(cards shuffle)
(mouse clicks)
- How do you describe our current relationship to others?
(Courtney laughs)
Mhmm.
(Kareem laughs)
- Kareem's my ex.
Things happened in our relationship.
It didn't work out.
He's a great guy.
Just sometimes, you trip up.
- Okay.
- My turn? - Yes.
- Okay.
- It is your turn. (laughs)
- Oof.
Okay.
What have you been hesitant to tell me?
- Ah.
There's a few things.
I feel like there's a list of things.
We kind touched base with them before.
Sometimes just how much I miss you.
Sometimes just...
Like how I feel like you didn't deserve what happened.
And how much I do think of you.
That as well.
- Okay.
(Kareem chuckles)
Your turn.
- What does our breakup feel like?
- What does our break up feel like?
- Yes. (chuckles)
- I mean I can only go back like what it felt like.
- I mean you was very vocal
about what it felt like... (laughs)
at the time.
- Yeah.
I just...
(Courtney groans)
My health, being depressed...
not feeling like...
I brought anything to the table
like financially and stuff.
There was a lot that I was dealing with and...
With what happened like stuff that you're doing and stuff.
I just felt so betrayed.
I felt weak.
I felt myself just sinking.
(coughs) I never been in a hole like that before.
And then even trying to go into other relationships
without holding onto that and everything was hard,
and just like, yeah.
I think I'm out of it.
I think I'm kinda away from the edge of it.
Just like (laughs) I'm not going back.
- Yeah.
- But at the time, that's what the breakup felt like.
It was hard.
Now...
I guess now I don't feel like much about it.
I think, if anything,
I just want you as my friend.
- Yeah.
- Yeah, just want you as my friend.
- Okay, I think it's your turn.
- What do you think was the reason we broke up?
- Ah.
Well for me, for me cheating.
Definitely I feel like that's like the biggest part
of why we broke up.
I feel like there was other things going on,
but we were trying to work through those things.
But I feel like that betrayal is definitely
what took it...
- Over the edge.
- Yeah.
- 'Cause yeah.
(both laugh)
- Ultimately.
Yeah, that's what it was.
(Kareem laughs)
- What was the hardest thing for you post breakup
that I'm not aware of?
- I don't know, I guess...
just the depression.
Like I feel like you knew I was depressed,
but I don't know if you knew on what scale.
- Same here.
- Yeah.
- Definitely same here.
- Yeah, I was just really depressed.
I was all in it.
- Yeah.
- I felt like we planned things, our future.
And it was just like...
(Kareem laughs)
get the hell out of here.
And just like trying to be having a conversation
with myself being like,
"Do I go back?
Do I go back again?"
That conversation that you just sit there
and having choices like...
It's like a lot of people are telling you like,
"But you love him.
But he hurt you.
You wanna be with him,
but I wanna be by myself."
And it's voices all around you
just saying that, saying this,
and you're now all by yourself,
and it's just dark.
And it's just like...
I don't know.
- For me, it was similar with the same thing.
I went to like this really deep...
(laughs) It was a really bad depression.
I wasn't me for maybe like August until maybe like April.
And in the midst of that,
I was really just crawling my way out of the hole,
'cause I was in a hole too.
But it was different for me,
because when you're the person
who does these things
and make that mistake,
and you have to live with that.
You know?
Like living together, cooking,
laundry, habits, work,
everything we knew on a daily schedule.
So to go from that
to being alone with everything again,
it was a transition on top of the depression
on top of being in the hole
on top of knowing what I did.
So it was really hard for me for a long time, as well.
And then trying to communicate with you.
I feel like for a year, you was enemy.
Like you may not... (laughs)
You may not see it that way,
but from my side,
I felt resented for like at least a year after.
- Yeah.
Now... - Yeah?
- I can definitely see that. - So it was hard
trying to make amends, trying to find a way to get peace,
trying to fix it or start something new.
It was a lot. (laughs)
It's your turn, sorry.
- What is the pain in me you wish you could heal?
- Me cheating.
You feeling betrayed.
I feel like
our friendship really...
was one of the main components in our relationship.
So, the cheating part. (laughs)
I feel like me cheating on you and betraying you,
that sense of betrayal that I could see in you
to even now.
It's just something that I wish,
even if it meant you not ever seeing me again or...
us never anything.
As long as that was a way,
I would be happy.
Because like I said,
I feel like you didn't deserve it.
And I just think that the journey I was on with myself,
mixed with us,
things played out the way they shouldn't have,
and then I see the longterm effects
that it has on the both of us.
I feel like that hurt,
that pain, that betrayal,
I wish I could take away.
- Yeah. - Yeah.
I need some tissue. (laughs)
In 20 years from now (Courtney chuckles)
when you (chuckles) will rethink about our time together
what do you want to remember the most?
- It was a goddamn mess. (laughs)
- [Kareem] 20 years from now.
- 20 years ago. (laugh)
- We'll be 57, 58.
- Stop, why would you...
Ew.
(Kareem laughs)
I would like to remember...
that we went through what we went through.
And we were able to become friends.
- I think in 20 years,
I hope that we're in a great place.
I don't know what that means how,
but as long as we're in a great place.
- Yeah.
- Yes. - Yeah, definitely.
(Kareem laughs)
(Courtney laughs)
- What do you have?
- (murmurs) Would you ever consider dating me again?
Why or why not?
- Ugh.
Yes, I would.
And because I have never felt the connection
I feel with you with any other man
that I've ever met after, before.
All of that stuff.
I don't really think that...
I can't say like, "Oh, why not?"
I can't really say why I wouldn't
want to be with you.
- Well, I think that was
if you had said no.
- Yeah.
- Yeah. - Okay.
So I wanna ask you the same question.
(both laugh)
- I mean you know my answer.
I would say no.
Just because,
we talked it.
Like I felt that chapter
has come and gone, and it's closed.
Since the breakup...
We've talked about his too.
Like since the breakup,
I've always just like...
And probably slipped up and...
I always wanted the friendship.
I just want us to have our friendship, because...
you were my friend.
You were my best friend.
You were my boyfriend.
You were my lover.
You were all these things.
And it's just like if we could just
remove those other things
and just have the friendship...
I'm okay with that.
I just, yeah.
- Okay.
- Yeah.
- Hi, guys.
Thank you so much for watching.
This is Mériem with The Skin Deep.
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