now to the ongoing trump organization
criminal probe and new details from the
indictment the washington post reporting
that internal spreadsheets kept by the
trump organization that tallied the
hidden payments provided a road map for
prosecutors prosecutors treating these
spreadsheets as quote the accounting
equivalent of a confession
and like his kids trump himself can't
keep his mouth shut at a rally in
florida he admits the crime in public
and downplays the criminal charges
they go after good hard-working people
for not paying taxes on a company car
company
you didn't pay tax on the car
or a company apartment you used an
apartment because you need an apartment
because you have to travel too far where
your house says
you didn't pay tax or education for your
grandchildren
i don't even know
do you have to but does anybody know the
answer to that stuff
okay
but they indict people for that
this is my confession does anyone even
know the answer to that yes i do
off-the-book schemes are illegal now
where this case goes next is anyone's
guess prosecutors are still pressuring
indicted cfo allen weisselberg to start
talking and now mary trump is out with a
stunning claim about who might flip
first
there will be other people
who might be more willing to flip than
alan and i think among those might well
indeed be my cousins oh
interesting
like the trump kids
ivanka also received i i don't remember
the amount yeah
right consulting fees that's not a thing
you're either an employee or you're not
an employee
so i think we're going to find a lot
more of that kind of thing
going on and uh she's much less likely
to stay loyal than ellen weisselberg
joining me now for our opening argument
series is former acting u.s solicitor
general neal katyal
neil i i have to start with this
this idea that ivanka could be the first
or most likely member of the trump
family to flip amazes me and i want to
show you some footage here of what we
think that conversation might be like
and get your thoughts on the other side
he's our dad but he was going to send me
to jail he'd do the same to all of us
chef are you okay are you part of this
family or not if i back you against
death
you would need to let me take over whoa
nelly
i like succession and the new trailer
just dropped but but basically i i can
imagine this is the conversation within
the family right now right i mean if if
some of if some of donald trump's
children are thinking
i could flip on my dad or at least i
could slip some information that might
cut me a better deal do you think that
is likely and if so what are the kinds
of things that they would have to offer
that would potentially get their father
in trouble the former disgraced two-time
impeach president but not also put them
in the hot seat
so jason i first just have to say thank
you for that segment you just did with
joy it's an extraordinary thing
conversation you had on an extraordinary
day for howard and i think you just
captured it enjoyed it so well and i
can't thank you enough for that now with
respect to ivanka
um look i mean i guess i'm in the two
minds of this first donald trump raised
his kids to put themselves first and so
we might see ivanka reminding him
reminding trump of his own favorite
advice you know it's nothing personal
it's just business so that's one side of
it the other is you know there are
really serious allegations here you
heard donald trump like say in his you
know
his uh whatever rally thing on saturday
oh everyone does it and so on you know
which you know do people not pay taxes
on fringe benefits yeah sure sometimes
does the cfo of a company uh no and
while keeping two separate sets of books
no way and like the most important piece
of writing since this indictment came
down if any if you're if our listeners
are going to look at one thing it's this
piece that dan shabaira wrote in just
security dan shaviro is like a nyu law
professor he's no ideologue and he's
read the indictment and what he says is
look this is not a fringe benefits case
that's what donald trump wants to
portray it as it's fraud plain and
simple he says you know it's two sets of
books anyone who does this he says would
be indicted at both the state and the
federal level so it's not surprising you
see trump going on with the rally and so
on you know for him it's kind of like
we're at the election night stage of the
investigation he's taking a victory lap
for the same reason he did on november
4th because he knows the next results
are not going to be so kind to him and
that's with or without ivanka and
weisselberg and all the others so
just for for the laymen out there
if your organization is keeping two sets
of books right
the only reason you would be doing that
is because you are either not paying
taxes or you're using the money in some
way that you haven't publicly stated
that makes sense to me that makes sense
to anybody who's seen three episodes of
law and order what confuses me is how
could the trump organization be either
so stupid or so lazy as to have that
information somewhere where it can be
found is that something that we often
see in criminal organizations neil where
you know somebody just keeps them on a
spreadsheet in excel or was this a
result of a very serious investigation
or somebody on the inside flipping
jason jason are you really confused i
mean really i mean donald trump it
thinks he's above the law so like the
insouciance that he has and you know is
you know he's not as smart as a mafia he
runs the thing like you know they've run
the thing like a mafia organized crime
organization except for the confidence
that they have it's disrespectful to the
mob basically so it's not surprising
that you see two sets of books like this
and all the other shenanigans and i
think the hard thing now is we now we've
seen the state move against the trump
organization and against alan
weisselberg and cfo the question i have
and it's teed up nicely by the dan
chavira article is what is the u.s
justice department and the irs gonna do
because shaviro says look if this any
other time
whenever this happens at the federal
level we prosecute so i want to make
sure that trump gets the same rulebook
not a harsher rulebook i just want him
to get the same rule book as every other
american and the idea that oh it's only
a million dollars and that's nothing to
the trumps and weisselbergs of the world
well it sure is to every american and so
you know i think uh i think this has got
to be looked at by the justice
department
[Music]
you