- Hey it's Justin Brown here from Primal Video.
This video is gonna be a little bit different.
We've had a heap of questions come in from people
asking about the different kinds of software
and systems that we use to run Primal Video.
We also have a lot of questions come in
specifically about what email service we use.
A lot of you even noticed that we've
recently moved from AWeber to ConvertKit.
And have been asking why.
Well given the majority of you in the Primal Video
community are entrepreneurs, we thought we'd do
this video to explain why we've moved
and maybe it'll help you decide which email
service is right for you.
(upbeat music)
Email really is king and it's a great way
for you to communicate with your loyal followers
and subscribers without the noise of social media.
If you're not currently growing a list,
then you definitely should be.
To do this, you're going to need an email service
like AWeber, MailChimp, Infusionsoft, or ConvertKit.
Now there's a ton of options out there and each
have its own advantages and disadvantages,
and what works best for you will really depend
on your workflow and what you're looking to achieve.
For us, that's convert kit.
And here's the main reasons why we've recently
moved from AWeber to ConvertKit.
First up is deliverability and that's absolutely critical.
Being able to send a message and know that
it's actually going to hit your subscriber's inbox
where they'll see it and not get lost in spam.
Now we don't have a massive list by any means,
but we did notice a decline in deliverability
with AWeber over time.
Now I'm not sure what changed on AWeber's end over time,
but just switching to ConvertKit we saw a huge
spike in our open rates.
More people were seeing our email messages,
so they were opening them, nothing else changed.
And for us that's huge.
Of course your experience may be different
and it's not to say that AWeber haven't or won't improve,
it could just be something temporary or limited
to a few customers like us.
But I've since worked with a number of partners
in the online community who have made
this same switch from AWeber after having
the exact same issues.
And they also noticed the exact same results.
Now some of these partners had mailing lists
tracking over 100,000, so an increase in a few
percent in opens really starts to impact at that scale.
So now let's look at list management and interface.
And this one really comes down to personal preference
and how you manage your list.
Both AWeber and ConvertKit have two very
different models for list management and pricing.
For us, ConvertKit makes a lot more sense.
The key difference is AWeber is list centric
and ConvertKit is subscriber centric.
So what does that mean?
Well in AWeber and most email services,
you manage and segment your subscribers into lists.
Each list is essentially a separate segment
and subscribers can be included in multiple segments.
The lists are basically like silos that you keep
your subscribers in.
It's difficult to manage subscribers across lists.
Within lists, you can add specific tags
to help further segment your subscribers.
But these tags can't easily be used for actions
across multiple lists.
They generally apply to a single list.
This can make it very cumbersome to manage
your subscribers, as you have to work between these
entirely separate silos with different tags
and tracking in each.
Any automation that you set up is entirely list specific.
You can see what I mean here.
In the top menu of AWeber you have to select a list first
before doing anything.
Changing settings, viewing your subscribers,
and then all other information shows relates only
to that specific list.
Now ConvertKit takes a completely different approach.
And one that we feel is more intuitive.
Basically you'll have one master list of subscribers
and then you segment that one list using
tags and automations.
All subscribers are tracked and listed into one place,
so I can click on any subscriber and see
exactly what they've received since they subscribed.
What tags they currently subscribe to.
And set up global automation rules based on all that info.
After switching over to this system it just feels
so much more intuitive and it fits in far
better with our workflows.
The subscriber centric approach just makes sense
and is probably why ConvertKit's interface
and user experience just feels more intuitive.
It's incredibly simple to use and it's easy to set up
advanced automations that we just couldn't do in
AWeber due to it being list based
and working with different silos of subscribers.
It's definitely a lot easier for
new users to pick up as well.
So now let's look at pricing.
Now pricing was more of an afterthought here for us.
Our primary focus was really deliverability
and also saving time internally.
So at first glance, ConvertKit looks
a fair bit more expensive.
But once you look at how both platforms really work,
ConvertKit actually works out much cheaper than AWeber.
The reason for this comes down to the different
stance on list management, subscriber versus list based.
So let's look at AWeber first.
Remember that they charge based on lists.
Each subscriber can be on multiple lists
and AWeber charged for total subscribers across all lists,
not unique subscribers.
If I have a customer who's subscribed to three lists,
then they're included three times
in my subscriber count.
ConvertKit on the other hand, charges based on
total unique subscribers.
So I could have 5,000 subscribers each subscribed
to three different tags, which is the equivalent
of lists in AWeber.
And I would only get charged once for each
subscriber, so 5,000 in total.
Now those same 5,000 in AWeber I get charged
once for each list.
So that would mean that my total
subscribers would be 15,000.
That's the pricing that you need to compare
when weighing up the two options.
How you manage your lists or subscribers will really
determine which platform is gonna be the
most economical for you.
For us, our subscribers run an average of three lists
or tags, so this multiplier is a pretty good indicator
and shows why ConvertKit actually works out
cheaper for us.
Now there's actually one more difference here in the pricing
models that models that most people aren't aware of.
If a user unsubscribes from a tag in ConvertKit,
they're no longer included in your subscriber count
for charging purposes.
But in AWeber, unsubscribers are included
in your monthly subscriber count.
Their justification for it is because you want
the unsubscriber data stored in a list,
so they continue to charge you for it.
Now I don't agree with this at all,
it's actually a pretty sneaky way of inflating
your subscriber count and it only grows over time.
You have to manually delete unsubscribers
from each AWeber list to stop getting charged for them.
So we're loving ConvertKit right now
and we definitely haven't looked back.
But this is just our experience.
And I wanted to give you our thoughts after
getting a lot of questions on the subject
to hopefully help you make the right decision
for your business and your unique circumstances.
For many AWeber, MailChimp, or GetResponse
might be the right choice.
But for us, it's ConvertKit.
These are the factors that influenced us,
but there are others to consider as well.
For example, ConvertKit is awesome at
simple text based emails.
It doesn't have anything like the templating functionality
of AWeber or MailChimp.
We find we get better results with basic emails,
so ConvertKit works well.
But if you're using fancy templates,
it may not be the best option and just be aware
that you'll need to get something custom coded
for your needs.
If you're interested in finding out more
on ConvertKit and how it works differently,
they have a great five minute video on their
website outlining the workflow
and how the tagging system works.
It explains it all much better than I ever could.
This is what triggered us to give it a try
and it's definitely worth taking a look.
You can check it out by clicking the video on screen now
and I'll throw a link in the description below.
As always, most of the awesome insights are gonna
be below in the comments area
from the Primal Video community.
Let us know what email provider you're using and why.
If you've had a difference experience
with AWeber or ConvertKit then let us know.
And if you like us doing these behind the scenes videos
on the systems and services that we use
to run Primal Video, then let us know that as well.
We'll be doing them a bit more regularly
in addition to our weekly video production tips.
We'll see you next time.