Good Morning ladies and gentlemen, you join us here outside the Ministry of Defence in
a cold, rather blustery London.
We're standing in front of the statue of Lord Portal of Hungerford, who was Chief of the
Air Staff during the Second World War.
More importantly for our course, he was a Squadron Commander and a pilot of RE8s, earning
two Military Crosses and a Distinguished Service Order as he went through the war.
So, when it came to formulating a doctrine, policy and so forth in the interwar years,
they were able to rely on people of real operational experience.
I'm joined this morning by Dr James Pugh who has recently finished his PhD with us at Birmingham
and you'll have met him on some of the messageboards and the forums during the course of the last
week.
What are you doing here in London James?
Well, outside of having a discussion with you Peter, I'm off to the National Archives
in Kew today.
The goal of that research I'm looking at RAF Bomber Command during the Second World War
and having a look at issues relating to aviation, medicine and fatigue.
It's always a fascinating experience to get down into the archives and do the bread and
butter stuff of what historians do.
OK.
That sounds really good.
What are the main themes that have been coming up in the posts on the forums?
It's been a very very busy week so far on the forums.
I suspect the first question that comes up is when course participants are confronted
with you reading Tennyson and they've signed up for an aviation course, they think what's
going on here?
Could you offer us anything on why do we begin with poetry?
With Tennyson?
Yeah.
Well it's certainly not because I'm an English student or anything else.
But one of the themes that we've introduced this week has been the fear and the fascination.
Part of the fascination stems in my mind from this idea that aviation's only ten years old
by the beginning of the first world War, but there's the beginning of this huge understanding,
fascination, that goes far beyond the tiny amounts of technology.
And Tennyson, HG Wells and many of the bits that have been brought up as we've been through
the week all stem from the... where did this all come from?
And part of it is from sources like Tennyson so I thought it worth exploring this as an
area, where were people getting their inspiration from?
I think that's really really interesting, but if I could just add a couple of points
on that.
I think in the discussions I had it's been relating to the value of exploring poetry.
I think it's about the culture and atmosphere of that time as you've alluded to.
It's the environment in which a lot of these young aviators - if they're not the pioneers
they're the aviators that fly aircraft during the First World War - they're brought up in
this stuff, they're taught it in school and it's just embedded in their psyche almost.
Yes, that's absolutely right.
And if I could make a very small recommendation on the reading list is a text by Michael Paris
called 'Winged Warfare' which certainly looks and explores that - the value of predictive
fiction prior to and during the First World War.
So worth exploring that if you have the time.
It's one of those things that the aviation bit just does not occur in a bubble.
It's in a wider military sense.
It's in a wider societal sense.
And these are things just to think about both as you go through this course and actually
looking to wider military history.
It happens in a big context.
I think another point and again linking to the wider context, is we have a discussion
point relating to lions led by donkeys, a particular perspective on generalship during
the First World War.
And the question comes again, we're doing an aviation MOOC, why are we talking about
this?
I think the first point to make on that is it's again the wider context.
It wasn't the Royal Air Force until 1918, the Royal Flying Corps as you all know was
an integral part of the British Army and they were effectively being led by the same generals.
More importantly from the historian's point of view, one of the things that we have to
look at are the myths that have grown up over the years and these myths come for a reason.
There's been a narrative which has been constructed.
As historians part of our job is to deconstruct this narrative and to try and find out what
the real story was and more importantly in some cases, why this story has grown up.
Part of that story was that aviation had been poohoo'd.
Classic Blackadder type quotation from a Blackadder type background.
So one of the things that we look at in that is where did this come from?
Is it real?
Is it part of the same phenomenon?
And the phenomenon of lions led by donkeys and the historical debate which still goes
on, were they lions?
Were they donkeys?
Or was there a real story of leadership and progression?
And I tend to think that the leadership of the Royal Flying Corps was not without criticisms
over the First World War and beyond into the years of the Royal Air Force, can only be
really studied and understood in the context of this generalship and the lions led by donkeys
debate.
And I think that's a fantastic point Peter and I think that a lot of the comments come
up have been based around these sort of, they're are myths in popular consciousness relating
to the First World War that individuals such as Sir Douglas Haig who commands the BEF from
1915 onwards and Sir John French who he supercedes, they're individuals that are old-fashioned,
they are luddites, they don't understand technology, for them it's all about getting the horses
and breaking through the lines.
And when you get into the archival record and you look at the archival papers of Sir
John French or Haig, you actually find from a very very early point, prior to the First
World War, they have a good understanding of what air power can deliver and a very very
supportive of the efforts of the Royal Flying Corps.
That's absolutely right and you don't have to go into the archives, you only have to
look at the official histories to see the value of reconnaissance, the value of what's
been going on both in the army manouevres leading up to the First World War and in the
early weeks and days of the First World War itself.
And this ability not just to see over the first hill but to see more generally across
the whole battlefield is worth its weight in gold.
All of the army records, all of the army field service regulations, aren't talking about
cavalry cavalry cavalry, they're talking about the interaction between cavalry and the new
arm - aircraft.
And how they can be best used to greatest advantage.
You've done a lot of this work in terms of your phd.
Yeah, I think in terms and I've mentioned this on the comments board a few times, but
a thing that we really need to acknowledge, and it's not widely acknowledged in history,
is a chap called Sir David Henderson.
David Henderson is the first commander of the Royal Flying Corps during the First World
War.
He takes the Royal Flying Corps through until about the middle of 1915.
He's also the Director General of Military Aeronatics and one of the really really important
about David Henderson is that at a very young age he understands the - young age in terms
of military career I should say - he understands the importance of air power.
And he understands that senior commanders within the British Army might be a bit sceptical
about this because it does threaten their understanding of warfare and that's never
really a very nice place to be faced with.
Change is a very difficult process to manage - for individuals and organisations.
And David Henderson's role is selling air power to senior commanders in the British
Army.
Absolutely.
Doing it in a language that they understand.
He's not scaring them.
He's saying this is a fantastic thing.
This can support your cavalry on the ground.
This can support your armour later in the war.
He plays an absolutely fundamental role in the creation of the Royal Flying Corps and
its integration into the British Army.
That's really interesting.
We frequently refer to Trenchard as the father of the Royal Air Force.
I think it's constructive to call David Henderson the father of the Royal Flying Corps.
Whatever points have we had over the week?
One really interesting point perhaps reflecting contemporary opinions about government is
that governments at the time prior to the First World War were really very slow in grasping
the significance of air power and I wondered if you had any thoughts on that?
I think the military generally and the government ... slow to react?
I think that's probably a bit harsh.
We're in an ideal position.
Sitting outside the Ministry of Defence.
I've worked long enough in those hallowed halls to know that things do grind on at a
fairly slow pace.
But I think in terms of grasping aviation it's another one of those myths that have
grown up that they were desperately slow and desperately conservative.
When you look at the actual investment that went into the aeroplanes, into the people,
I think that they're actually quite forward looking and it's a bit story than comes out
of the myths.
No, I think that's fair.
They certainly do take their time.
As do all organisations of that size.
But I think more importantly, they're taking their time because this is completely unprecedented.
There is no knowledge about this.
They are building I think the historian Eric Ashe says 'they're building without bricks'.
They literally have no knowledge on which to base this, it's all very speculative.
So any investment that they make is quite a progressive decision at that point.
That's absolutely right James and I think we also, I come back to the classic Sir Michael
Howard advice of studying things in depth, in breadth and in particular in context.
What we have to bear in mind, the context of the time was that the British Army was
not prepared, was not wanting to go to war in an expeditionary style.
So, the whole thing was moving at a fairly slow pace because it was contrary to what
they were set up to do.
This wasn't imperial policing, this was major scale, leading to total, war.
They are bound to be slow in coming to terms with that.
I think just to add another point on that as well.
If you look at spending regards defence prior to the First World War, even the Royal Navy,
the premier service in Britain, the service that literally is keeping Britain's arterial
lifelines open around the Empire and keeping the home nations safe, they are struggling
to get enough money to buy enough dreadnoughts.
They don't feel they have enough if you look at the naval estimates, I don't recall, it's
prior to the First World War, Winston Churchill as First Lord of the Admiralty, has an incredible
difficult time in terms of securing enough budget for the needs of that service as a
whole.
Yes, pretty much as we are today.
Your defence is always quite low down in the priorities until you actually start the war.
Preparing for the war is a different matter.
So I think you'll agree we've had a really interesting week for the first week of this
MOOC.
We've got another two weeks to go.
What's coming up next week James?
We are exploring the First World War in more depth.
So this week again as you've said before is context.
We've set the context but actually looking at air power in the context of the First World
War.
And we'll explore how I think in your terms the white heat of that conflict, how that
affects the development of aviation between 1914 and 1918.
We'll also conclude which I think is for discussions with participants on the board is something
everyone's really looking forward to getting their teeth into, is where on earth the Royal
Air Force comes from.
And that will be a really crucial part of next week.
There's some interesting parts of that.
There are various myths, there are various tales, there are various legends about it.
And the continuing theme of the fear and the fascination of flight will continue next week.
But we'll also look at some of these myths and we'll see whether they stand the test
of time.
Whether they'll hold water.
Or whether they've just arisen for different reasons.
Look forward to seeing you all next week and we'll look forward to catching up wlth you
at the end of the week.
Thank you.
Thanks