Film Courage: You said something in another interview about seeing the movie The Crying Game [1992 - Written/Directed by Neil Jordan]
and that you learned from either seeing it or not being able to see parts of it you
learned about boundaries and censorship from the point of like an audience or
something. I was just wondering if you can expand on that because I thought
that was fascinating and cool story? Orson Oblowitz, Filmmaker/Photographer: and everything yeah well
so Sherman I have a predilection to make violent movies I've always been
attracted to them kind of harsh realities and violent instances and
that's where creatively I am attracted to so it all started and I got one point
pinpoint at this moment my mom my mom was a single mom bring me up in New York
and she wanted to go see the film The Crying Game
over at the Angelika film the Angelika Film Center in New York City so she took
me cuz she couldn't get a babysitter so I went with her and there's a very
violent scene in The Crying Game with a that's a great Irish actor's name
I can't remember his name Steven Rae there's a violent scene with Steven Rae
and a and the love interest who's also a transvestite and my mom knew it was
coming so she said hey she took me she took me
outside the theater and said can you you know sit with an usher and I'm gonna go
watch the Z because I wanted to see the film but you knew was coming cuz her
friends had told her so you know so I knew well I'm not supposed to watch this
like I got to see this so in the doorway of the Angelika Film Center was a
portable that you could see into the theater and I watched the scene through
the porthole out of the door with no sound and it was at a moment that I knew
I wanted to make I wanted to be part of transgressive cinema where I and I
couldn't put a word on it then but now I think I understand more is it that I
wanted to to break down that that doorway between the audience the between
what you're not supposed to see and what you can see and I think that's what I
learned in that moment this idea that as an audience member you
know there's these violent moments and were allowed these glimpses into them
and there was like a certain voyeurism sort of a certain taboo that I wasn't
being allowed in on and that's all I ever wanted to do since then in these
films so yeah that movement was very so uh informative to my to to later you
know twenty years later when I started I actually got the chance to make a movie
and I realized why do I have this predilection for violence why do I want
to always push it it's because it was something that was taken away from me
that I couldn't have and that even draw it drew me closer to it that's
interesting because it goes back to what you said earlier about like living these
two different realities and and how there's people that could be right next
to you and they're living in different reality than you and I can remember
being younger and I grew up in somewhat of a conservative town and there were
kids that I played with it weren't allowed to watch Public Television and
to me I wasn't you know I was watching Three's Company and that was probably
too progressive for my age you know and so just think that's interesting that
that having been sort of kept from you oh yeah I mean that's what's fascinating
to me right and I think that's like kind of what's created great I mean look at
Scorsese or Paul Schrader right both grew up in very conservative religious
households right Paul Schrader didn't CFL until he was over 18 and all his
films kind of deal with violent is lack of faith this alien aided outsider in a
world that doesn't want him so it's totally affected them I on the other
hand was almost allowed to see too much so this moment of not being allowed to
see something was really and being inhibited really to me prove that there
were boundaries that people didn't want you to crosses the viewer but I wanted
to cross them so I think yeah it's the same thing right like we we're products
of our environment I think that might push us totally in the other direction
that intended by you know the person in charge very true yeah and you were
raised by two artists which is interesting because most people it seems
like a lot of people are raised by people that aren't artists and then they
prevent their kid from winning the arts because they want
to save them from some of the the harsh realities of doing anything creative
so how was that being raised by by either one person or knowing that two
parents that you had were creative I mean it was a pretty interesting
childhood for sure you know my mom and dad they came here from South Africa in
the 70s to escape apartheid and not they were just very anti apartheid and anti
the political systems of Africa at the time so they came here and my dad was a
filmmaker my mom was an actress and you know eventually they went their
different ways and my dad moved out to LA became a filmmaker and he always told
me he was like you don't want to do this he was like oh be a doctor be a lawyer
whatever you do do not become a filmmaker so of course I was like womp
becoming a filmmaker that dad said no probably shouldn't listen to him and you
basically have to be a lawyer half the time in this industry anyway but um and
then my mom on the other hand was extremely supportive and I lived with
her most my life in New York and she was always you know like be creative helping
me create supporting creativity bought me a still camera when I was very young
that I used all the time to take photos with and that was kind of my first inlet
into film so it was interesting and then I also watched my dad who you know he
had a lot of struggle he made some great films and had some struggles with films
and he's and it was you know the industry wasn't always the best to him
and and it changed and you know he's always managed to keep up with it and do
his thing but so I have very much a first-hand glimpse into also you know
this is a really hard industry this is and that it goes back to lala land right
I think lala land starts with the thesis that it's a hard industry but that makes
it seem like it's very easy and for me I think there's a lot of us that you know
we put a lot we let a lot ride on the filmmaking be a filmmaker being an
artist and what it doesn't work out it really hurts and I saw that firsthand as
well and I've had it happen to me firsthand but different you know with
you put something out there and maybe there's sponsors and what you wanted and
it's like your child so yeah as I was very lucky to have supportive parents
and I was lucky to have an insight and I'm
crazy that I wanted to go do this but I couldn't imagine doing anything else in
the world I get the sense that maybe I told you this one we had joined the
panel but that you've always been like two decades ahead of people like even
growing up what was that hard for you I'm not just assuming I shouldn't assume
but I could see that in you that you were like more advanced than maybe some
other kids I don't know if I was I mean I went through a lot of honestly I have
a lot of personal trials and tribulations I went through growing up
so I think creatively I got I I was I was allowed to express myself at an
early age and there was no pushback against that and that was very important
on the other hand I think with that I was a terrible student
I was not great Oh a socially younger you know got in a lot of trouble kind of
rested all that stuff like so that came with that so I think you know there is a
give and take to everything but I am very grateful that I got to be creative
at a young age and that was supported and that no one ever really pushed me in
any other direction and I feel blessed in that's the way because I know a lot
of people who are amazing filmmakers now and it took a lot you know they had to
reject their family's wishes and move away from home and go far away and
they're super successful in really fantastic artists but there came from
the opposite where they really had to push back against the world that they
were brought up so you know I think it's you know the luck of the draw a little
bit I think on your website you had a quote that just said that um you have to
be obsessed or maybe it was a QA you have to be obsessed to make this work so
I just think that's interesting I mean because if you know that you had
struggles before sometimes people take an easier path but if I think if you've
dealt with risk and just always feeling like stuff's not gonna work out then
you're willing to take sort of the longshot I don't know yeah I mean I
think you have to be obsessed like there's there's no get-rich-quick scheme
in the film at least in my version of his film industry like you want to make
personal films or you're not getting rich the next day when it comes out you
probably have to put your own money your own credit your own time
family your own relationships on the line and that's only worth it if you are
absolutely obsessed and no one can tell you to be obsessed you're just gonna be
obsessed it's not it's gonna overwhelm you and take you and then in the end of
the day you're gonna have to give put it out in the world and when it comes out
there you're done you know you've done your job and yeah I really do think that
this is a film industry uh that filmmaking more than the industry
because industries all other thing but I think almost anyone who works in the
film industry is absolutely crazy you have to be right yeah you just
there's no reason is you can work in a bank you can have a great life but for
me it's kind of like I get one shot at this life and like this is what I love
and I even like many days you know only have a hundred dollars my fake account
but it doesn't matter because I get to make a movie I get to work I get to
write I get to have great conversations with people it opens outlets in your
life that no money or career opportunities could open for you I know
I've known a lot of people that work corporate jobs that aren't happy and
then it manifests into office politics and you know because you're dealing with
the same set of people saying dynamic almost everyday and I think that people
start to get crazy there too I think it's just a contained crazy absolutely
but you know I think also like you know we're all trying our best to survive in
this crazy world and there's you know all the rules that people give us seem
to change all the time so you know I think there's no I think
there was a time of my life where I used to think you know you can do a corporate
job that you know whatever that's you but I it's all it's all just your path
and like your journey and as a filmmaker like you're gonna you're gonna be
miserable a lot of the time you're gonna be sad you're gonna think you're
terrible at what you do I mean I was going through it recently like I'm
adding a new film and some days like I just want to press the delete button on
the whole thing you know like I just don't want it I don't even want to look
at a frame of it anymore but you got it because it's yours and it honors the
only reason you have to is because if you don't no one else will do you think
that comes from being so close to it every day because now you can get sick
of even if it's excellent but it's just
like you're facing it every day and it goes back to the same thing with the
workplace you're in the same place every day so then stuff manifests oh
absolutely I think it's all about you know I'm actually it's so funny you say
because I'm very much going through this process that I'm struggling with right
now I have a new film that I've been making and I I wrote directed I shot it
and I'm editing it and a lot of that was out of just a financial necessity
because when you're doing small low budget films there's just certain of
voids you you may have to film along the way be is that's just the way I imagine
making the movie I think that was it was kind of this mercurial process I saw and
I said I want to try this and again it comes back to obsession
I'm obsessed and control Frank and I think almost all filmmakers are control
freaks actually everyone I met and I'm very messy in my life but my films where
I get to like be the control freak uh-huh and and going back to that I
think you get so close yeah I was so funny I was talking to a friend today he
said how are you doing on the edit and I go dude I'm so deep in the woods I don't
even know which end I'm coming out on and he was like he was like yeah but you
know this one day will this will end and you're gonna come out on one side of the
woods so just keep going and that's kind of you know the you know it's like the
Elizabeth Warren uh what's her or the Elizabeth Warren slogan you know she
persisted you know that's kind of the way filming something to persist you
have to persist at every step of it but yeah it is very hard to be close and
it's very hard to detach yourself from something that you really love you know
and let it go in every edit is you letting go of something you love and
then it turns to you hating it and then you're kind of in a crazy place well
with the queen of Hollywood how was that once you screamed it and then I think
you have distribution for it right yeah so and then like the whole sort of
sexiness of filming it is over the editing part where maybe it's more
traumatic and then now it's out in the world what is that like
the good and the bad of that Wow making Queen was one of the most if not
the most transformative experience I had as a human being there was a lot that
went of reasons why I made that film I was going through some very personal
dark situations around me and I basically was like I understand this
world I have to make a film at this point because I don't really know where
else to go and then I made it I shot it you know getting it the whole process
every process is hard right like you have no money you're begging people for
money and the amazing thing is people help you and that's one of things like
the first step I learned along the way I guess the method is that people were
there and really excited to be part of it from the get-go and a small team
formed and the bigger team formed and then we were shooting and it was the
most amazing experience ever and then I edited that film for almost a
year I was so obsessed and so not sure what it was and I had another editor
Kelly McGillicuddy on it for a couple months and my producers Matt and Jeff
they were also editors so they'd come in and edit like it was kind of this crazy
process and we'd sent it to festivals and we get rejected and then a festival
would say no we want you actually we're not gonna take you it just a crazy I
mean I many stories no one's you know you never know and then I had a party I
met Michael rap she runs Dark Star pictures and we just hit it off and I
sent him the film I mean I went through every other channel in the world here
supposed to go through and I met a guy at a party who was like I dig this film
let's do it and you know he worked really closely with me we distributed it
it came out in theaters played a bunch of cool festivals it you know and I
don't think you're ever satisfied you always think you know you're so obsessed
that you're like this is the greatest thing in the world and it's great to you
but you know there's a lot of films out there there's a lot of art out there and
you just have to let it be and you have to let it live you have to let it find
its own life and that was a big experience I learned but I loved it I
mean there's nothing you know there's there's honestly
nothing more satisfying than being able to go on like Amazon and just type your
film in and it comes up and you know what it doesn't matter if one person
sees it or 1 million people see it like that's your baby and it's out in the
world and it's all worth it just just to let it to know that it lives and that it
will live but it's a lot of work you know and it's it's not always that's the
thing that goes back to the Long Island statement right you know it kind of
keeps going back to that which is like that film tells us that like if you do
work and you find success it will all be great not as great as you thought
because you could have had this other you gave up love but it's still pretty
great and it's hard the whole process is hard and it's difficult and it's
alienating but we again we do it because we're obsessed crazy people and we feel
we have a story to tell and those stories are important that anyone who
has and tells me
you