good afternoon welcome to C CK live my
name is Brad Hennings we're here with
Anna Peterson and Christine Clements and
we're here at Chisholm Chisholm and
Kilpatrick in Providence Rhode Island
we're going to be talking about
permanent and total disability today
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alright so today we're going to be
talking about permanent and total
disability otherwise known as P and T
and this is widely known in the veterans
community as desirable thing to have
added to your award and what we're
talking about is the VA disability
compensation program not VA pension most
often you hear about it in the context
of you have total disability due to
individual unemployability benefits and
you want them to clear permanent total
or PMT by the VA so let's let's get
going and talk a little bit about this
so what is permanent and total
disability so they are sort of two
concepts on their own total disability
is what it sounds like it means that
you're a hundred percent disabled
whether that be through a combination of
disabilities you have service-connected
that combined together to a hundred
percent or you have been found to be
unable to work you have a TDI you
benefit from VA so you're totally
disabled permanent means that VA has
decided that it's reasonably certain
that your disability is not going to get
any better
it's not going to be any improvement for
the rest of your life and they use
medical evidence to come to that
conclusion
so together it's a super important
finding that you are only only
permanently but a hundred percent
totally disabled can be a great addition
tip for a veteran to have it means that
you're going to keep that hundred
percent rating and VA is not going to
change it in the future okay so are
there any disabilities that are
automatically that automatically
received permanent and totally sure so
some disabilities like an e reverse
loss of use either due to paralysis or
amputation of both hands both feet one
hand and one foot side of both eyes are
becoming permanently helpless in
bedridden those are things that would
automatically receive permanent in total
there are some other conditions as well
and then some conditions might be less
likely to be deemed permanent in total
you know we often see first of all
temporary disability ratings so
temporary hundred percent rating based
on hospitalization due to a convalescent
period after surgery there are certain
ratings as well that might get a hundred
percent rating for a year after for
example a hip replacement and knee
replacement but that hundred percent
rating is not a permanent rating
necessarily other other things that we
often see certain cancers the cancer
when it's active is rated at a hundred
percent and after a period of remission
it is the VA will reassess the condition
and assign a rating based on the
symptoms at the time also mental health
conditions a lot of times are not rated
permanently and the idea behind that is
that these are conditions that can
improve over time so let me before we go
any further into the topic let me just
say that this can be a complicated issue
or set of issues and although a veteran
or claimant or their relatives may think
that the quad should qualify for
permanent in total it's ultimately an
adjudicatory determination by the VA
meaning a decision that the VA makes and
so if you're going to go for permanent
or think you should be permanent total
please reach out to someone who's
knowledgeable in the area be it a
veteran service organization like our
colleagues at the disabled american
veterans DAV or
accredited attorney or VA accredited
agent so with that so how do I know if
my disability rating is permanent and
what do I do
if it isn't permanent but I think it
should be sure so a couple ways to
figure out if VA has decided your
permanent in total you can look in the
rating decision you receive they might
come out and say it
they might say it in that cover letter
that comes with the decision saying you
know we found you to be permanent in
total sometimes but not always
our veterans will receive the code sheet
which actually has a list of all the
disabilities they have service-connected
and it might be listed in there or
there's some a couple other things that
might signal you've been found be
permanent in total they might assign you
that 100 percent rating and say no
future exam that's a good indication
that they've found to be permanent in
total if they award certain benefits
like chant VA benefits which is
healthcare for dependence VA health care
for dependence chapter 35 dependent
education assistant program if you see
chapter 35 DEA awarded to you in a
decision that's a good indication so
those are some things some clues you can
look for in the documents you received
from VA if you haven't been found to be
permanent in total and you like the
benefit you certainly can ask for that
but my recommendation would be to talk
with your accredited agent your via so
your attorney whoever you work with
about what types of medical evidence you
might already have in your file or what
you need to get to show VA that your
disability is permanent in total because
they are gonna look for some type of
medical evidence to make that decision
so is that something there's a VA form
for because the VA is become obsessed to
use to confer benefits or is it just
something you ask being to do to my
knowledge there's no form for that this
is something you're gonna have to ask VA
for they should be granting it if if you
deserve it
you know if it's raised by the record
and it's in there that's something that
they should they should be giving to you
but sometimes you might have to push for
it and the way that you might push for
it might include the use of some form
but there is no as mo site specific form
for this right so we have a question for
Glendon and the question is if you are
totally disabled by the Social Security
Administration SSA are you entitled to
VA disability not automatically so SSA
determinations are not binding on VA the
information that they use is certainly
persuasive and it's good evidence I and
you know I certainly think it can be
very helpful but VA is an entirely
different administration they have
different rules for awarding benefit and
that's sort of you know getting into a
lot a whole other conversation but
certainly check out our website with a
series of Facebook lives and a lot of
blog postings about how you get VA
disability and how you get service
connection but unfortunately no there's
there's sort of no automatic cross
between SSA and VA and the other thing I
would say is that it depends on the
conditions that renders somebody totally
disabled so the Social Security
Administration is looking at total
disability the VA for the purposes of
what we're talking about today for
compensation benefits is looking at
service-connected disability and so they
might be the same they might overlap but
they might be different and I think what
Mo was suggesting is where the
conditions do overlap they are the same
the standards are still different so
that's something to keep in mind
absolutely
so basically what I hear both of you
saying is it's the classic lawyerly
answer that's right right it absolutely
depends on the circumstances so if you
qualify for TDI you or total disability
due to individual unemployability does
that mean that your rating is
automatically permanent total not
necessarily tdiu is a total disability
rating so it means that you meet one of
the criteria that you're totally
disabled it doesn't necessarily meet the
permanent criteria okay so what are the
advantages of having a permanent and
total rating are there additional
benefits that veterans are that are
available for veterans absolutely so
first are sort of local and state
benefits that might be available to you
and certainly recommend you reach out to
different agencies in your state to find
out what those might be but then there's
also like we mentioned
for benefits for your dependents with
educational assistance and healthcare
coverage which is huge
due to the you know exponentially
increasing costs or both of those things
and finally there's a benefit to your
spouse or dependents and the unfortunate
event that you pass away they be
entitled to dependency and indemnity
compensation going forward automatically
if you've been permanent in total for at
least ten years prior to your death
without having to prove that you passed
away due to a service-connected
disability if it's less than ten years
though they do need to file for a
service connection for cause of death
but that's that's an amazing benefit for
like I said o spouse or dependent if you
were unfortunately passed away they get
a monthly benefit going forward I would
say one other benefit that's not a
technical benefit but one thing that we
often hear from our clients is that
there there's the benefit of peace of
mind that they're not going to be
scheduled for additional exams that they
may have difficulty getting to or
remembering when the day is and so that
I think is also pretty huge right so
again this is Brad Hemmings joined by
Christine Clements and Emma Pearson here
at Chisholm Chisholm and Kilpatrick C CK
live please reach out to us either on
Facebook or at our website at C CK
live.com so with that so even without a
permanent and total rating some veterans
may have more protection from a VA
rating reductions so how does this work
so there are ratings that can become
stabilized so if you've been rated at a
certain level for five or more years and
you're you're at or above that rating
for five or more years
VA has to overcome some higher burdens
to then reduce you so they can't just
use one examination one new the
examination to show that you've improved
and then reduce your rating
they have to show through medical
records that you're not just temporarily
experiencing a minor improvement and
they have to show the evidence in your
file predominantly demonstrate sustained
improvement so that's it's hard burden
to me and it is a burden that's on the
VA correct not on you the veteran to
show this they have to overcome that
hurdle before they can actually reduce
you now that doesn't mean they won't do
it anyways it doesn't mean that you
should you know just go with it if you
certainly think that it's it's not
warranted you absolutely can file a
notice of disagreement with that
reduction if it happens but then there's
another even greater benefit is that if
you've been continuously rated at or
about above a certain level for 20 or
more years then that is going to be
essentially permanent for lack of a
better way to say it but he is gonna
have to show that the rating to reduce
you they're gonna have to show the
original rating was based on fraud or
some sort of high standard like that so
what about protections for veterans with
total ratings that haven't been deemed
permanent and I'm are there some other
tips that you can add into this area
yeah so um you know it's sort of similar
to what Emma talked about the standard
for that the VA has this burden of
showing sustained improvement with total
ratings the VA has to show material
improvement and what that means is that
there's some sort of observable change
in the veterans ability to function
under conditions of daily life so the
the view would have to show that you
know this is really this condition has
improved in a way that is observable
right so that's the first thing that
people can see the change the
improvement and in these conditions of
daily life so if somebody is still
impaired in being able to to work to
cook to leave the house to go to the
grocery store it's gonna be very hard
for VA to meet that legal standard that
they're required to mhm so let's talk a
little bit about what
kinds of things you want to do as a
veteran if VA is proposing a reduction
what are those some of the examples of
kinds of evidence or things you'd want
to show the VA so they wouldn't reduce
you so there are a couple of things and
first just sort of from a procedural
standpoint as the veteran would want to
respond to that that notice that the VA
sends to them the veteran responds
within 30 days requesting a hearing it
will stay and what that means in kind of
English is that it will prevent the VA
from being able to take the action of
reducing the veteran before granting
them a hearing the other thing is that
the veteran wants to respond to that
with evidence that supports even though
the VA has the burden has the obligation
the veteran would want to inform the VA
that this condition hasn't improved that
the impairment is the same or has
oftentimes has gotten worse in ways that
might not be evident from a medical exam
lay statements statements from family
members spouses friends those are all
helpful in developing the record
statements from doctors and say this
condition hasn't improved any
maybe the veteran had a good day and had
a good exam that one day that moment in
time but this isn't reflective of what
the veterans experiencing on a daily
basis and the types of impairment that
the veteran would have in any sort of
employment capacity I think a good sort
of real-life example that we see a lot
of times are with the orthopedic
conditions because the testing VA does
for those conditions is based on range
of motion you know how far can you move
your leg and knee and things like that
so in a controlled you know clinical
environment with an examiner you know
measuring your range of motion maybe you
can you know move it up and down but in
your day to day life you can't you know
walk down the end of your driveway to
get your mail so it's so it's too
painful you need to have someone come
into your house to help you cook and
clean that's the reality of your dating
life and so that's what we mean when we
say under the conditions of ordinary
life so if you have that hasn't improved
then VA should not be reducing you so I
think again lay evidence explaining that
is very helpful it's not you know again
the veterans burden to prove that but it
can't hurt to get that evidence in there
so let me use this opportunity to again
this can be complicated so please if you
if you have a resource veteran's service
organization like DAV VA credit an
attorney of a credit agent someone that
you can consult with if the VA proposes
to reduce something like this I think it
would be incredibly helpful to talk to
them and work through what they think
would be helpful for you on your
individual case with that we've gone
through the the basics of permanent
total we talked a little bit about
rating reductions are there any other
points that either of you would like to
add and any final words thoughts
Christine oh I don't know if I have any
final words or thoughts I mean I think
you know Brad I think you said it best
this is really complicated stuff and
there are benefits to being permanent in
total it doesn't apply to everybody but
if you have the question it's important
to ask and to get the right information
and that's why reaching out to an
accredited representative is so
important the other thing I would say is
that it's not uncommon for somebody to
file an increased rating claim and for
the VA and this is just kind of on exams
to say well maybe we think your
condition has improved and the veteran
doesn't have to accept that statement
that the VA thinks the condition has
improved or take it at face value so
even though again we've talked about the
VA does have the burden there are
strategies for for veterans and and
accredited representatives are in a good
place to talk to them about what the
best strategy would be and I would just
going off that same thing if you think
you do deserve this benefit certainly
get with someone and figure out how to
ask for it if he hasn't awarded it to
you because there are a lot of host of
other really great benefits
come along with being rated permanent in
total so don't be afraid to seek out
help and discuss if that's gonna be a
good option for you to go ahead and ask
VA for it
and that raises another really good
point a lot of times veterans think
they're already permanent Antonio and
they're actually not so that's something
to again talk to your representative
talk to VA and ask them hey have you
officially declared me if it's not so
obvious from the paperwork that the VA
is provided and as I said don't feel shy
about saying this isn't getting any any
better and it's severely impacting my
life so with that again thank you all
for joining us this afternoon at C CK
live again my name is Brad Hennings for
Christine Clemens and the Pearson we're
here at Chisholm Chisholm and Kilpatrick
if you have any additional thoughts or
questions please reach out to us on
facebook at our facebook page in the
comment section or reach out to us on
our website at C CK law comm and with
that thank you so much for joining us
you