ED: GOOD MORNING.
IT IS SUNDAY, AUGUST 9.
OUR GUEST IS DEVAL PATRICK.
DEVAL PATRICK HAS HIS EYES ON THE LONG GAME.
WHERE HE SEES THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND CRITICAL MOMENTS BEFORE THE ELECTION, AND HOW THE PANDEMIC HAS CHANGED POLITICS.
LET’S GO "ON THE RECORD." >> THE INSIDE WORD FROM WASHINGTON TO BEACON HILL.
WE ARE GOING ON THE RECORD.
ED: GOOD MORNING.
I AM ED HARDING.
I AM WITH JANET WU.
WE ARE FOLLOWING SO STILL DISTANCING -- SOCIAL DISTANCING, USING EVERY BIT OF OUR LARGE SPACE.
AND THE FORMER GOVERNOR DEVAL PATRICK IS WITHOUT THIS MORNING.
THE FIRST PERSON OF COLOR TO HOLD THE STATE’S HIGHEST OFFICE.
HE REMAINS ACTIVELY INVOLVED IN DEMOCRATIC POLITICS.
IT IS A PLEASURE TO WELCOME YOU BACK.
>> IT IS GREAT TO SEE YOU BOTH, FROM THIS DISTANCE.
CLOSER THE NEXT TIME, I HOPE.
JANET: WE WANT TO THANK YOU AGAIN FOR BEING ON THE SHOW.
WE HAVE A LOT OF QUESTIONS WE WANT TO ASK YOU, BUT WE WILL START WITH A LOCAL QUESTION THAT IS HARD TO IGNORE.
YOU HAVE BEEN THE GOVERNOR.
AS YOU LOOK AT THE NUMBERS, DO YOU THINK THAT SCHOOLS SHOULD REOPEN TO AT LEAST SOME IN PERSON CLASSES, OR SHOULD THEY REMAIN REMOTE FOR THE FALL?
>> IT IS SO HARD, BECAUSE THERE’S SO LITTLE THAT WE REALLY UNDERSTAND ABOUT COVID-19.
IT KEEPS CHANGING.
WE HAVE HAD LITTLE CONSISTENT GUIDELINES AND GUIDANCE AT THE NATIONAL LEVEL.
I THINK AT THE STATE LEVEL, THE TEAM SEEMS TO BE ADAPTING JUST AS FAST AND WELL AS THEY CAN.
THIS IS OBVIOUSLY THEIR DECISION.
WE HAVE A GRANDSON THAT IS ACHING TO GET BACK TO SCHOOL TO BE WITH HIS FRIENDS.
AND A MOTHER AND OTHER PARENTS, WHO ARE UNDERSTANDABLY CAUTIOUS ABOUT THAT.
SO, I THINK THAT THERE ARE WAYS OF THINKING ABOUT, ESPECIALLY HOW YOUNGER CHILDREN CAN BE TOGETHER IN SAFE PODS, WHERE THEIR HABITS OF DISTANCING AND THEIR FAMILIES’ HABITS CAN BE
RELIED ON.
IT IS SOMETHING I THINK ABOUT, BUT I DO NOT PRETEND TO HAVE A GRASP OF ALL THE FACTORS THAT BEAR ON THIS.
I HAVE THE PERSPECTIVE OF A SEVEN-YEAR-OLD WANTING TO GO BACK.
JANET: WHAT IS YOUR ADVICE TO YOUR CHILDREN ABOUT SENDING YOUR GRANDSON BACK TO SCHOOL?
>> THEY ARE WAITING FOR GUIDANCE FROM THE SCHOOLS, THE SCHOOLS ARE STRUGGLING, AS YOU CAN IMAGINE.
IN OUR DAUGHTER’S CASE, THEY HAVE THE NOTION OF TRYING TO DO -- YOU HAVE HEARD THESE MODELS, THE STAGGERED WEEK, WHERE SOME KIDS COME FOR CERTAIN DAYS, OTHER KIDS COME IN FOR THE OTHER
DAYS.
I HAVE HEARD ABOUT DIFFERENT TIMES OF DAY.
SOME KIDS GET THE MORNINGS, OTHERS THAT THE AFTERNOONS.
AND THERE ARE IMPLICATIONS FOR THE WORKING MOTHERS AND FATHERS AS WELL, IN TERMS OF THEIR ABILITY TO BE SUPPORTED THROUGH THIS.
I THINK WE HAVE TO ALL STAY FLEXIBLE INPATIENT.
AND EVERYONE IS -- AND PATIENT.
AND EVERYONE IS THINKING ABOUT THE SAFETY OF STUDENTS AND THEIR FAMILIES.
THAT SEEMS TO BE APPROPRIATE.
I DO NOT HAVE AN ANSWER BEYOND THAT.
ED: TO THE CURRENT NUMBERS CALL FOR A ROLLING BACK OF THE REOPENING?
MAY BE BACK TO PHASE TWO?
WHAT DO YOU THINK?
>> I DO NOT REALLY KNOW.
AS I SAID, THE BEHAVIORS OF PEOPLE AROUND THE COUNTRY HAVE VARIED SO WIDELY, BECAUSE WE HAVE HAD SO LITTLE NATIONAL GUIDANCE.
IT IS AN OUTRAGE TO ME, WHEN I THINK ABOUT NEARLY 5 MILLION AMERICANS POSITIVE WITH THE VIRUS. TODAY -- VIRUS TODAY.
160,000 WE HAVE LOST TO THE VIRUS.
AND A PRESIDENT WHO, YOU KNOW, IF WE HAD BEEN ATTACKED AT PEARL HARBOR, CAN YOU IMAGINE THE GOVERNOR -- THE PRESIDENT CALLING HAWAII AND SAYING, GOOD LUCK.
CALL US IF YOU NEED US.
IT’S RIDICULOUS THAT THERE HAS NOT BEEN A NATIONAL AND EFFECTIVE COORDINATION.
AND I THINK THAT ALL COMMUNITIES ARE SUFFERING FROM THIS.
JANET: DO YOU THINK MASSACHUSETTS SHOULD BE TOUGHER ON THE LARGER CROWDS?
I AM SURE YOU HAVE SEEN THE VIDEO OF LARGE NUMBERS OF PEOPLE AT THE BEACHES AND PARKS VERY CLOSE TOGETHER.
SHOULD THERE BE PENALTIES INSTEAD OF SIMPLY SCOLDING PEOPLE?
>> I THINK THERE ARE PENALTIES, AT LEAST FOR TRAVELERS.
CAN YOU IMAGINE -- I WOULD HAVE NEVER IMAGINED A PANDEMIC BEING POLITICIZED IN THE WAY THAT THIS HAS BEEN.
THIS IS A PUBLIC HEALTH EMERGENCY.
IT IS CHALLENGING FOR EVERYBODY.
INDEED IT HAS EXPOSED NOT ONLY OUR NEED TO BE WITH OTHER PEOPLE, BUT SO MUCH OF THE UNFINISHED BUSINESS OF MASSACHUSETTS, AND OF AMERICA -- THE HEALTH DISPARITIES, THE
IMPACT ON PEOPLE WITHOUT RESOURCES, THE WAY THAT WE TALK ABOUT FOLKS AS YOU CENTRAL, WH -- ESSENTIAL, WHOM WE RARELY PAY LIKE THEY ARE.
IT IS CAUSING US AN IMPORTANT RECKONING ON A WHOLE BUNCH OF LEVELS, INCLUDING THE QUESTION OF WHAT IT MEANS TO BE AMERICAN.
AND WHAT THAT -- WHAT RESPONSIBILITY THAT CALLS ON FROM EACH OF US.
ED: DO YOU THINK THAT THERE SHOULD BE SOMETHING MORE THAN -- GOVERNOR BAKER HAS SAID WE WILL NOT ENFORCE THIS, SHOULD THERE BE SOMETHING STRONGER?
>> IT IS HARD TO THINK ABOUT ASKING LAW ENFORCEMENT FOLKS TO TICKET PEOPLE BECAUSE THEY ARE TOO CLOSE TOGETHER AT A PARTY.
BUT THERE ARE OR THERE SHOULD BE SOME REGULAR DRUMBEAT OF INFORMATION AND ENCOURAGEMENT ABOUT HOW IMPORTANT THIS IS.
REMEMBER WHEN WE HAD THE ATTACKS AT THE MARATHON?
WE ASKED PEOPLE TO SHELTER IN PLACE, DO YOU REMEMBER?
WHEN WE IDENTIFIED THE LOCATION OF THE PERPETRATORS.
IT WASN’T AN ORDER.
PEOPLE DID IT, NOT EVERYBODY, BUT PEOPLE DID IT BECAUSE IT WAS NOT EXTENDED.
AND BECAUSE THEY TRUSTED WE WERE GIVING THEM INFORMATION AROUND WHICH THEY COULD PLAN THEIR LIVES.
I THINK ONE OF THE HARD PARTS OF THIS, ONE OF THE DIFFERENCES OF THIS, IS THAT WE RARELY GET AT THE NATIONAL LEVEL A CONSISTENT INFORMATION THAT ENABLES US TO PLAN OUR BEHAVIORS.
ED: HOW WOULD YOU ASSESS HOW THE GOVERNOR HAS HANDLED THE PANDEMIC?
IT HAS BEEN A STATE-BY-STATE APPROACH, BUT HOW DO YOU THINK THE GOVERNOR IS HANDLING IT?
>> I THINK HE HAS A REALLY HARD TASK.
IT FELT SLOW TO GET GOING, BUT AFTER IT GOT GOING I THINK HE HAS BEEN DOING WELL.
HAVING SAID IT IS A REALLY HARD TASK, I SAY THAT, BECAUSE THIS IS NOT THE KIND OF THING THAT LENDS ITSELF TO STATE BOUNDARIES.
BARONESS -- VIRUSES DO NOT RECOGNIZE STATE BOUNDARIES, OR A PARTY FOR THAT MATTER, SO I THINK FROM WHAT I CAN TELL AND FROM WHAT I READ AND I SEE, THE GOVERNOR AND HIS TEAM HAVE BEEN
TRYING TO ADAPT TO THE CIRCUMSTANCES, THE CHANGES IN INFORMATION AS WE GET IT.
JANET: LET’S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT JUSTICE REFORM.
PROTESTS CONTINUE, BUT NOT IN THE LARGE NUMBERS THEY WERE.
CANDIDATES ARE RUNNING ON THESE ISSUES, BUT MY QUESTION TO YOU IS, DO YOU THINK IT WILL USURP WITH THE PANDEMIC AS A TOP ISSUE FOR PEOPLE AS THEY VOTE THIS FALL?
>> THEY ARE RELATED IN A WAY, BUT I WILL SAY THAT THE ISSUES AROUND CRIMINAL JUSTICE AND THE SORT OF BEHAVIOR OF POLICE TOWARD BLACK PEOPLE, THE BEHAVIOR OF POLICE TOWARD SOME
OF THE PROTESTERS, WHICH HAVE BEEN OVERWHELMINGLY PEACEFUL, IS ALARMING.
IT’S NOT NEW.
BUT THE FACT WAY OF NOT -- WE HAVE NOT HAD THE TYPE OF DISTRACTIONS THAT USUALLY COME UP IN THE CIRCUMSTANCES, HAS CAUSED PEOPLE TO FOCUS IN AN INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT WAY.
JANET: YOU ARE SAYING THE PANDEMIC HAS FORCED US TO FOCUS ON THIS?
>> YES.
IN -- THE SAME DISPARITIES I TALKED ABOUT EARLIER IN TERMS OF ECONOMIC CONDITIONS, THE ABILITY OF PEOPLE TO ACCESS VARIOUS FORMS OF RELIEF, TO TURN TO OTHERS FOR SUPPORT, OR NOT.
MUCH OF THIS, MUCH OF THESE DISPARITIES HAVE THE SAME ROOTS AT THE BOTTOM OF THE ISSUES AROUND POLICE, AND THE EXCESSIVE USE OF FORCE.
IT DOES NOT MEAN ALL POLICE ARE BAD AND POLICING DOES NOT HAVE ITS PLACE, BUT IT MEANS WE HAVE UNFINISHED BUSINESS AND A RACIAL RECKONING THAT’S A BIG PART OF IT, WHICH I. THINK IS ENORMOUSLY
IMPORTANT -- WHICH I THINK IS ENORMOUSLY IMPORTANT.
IN EVERY ELECTION, THE CHARACTER OF THE CANDIDATES IS THE ISSUE, BUT RIGHT NOW IT IS THE CHARACTER OF THE COUNTRY.
I SAID THAT AND I BELIEVED IT BEFORE THE PANDEMIC, BEFORE GEORGE FLOYD’S VIDEOTAPED LYNCHING.
IN SOME WAYS, WE ARE ALL FACING SIMILAR KINDS OF AND UNDERSTANDING ABOUT THE SCOPE AND SIGNIFICANCE OF WHAT WEARE VOTING ON NOW.
JANET: MY QUESTION, I HAVE TO ASK, ANY INTEREST IN BECOMING ATTORNEY GENERAL IN A JOE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION?
>> ONE THING AT A TIME.
[LAUGHTER] SERIOUSLY, I AM WORKING REALLY HARD TO HELP BIDEN WIN.
TO HELP THROUGH AN INITIATIVE A NUMBER OF CANDIDATES FOR THE SENATE AND FOR THE HOUSE, MANY OF WHOM ARE RUNNING IN PLACES WHERE DEMOCRATS HAVE NOT COMPETED, OR COMPETED
SUCCESSFULLY FOR A LONG TIME.
A TERRIFIC GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO REALLY DO UNDERSTAND HOW IMPORTANT IT IS TO RESTORE A SENSE OF NATIONAL COMMUNITY, THAT WE HAVE A STAKE IN EACH OTHER.
AND WE HAVE BIG QUESTIONS AT THAT NEED TO BE CALLED, AND BIG OPPORTUNITIES TO DO RIGHT BY MORE PEOPLE.