Still hungry? Then stay with us as we delve into the details of Banh Mi....
Vietnam’s version of a baguette sandwich,
shows the obvious influence of both China and France,
countries that had a long presence here.
The banh mi includes a variety of Vietnamese charcuterie,
depending on the maker and the customer.
Chinese-style roast pork is customary,
but a French-style pâté scented with star anise may be an option, too.
Secret sauces are often part of the ritual, with the Vietnamese contribution last:
crunchy onions, sliced chilies, fresh herbs and pickled vegetables.
Without them, it’s not banh mi.
In this demonstration, Mai Pham shows Unilever Foodsolutions executive Chef Steve Jilleba
how to make a classic banh mi with ingredients available in America.
[Mai Pham speaking] We're going to make a sandwich, but I thought that maybe we'd talk about the herbs first because, um....
In Vietnamese cuisine, herbs are such an integral part of the cuisine.
Here we have a platter. This is kinda — you could almost call this a table salad, if you will.
At the Vietnamese table, at almost every family meal, you'll have a platter of fresh herbs....
And a lot of people, you know, in this country, when they see something like this,
they say it looks beautiful but they probably wouldn't think of eating it,
but you know, you've been in Vietnam, you've seen that people like.... This could easily feed two people, right?
Sometimes even, you know, one person can eat almost the entire thing, if you are to be served a crepe, for example.
But one of the most wonderful things about Vietnamese cuisine is all the fresh herbs. Um....
Many different kinds and this is sort of how we serve that. This came from my restaurant — Lemongrass Restaurant....
Whole sprigs of Rau răm, which is Vietnamese coriander,
and you can see, this is the way we serve it, and when you eat it, you eat the whole thing.
And as you know, the stems are so flavorful.
That's why we always leave it on and encourage the the customers to....
— the guests — to eat the whole thing. So, this is Vietnamese coriander — Rau răm.
Kind of on the spicy side. Wonderful in sandwiches.
And I think the wonderful thing is that it's becoming easily available in this country, so....
For chefs who want to make this, in their own operations, I think this should not be out too difficult to get right now.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] And I'm finding a lot of this actually in the Chicago area which is really good now. [Chef Mai Pham] Uh huh. Right.
[Chef Mai Pham] Yeah, I'm sure that you're able to get Thai Basil, right? [Chef Steve Jilleba] That's easy. Well, actually.....
[Chef Mai Pham] You can get almost everything? Oh my Gosh. [Chef Steve Jilleba] I can, I can.... yes.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Sometimes I don't see this. [Chef Mai Pham] Okay, great....
Now, this one you know you can it's very easy to grow at home. So, you can go take take one of this...
and just root it in a glass of water and then throw it in your backyard.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Okay, well that's what I'm doin.' [Chef Mai Pham] Yeah.
Vietnamese love basil — Asian Basil. Also called Thai Basil in this country.
We just love this flavor in the Phở. The beef Phở noodle soup.
And it's also wonderful in stir fries. And the way you use this is not chiffonade style,
but whole leaves, sprigs, [....] Okay?
So, this is Asian basil. And this is one of my personal favorite.
You had this in Vietnam. You serve this everywhere.
Saw-leaf herb. Also called culantro.
And smells just like very intense cilantro. Is in the same cilantro family. So there we have that.
This one here is wonderful with grilled pork and with any salads. It's a Red Perilla.
[Chef Mai Pham] Can you get this in Chicago? [Chef Steve Jilleba] That one, I don't know if I've seen, but I probably haven't looked hard enough.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Yeah, but it's amazing the amount of stuff that we can get now.
[Chef Mai Pham] Well, I'm thinking, if you're able to get this, they're growing it somewhere. You're able to get this.
You probably can get this. Just ask people to.... ....to provide it and the farmers to grow it.
But this is red perilla, it's really wonderful.
It's the same thing — same families as the shiso used in Japanese cuisine.
Although it's a little bit more roughly and more serrated.
[Chef Mai Pham] We also have another one which I don't have today. [Chef Steve Jilleba] It's much smaller too.
[Chef Mai Pham] Right, it's much smaller but there's alsoanother one called green perilla.
It's a relative of this herb, all green, and it's very similar to, like, lemon balm.
And it's delicious with grilled meats, okay?
So, that's the herb story. What we're going to do right now is a Vietnamese sandwich.
And it can be a whole category in and of itself.
In Vietnam, you can have cold cuts, you can have chicken, you can have grilled pork.
We're going to do it today with grilled pork.
The baguette, of course, is the French influence in Vietnamese cuisine.
And interestingly in Vietnam, um....
You don't see a lot of sandwiches early in the morning. You see the noodle soups....
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Afternoon. [Chef Mai Pham] Afternoon. You saw that, right?
[Chef Steve Jilleba] And I remember the ladies on the.... [Chef Mai Pham] ....The little car, yeah. [Chef Steve Jilleba] Or even just carrying it.
[Chef Mai Pham] Just carrying in a basket.... [Chef Steve Jilleba] Carrying it. Setting up a little station and making the sandwiches.
[Chef Mai Pham] Isn't that quite an image to see? The lady with a conical hats and she's carrying it, you know, the yoke and on her shoulders.
And it's so traditional — Vietnamese rustic village style.
Then all of a sudden you see the French influence in the baguette....
And as you know, in Vietnam, the baguette is really, really light. It's made with also rice flour.
[Chef Mai Pham] So, that gives it a really nice light texture. [Chef Steve Jilleba] So it's a blend of flour, then?
[Chef Mai Pham] Yes, it's a blend of flour. And we did that probably because we have a lot of rice flour,
but not a lot of wheat flour. We have to import that.
But so, it makes for a very nice, light bread.
And so what you want to do for this sandwich — the best kind of bread is one that's very airy.
We like a lot of crust.
If you cannot buy a light airy baguette, you can buy regular baguette, and just take the inside out....
....a little bit, just....
So you want to go ahead and make this?
I'm going to put this aside, so within an easy reach,
and what makes a Vietnamese sandwich particularly delicious and particularly wonderful
and very different is really the way it's garnished, right?
So, you're going to do a little bit of mayonnaise in here, okay?
And in Vietnam, we like to.... In the old days, we use some butter, right?
A little bit of mayonnaise.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] I'm very happy that you use mayonnaise. [Chef Mai Pham] Okay, good. Good.
[Chef Mai Pham] I understand you have some in your arsenal. [Chef Steve Jilleba] Yeah. Best Foods or Hellmann's. Of course.
[Chef Mai Pham] Okay, you want to put some pork. You go ahead and use chopsticks, if you like.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] And also, if I remember the sandwiches, so..... Another piece?
[Chef Mai Pham] Yeah, why not? [Chef Steve Jilleba] Or normally just one? Normally, it's very little....?
[Chef Mai Pham] Well, in Vietnam, yes, yes, for those chefs who are watching their food costs. [Chef Steve Jilleba] (unintelligible cross talk)
[Chef Steve Jilleba] So, you're making this for me, now? [Chef Mai Pham] Yeah, making it for you. But even though....
You know, this is only like one and a half ounces, here. So, we don't have — this is not three ounces, you know? Um....
So, basically here's what we have. And this is how you traditionally build this.
You can you can take pork that's that's been grilled. This one here is basically pork shoulder or pork butt.
Leave the fat on. The interesting thing to take note of is.... Notice this piece came from my restaurant....
and we will cut the beef very thinly sliced.... We partially freeze it,
then we slice, and we slice it along the grain. Not against the grain....
Because when you do it against the grain, this thin, it will fall apart on you.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] It will break apart? [Chef Mai Pham] On the grill, okay?
So, that's a secret that a lot of people don't know.
Okay, so we got the pork and you want to go ahead.... This is what makes Vietnamese cuisine, right?
It makes a Vietnamese sandwiches....
Marinated carrots and daikon, okay?
And I brought some, you know, the daikon here....
[Chef Mai Pham] And I don't know. Do you like daikon? Right. [Chef Steve Jilleba] Yeah, I do. It's....again, light flavor.
[Chef Mai Pham] Some people don't like it, or can't eat it. Never had it before.
And so what I like to suggest is just put a little bit of it. And it gets a really nice, little, nice....
....you know, savory flavor that you don't get from just marinated carrots, okay? So....
A very central tool in the Vietnamese cuisine and in Southeast Asian cuisine — we love the Japanese mandolin.
Or really any kind of mandolin.
But the whole idea is to shred things very small. Easy to eat.
We don't use forks and knives when we're eating.
You've been in Vietnam. You see how the ladies at the market just stand right there and just grate everything and julienne everything.
So, go ahead and put a very generous amount, okay?
Even like a quarter cup on the sandwich. Quite a bit.
Okay these are.... And this is what makes Vietnamese sandwich very special, okay?
[Chef Mai Pham] And then you want to put some cilantro. [Chef Steve Jilleba] And this was....?
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Again, it was marinated in vinegar? Sugar?
[Chef Mai Pham] Vinegar, sugar and a little salt. And that's all. Okay?
And it's a wonderful thing. You can also, in high-volume foodservice, you can get this in pre-cut, right?
I mean, I suspect this in for several universities, pre-cut....
Wash them really well, drain them completely. Then make this pickling solution with
vinegar and water and a little salt.
And you put this in, and if you refrigerate it.... and you don't stick your dirty hands in there,
it should last for, you know, stay nice and crisp....
[Chef Steve Jilleba] For a couple days? [Chef Mai Pham] No, for a couple weeks.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Really? Okay. [Chef Mai Pham] Yeah, because it's basically like... [Chef Steve Jilleba] It's pickling.
[Chef Mai Pham] Yeah. So, there we have it. Oh, you know what we haven't done....
Put a cucumber in there. And I'm going to take this blade out and we're going to make some....
....very thinly sliced jalapeños. They're very hot, right? So, while you're doing that....
[Chef Steve Jilleba] So, you wanna get a little....? [Chef Mai Pham] Yeah.
I'm going to do it really, really thin. Okay, that's probably good.
And you notice how these cucumbers are cut. They're cut kind of chunky, right?
Now, here's when you don't.... This is still....
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Still pretty thick? [Chef Mai Pham] They look pretty thick to me so, I'm gonna.....
And you don't want too much, okay? So, here's paper-thin, just like that.... right?
And the dish is complete as is. But because we have so many fresh herbs here, why don't we put some on top, okay?
So, it's kind of like a salad inside a sandwich, right?
And the thing about I think some of the common mistakes made with this sandwich,
in this country, is like people like to make it kind of like the western style....
Pack it in way too much.
And it really has a very different flavor. You've been in Vietnam. You saw how the sandwich was.
We're really thin. Not a whole lot of stuff inside.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] No, actually very little amount there. You have the bread, but you had all those flavors.
[Chef Mai Pham] And definitely no tomatoes! [Chef Steve Jilleba] Yeah, that's....
[Chef Mai Pham] Because tomatoes are a wonderful vegetable, but they have a blanding effect sometimes, right? Because they're too watery.
Not a whole lot of liquid, of moisture in here. So....
Why don't you close that up?
[Chef Steve Jilleba] And normally this would....? The bread split on us. It would just be like a....
[Chef Mai Pham] Right, yeah. [Chef Steve Jilleba] ....a pocket there.
[Chef Mai Pham] Right. So, basically here, you know, we serve it like that.
And you could in food service, you could, of course, you could cut it up. Or you can put some more....
You can serve a salad on the side, right?
At our restaurant, at Lemongrass Restaurant, we serve it with a little bit of a noodle salad, just a small amount, right?
Just so that it looks really nice and, you know, like, gives you a nice little balance and.....
What do you think of the sandwich that looks like that?
[Chef Steve Jilleba] I think it looks pretty good. You know, it actually perceives a much healthier sandwich, too,
compared to what you normally see.
Because you see all the freshness of the greens and the carrots and all that.
And then I remember that what we said the cold cuts were like....
Basically pork pâté is either cooked in banana leaves, or basically a steamed pâté and sometimes a liver pâté.
So, kinda was a mix of different things.
[Chef Mai Pham] You use everything. You use the pâtés, you use the Vietnamese sausage
which is made by pounded pork with some spices and wrap and banana leaf....
And steamed or boiled...
And then you cut into kind of nice thick chunks
or you can do chicken or you can do the cold cuts, as you were saying.
But what makes the Vietnamese sandwich is really when you take a look at it,
it's really not a whole lot of protein, right?
So, it's it's sort of kind of it's a really wonderful kind of idea for people maybe not looking to eat a whole lot of meat,
but lots of air.... It's kind of like a salad, right?
It's a half salad, half sandwich.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] So, it also has a great food cost. [Chef Mai Pham] Yes, yes, it does. It....
But the important thing is to remember about the marinated carrots, the vegetables....
and the very light airy baguette.
And try not to over stuff it.
[Chef Mai Pham] Do you want to try it? Okay.... [Chef Steve Jilleba] Sure.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Want to try it with me? [Chef Mai Pham] Yeah. We'll cut it.
[Chef Mai Pham] I'm going to not cut it on the slant, too much, because it'll break. So, you go ahead and go first.
[Chef Mai Pham] What do you think?
[Chef Steve Jilleba] I've got a full mouth. It's actually really good because the pork is just warm.
A nice mellow from the spices of the pork.
[Chef Mai Pham] Mm-hmm. What I do at the cafes where we serve this, is I use a turbo chef, you know?
Just to kind of reheat. And basically, we're very busy.
We have only one and a half hours really to serve all these customers.
And we'll probably do about 400 covers.
And so what we will do, we would split it open first, right? Not completely.
We'll put the meat in there that's been pre-grilled.
And then we will heat it up in there for just 30 seconds.
You don't want to brown it. You just wanted a little toasty and the meat becomes a little bit warm.
And then we put all the vegetables in, and it out the door it goes.
And so it's a wonderful dish to make. It's very fast...
And it's very delicious and very different.
[Chef Steve Jilleba] No, no, it's great flavors. It really does, so....
[Chef Steve Jilleba] Thank you very much. [Chef Mai Pham] Oh, you're welcome.