to live in infamy. And you know,
it's Pearl Harbor is Czechoslovakia. And it's really
an attack on the western world, a free democratic European
nation was attacked by 3000 tanks in Europe, defended, not
defeated. And with a nuclear threat umbrella. You know, it's
a debt devastating war, we don't know the outcome. We don't know
that most words. And of course, it's rolling oil markets, food
markets, and it's changing everyone's mind about national
security, around everything was food, energy, technology, etc.
It's a chance for the Western world to get his act together.
You know, the autocratic world thinks that the Western world
are those lazy and incompetent that a little bit of truth to
that this is the chance to get our act together and to solidify
the Western free, democratic capitalist free people, free
movements, freedom of speech from religion, for the next
century. Good if we don't get this one, right. That kind of
chaos you can see around the world for the next 50 years,
there have been a lot of Lehman comparisons made in recent weeks
and months with regards to the fallout from the energy crisis.
You are the only Wall Street CEO who is around to navigate the
global financial crisis. How worried are you about Europe
this winter, given everything that's going on in Ukraine, and
with the energy supply?
Well, I think we're getting energy completely wrong, which
is, you know, ever since this war started, you know that
Europe is going to have a problem. And that it was pretty
predictable that Putin was going to cut off some gases that an
oil and oil price would go up. And by the way, for the climate
folks, here, it's made the climate worse, because people
had this bad assumption that higher oil prices and gas
prices, reduce consumption, reduce co2, no poor nations,
India, China, Indonesia, Philippines, Vietnam, are
turning back on coal plants, as our rich nations called Germany,
Netherlands, France, we have it completely backwards. And in my
view, America should have been pumping oil and gas. And it
should have been supported, you know, we're trying to have our
cake and eat it too, a little bit. And so you have the you
have the problem this winter, which sounds like they've got
enough supply to get through this winter. But we have a
longer term problem now, which is the world is not producing
enough oil and gas to reduce call, make the transition,
create security for people. So I would put it in a critical
category. And this should be treated almost as a matter of
war at this point, not as nothing short of that. So people
don't be surprised, like I was not surprised at Nord Stream one
being blown up. My I wouldn't be surprised if some of the
pipeline or a tanker in the wrong place. And people need to
be prepared this one and obviously America needs to play
a real leadership role. America is the swing producer, not Saudi
Arabia. And we we should have gotten that right story in
March. It's almost too late to get it right. Because obviously,
this is a longer term investments.
Speaking of getting it right, with regards to Saudi Arabia,
President Biden was heavily criticized for his efforts in
the Middle East OPEC, going ahead with their production
cuts, despite President Biden pushing against that. How would
you say the Biden administration has handled things? And has
Biden been strong enough?
I think they've done a good job. I don't look, I was gonna agree
everything the administration has done. And I think all of us
need to focus more on growth agendas, which we really don't
do very much of. But I think they've done a very good job
coalescing the Western world keeping it together, around this
war in Ukraine, and that's good, that needs to be sustained.
Because this can go on for years. The the notion is my own
right away, I think is a false notion. I think we should,
should have and could have done more in oil and gas. I think,
you know, if you're an American leader, you know, obviously,
you're gonna deal with people that you may not want to deal
with. I'm not talking to Saudi Arabia, you know, FDR, FDR, and
Winston Churchill, that was down. You know, and I think
people make a mistake to, you know, to have butterflies and
roses and stuff like that. That's not what this is. And
obviously, we should be working with Saudi Arabia. They've been
a longtime ally. You know, they are a producer of oil and gas. I
don't know what the private conversations are. I do think
that in the long run, they are far better off aligned with
America than with some of these other folks. And I think they
probably know that, and I would assume that was by the
President's conversation. Let's take it back to my bill is still
the American military that protects all that oil flow
around the world, including the oil going to China.
I want to just circle back to your initial comments around
Russia, Ukraine, you seem particularly concerned about
this war and its impact. Do you see Putin using tactical nuclear
I couldn't possibly do that before, then, you know, so if
weapons?
you could, but your comment I will make nuclear proliferation
is still the greatest threat to mankind. Okay, if we're not
sitting here in 200 years, it'll be because of nuclear
proliferation. And I do think this is example that we have,
but how important it is. And I think Putin also taught the
world that having a nuclear weapon gives you pretty much 32
Boolean enable you want