOOS OR THE POINT JOSH WAS JUST TAKEN.
OOUF NEVER HEARD ANY REPUBLICANS BOO IN PROTECTION OF HIDING
DONALD TRUMP'S TAX RETURNS. >> I THINK THAT'S RIGHT.
I THINK THAT JONI ERNST IS A PREVIEW OF COMING ATTRACTIONS.
YOU'LL SEE MORE AND MORE REPUBLICANS TAKING HER POSTURE.
AND, OVER TIME, AS TRUMP'S FAILURES MOUNT UP AND HIS
SUCCESSES DIMINISH, THEY ARE GOING TO CREATE MORE AND MORE
DISTANCE FROM HIM. I SAW TOM COTTON WITH THAT TOWN
HALL, AND HE LOOKED SILLY TRYING TO DEFEND WHAT HE KNEW WAS
INDEFENSIBLE. SO REPUBLICANS ARE IN A BOX.
THEY'RE ALSO GOING TO FIND OUT THAT IT'S GOING TO BE IN THEIR
SELF-INTEREST TO DISTANCE THEMSELVES FROM HIM.
HE'S AN UNPRECEDENTEDLY UNPOPULAR INTEREST.
WE'VE GOT THESE TOWN HALLS WHERE THE CROWDS ARE REALLY JUICED UP
AND JACKED UP AGAINST THE REPUBLICANS.
YOU'VE GOT THIS RACE IN THE GEORGIA SIXTH A COUPLE OF WEEKS
AGO WITH MIKE POMPEO'S SEAT IN KANSAS, MUCH CLOSER THAN IT
SHOULD HAVE BEEN. THIS IS AN ADMINISTRATION THAT
IS IN TROUBLE AND THE REPUBLICAN PARTY IS IN TROUBLE.
I THINK THE IMPORTANT THING TO BEAR IN MIND IS THIS IS IN
TROUBLE IN THE FIRST 90 DAYS OF HIS PRESIDENCY.
THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE THE APEX OF POPULARITY.
SO THIS IS -- THIS IS A LOT OF TROUBLE EARLY ON.
>> FIRST PRESIDENT IN MODERN HISTORY TO HAVE FAILED ON HIS
FIRST BIG LEGISLATIVE EFFORT WHICH WAS THE OBAMACARE REPEAL
AND REPLACE. >> THAT'S RIGHT.
>> LET'S LISTEN TO WHAT HE SAID ABOUT THAT TODAY.
>> I THINK WE ARE GOING TO HAVE A BIG WIN SOON BECAUSE WE'RE
GOING TO HAVE HEALTH CARE, AND I BELIEVE THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
AND, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS NO LIKE LOSS WITH HEALTH CARE.
THIS IS JUST A CONSTANT NEGOTIATION.
AND THE MAN IS GETTING BETTER AND BETTER ALL THE TIME.
WE'RE GOING TO HAVE SOME GREAT LEGISLATIVE VICTORIES IN THE
VERY NEAR FUTURE. ONE OF THEM IS GOING TO BE
HEALTH CARE. THE OTHER ONE IS GOING TO BE TAX
REFORM. >> JOSH, HEALTH CARE IS NEVER
COMING BACK. THIS IS JUST TALK, OBVIOUSLY.
I NEVER WANT TO WASTE LIMITED TIME WE HAVE ON IT.
NAFTA, MUCH MORE SERIOUS PROBLEM BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT GOING TO DO
ANYTHING ON IT. THE ONLY THING MORE COMPLEX
LEGISLATIVELY THAN HEALTH CARE IS TRADE, INTERNATIONAL TRADE.
TO REOPEN A NAFTA NEGOTIATION IS SOMETHING THAT THIS CONGRESS IS
TOTALLY INCAPABLE OF DOING. TAKES YEARS TO DO AND HAS A
COMPLEXITY LEVEL THAT NOBODY THERE CAN HANDLE.
SO THAT'S GOING TO BE A ZERO. AND THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE A TAX
CUT PLAN AVAILABLE TO EVEN LOOK AT YET.
>> AND BEFORE ANY OF THIS, THE NEXT THING THAT HAS TO COME ON
THE LEGISLATIVE CALENDAR IS A BILL TO KEEP THE GOVERNMENT
OPEN. A GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN IF THEY
DON'T PASS A BILL BY APRIL 28th TO DO THAT.
THE NATIONAL INSTITUTES OF HEALTH TO PAY FOR A WALL,
MILITARY EXPANSION. AND PEOPLE IN CONGRESS HAVE BEEN
IGNORING THIS DOCUMENT. THE SPENDING BILL HAS TO GET 60
VOTES WHICH MEANS ANY INCREASE IN MILITARY SPENDING HAS TO COME
WITH INCREES IN DOMESTIC SPENDING, NOT CUTS.
THE BILL WILL BE A TOTAL DEFEAT FOR THE PRESIDENT ON POLICY
ASSUMING PAUL RYAN IS ABLE TO GET ANYTHING OUT OF THE HOUSE OF
REPS. I THINK COMING OFF THE HEALTH
CARE FIGHT, HE THE WHITE HOUSE IS NOT EAGER TO CAUSE A
GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN. THE NEXT BIG LEGISLATIVE EVENT
WILL BE A DEFEAT FOR TRUMP. >> AND, PETE, WE HAD THE
TREASURY SECRETARY THIS WEEK PUBLICLY ADMITTING THERE'S NO
CHANCE TO GET TO A TAX BILL BEFORE LABOR DAY.
AND SO WE -- WE MAY GET THROUGH A FIRST YEAR OF ZERO LEGISLATIVE
ACHIEVEMENTS IN THE TRUMP WHITE HOUSE.
>> YEAH, AND THAT UNDERSCORES WHAT I THINK IS THE MOST SERIOUS
PROBLEM WITH THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION SO FAR WHICH IS
IT IS JUST STUNNINGLY INEPT AND INCOMPETENT.
WE'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS.
THESE GUYS CAN'T GOVERN THEIR WAY OUT OF A PAPER BAG.
WE'VE GONE FROM REALITY TELEVISION TO REALITY.
JUMP GOT AWAY WITH A LOT OF PROMISES AND WORDS DURING THE
CAMPAIGN. IN THE END, WHEN YOU'RE
PRESIDENT, YOU CAN'T DO THAT. IN THE END, REALITY MATTERS.
YOU CAN TRY AND OUTRUN IT FOR A WHILE, BUT SOONER OR LATER, IT
CATCHES UP TO YOU. AND REALITY IS CATCHING UP TO
DONALD TRUMP AND IT WILL CATCH UP TO THE REPUBLICANS AS WELL.
THEY ARE IN A REAL JAM. AND THEY HAVE NO IDEA, I DON'T
THINK, HOW TO GET OUT OF THIS. AS YOU SAID, MARQUEE LEGISLATION
WAS A BELLYFLOP. AND TAX REFORM IS TOUGHER THAN
REPEALING OBAMACARE AND REPLACING IT.
>> JOSH BARROW, PETER WEHNER. YOU TRIED TO WARN YOUR FELLOW
REPUBLICANS ABOUT THIS DURING THE CAMPAIGN.
YOU TRIED TO DESCRIBE