what is the best case you've ever heard against extreme ownership and what's
your response or alternatively are there situations where extreme ownership is
the wrong answer if you've never heard an argument against let me propose to
okay one extreme ownership focuses too much on achieving victory through focus
on strategy and tactics let me before you even go there mmm I got asked that
question at the muster is there such a thing as too much extreme ownership and
I said well yes there is actually such a thing as too much extreme ownership for
instance and I actually broke it down to the fact that there's two types of
extreme ownership that you're gonna have internal and external internal is I own
everything and I know that but I'm not sitting here telling everyone right
external is hey guys I'm gonna own this this is me this is mine so you can
easily see from there where you can overplay your hand of external extreme
ownership for instance echo you're in charge of this project that we're doing
I want you to do it like this because I own it
like that's obviously wrong right so if I'm trying to get people to do things
like I'm trying to use decentralized command and all I'm telling you everyone
was like this is my project I own it echo you do this this is your
part of the project but the project is mine right does that make does that
motivate you in any way no okay so we're not gonna do that that would be
too much extreme ownership it would be too much outward extreme ownership now
if so what I want to do is almost an echo this is your project I'm gonna set
back let you run this thing I think you've got a really good idea and vision
on how this is gonna work and I think you could actually do a better job then
I can do so here's here's the goal that we're trying to accomplish and if you
just you know come up with a plan and tell me how you're gonna execute it I'm
standing by right now you're like whoa chuckles trust me to do this that's
pretty cool right that's awesome so now we have a good thing going so that's
that's what I'm gonna keep my ownership internal
I'm not gonna project it on you keep it internal now where this flips is the
project fails and clearly the example now becomes crystal clear because now if
I use external ownership and I'm saying I should use external ownership and when
the boss says hey joko your team failed on this mission I'll say you know what
we did I've made some mistakes here here's what I did wrong here's we made
the wrong investments I didn't allocate resources well here my fault we're gonna
get it fixed next time around won't happen mm-hmm okay that's cool that's
I'm now correctly using excessive extreme ownership to take ownership of
the project that you actually screwed up now obviously the wrong thing would be
hey Jocko this project failed and I say oh that's cuz echo dropped the ball on
this he didn't get this done in time and echos got issues over here now that's
not good I want to take I don't want to use that I'm keeping my ownership
internal I'm being lame basically so yes the the argument against extreme
ownership is yes if you take too much ownership of a project and you're not
letting your you're not using enough decentralized command that's why there's
a dichotomy between those two there's a dichotomy between extreme ownership and
decentralized command and if I use too much extreme ownership when I'm trying
to execute decentralized command it's not gonna work right yeah now once a
mistake happens or there's failure that's when you step in and take
ownership and by the way you should have taken ownership all along to make sure
that the project didn't fail but these things happen you don't win every single
time you don't care who you are now he gave except a couple examples I'll
let you proceed with the question good sir
okay he's gonna propose to example okay extreme ownership focuses too much on
achieving victory through focus on strategy and tactics but not assessing
whether war was worth fighting in the first place for example maybe you
priority prioritize and execute and cover and move and institute
decentralized command to become the leading buggy whip manufacturer in the
country right beforehand you're Henry Ford releases the Model T or maybe you
built the tightest sharpest most aggressive sales team in history but the
product they're selling is praying the weakness of poor or ignorant okay so
this is fairly simple now and in the book extreme ownership I believe Chapter
three is called believe that is you gotta believe in what you're doing and
part of believing in what you're doing is understand why you were doing in what
you're doing and how it is beneficial in the world mmm right so for instance that
both these examples would fail the test of believing in what you're doing they
would fail the test anyone that was in the transportation industry at the turn
of the century and would understand that the buggy the horse buggy was doomed
when they started seeing reliable cars come out on the streets and somebody
that truly exercises extreme ownership would step up would adapt which is
another key concept of extreme ownership and lead the transition from buggy whips
to this new technology of cars so it's okay it's not you're gonna step up
you've got to make changes that's part of ownership is looking and assessing
the other example where you're leading extreme ownership you're leading
something that is preying on weak people well then that doesn't pass the test
right that doesn't pass the test and believing what you do because if I'm
like hey you know what I'm gonna get out there do we go out there prey on extreme
people yeah you know that's one dude now of course if you have a person that's a
sociopath or doesn't care about others those are only out for themselves and
they exercise extreme ownership in order to accomplish an evil mission well yeah
that's gonna be bad because people that people that take ownership of things can
make things happen and if their cause is evil then that's gonna be bad it's gonna
be a bad situation so you know the the thing that's inherent in extreme
ownership is a true understanding of the mission and belief in the mission and
the knowledge that you're doing the right things for the right reasons which
is why these two examples are are actually non issues mm-hmm and then he
gave another example what sample number two yeah example number two is
the time and focus commitments required to practice extreme ownership come at
too high a cost to your family we didn't sign up for this for you no didn't sign
up for a mission and in the end the gratification of having achieved your
objective won't be worth what you've given up in your personal life perhaps
substantial ownership come on quotes is a better fit for most people
okay well let's just not forget that extreme ownership is not just about
business in any stretch it's about life and you have to own the outcome in life
and that inherently includes balancing between what you do for business and
what you do with your family now I'll tell you that we hear all the time about
how extreme ownership actually saved marriages not hurts them but saves them
and you know the husband will stop blaming his wife or vice versa and look
at themselves and see where they can improve instead of blaming your wife for
what's going wrong you say oh maybe it's not cool that I do this particular thing
that I know annoys are right take some ownership of that they take ownership of
the relationship and the problems in the relationship and they fix them instead
of making excuses or pass on the blame so extreme ownership is gonna help that
family then if you listen to the the podcast with JP with JP Danelle on it
which is number 46 JP is taking ownership of his marriage which was a it
actually were divorced at the time and applied the simple laws of combat right
simplify cover and move and and got his marriage back on track and so the
extreme ownership is not a hundred percent focused on business it's focused
on life and the dichotomy is also there that I talk about all the time that you
have to balance all the opposing forces it's a chapter in the book called the
dichotomy of leadership right you've got to balance these opposing forces in your
world now one of those opposing forces is balancing the the pull of your family
with the pull of your work and yeah you can go too far in one
direction you can go so far in one direction that you lose your you can go
so work so hard and do such long hours that you lose your debt then you lose
your family mm-hmm you can also do the opposite where you're you don't do
enough for at work and you focus so much in your family that you lose your job
which one of those is a good outcome neither that's why you have to balance
neither one of those is a good outcome yeah that's why you have to balance and
by the way it's one of those things - I've seen this happen with your friends
of mine that have gone on sort of a breakdown kind of downward spiral in
their life hmm I think this is problematic people start having trouble
with their marriage right and they quit their job mmm and they think oh now I'll
be able to spend more time but now all of a sudden they don't have any money
and it turns into a disaster and I always say look man think about this
your job is what how you provide for your family so let's have a plan before
we move in this direction you got a balance if you if you cuz if you throw
everything like I just said if you say okay my jobs you know I'm too stressed
out and I'm just gonna leave my job and just focus on my family now you've got
no income you got a whole new level stresses coming at you cuz who's gonna
put the food on the table yeah so no like one guys they stopped working out
after they get married because all I gotta focus on my family my kids you
know no but Oh health down you know health down yeah the energy down yeah
you know you become a low-energy father we don't want that that's bad that's bad
for the whole family so yeah that's another thing if you got if you got your
your wife or your husband is saying hey you know you're working out all the time
or you know I don't like this say hey here's the benefits you know do you want
me to be around for an extended period of time you want me alive past 60 do you
want me to be healthy do you want me to be able to defend our family should
there be some kind of an encounter you know I know I do want to be able to
defend this family yeah so yeah I got to spend a little extra time on their gun
range yeah I got to spend a little extra time on the jiu-jitsu math yes I'm gonna
work out that's I'm doing that you think I'm
doing it for me I'm doing it for us for us you know I'm doing it for us no of
course the balance that do because you can go
overboard there too yes we're you know careful like working out is not to be
confused with going to the gym there's some bulls a huge separation there yeah
so guys will like go to the jammers let's face it there is a big element of
social there you know that social component and jujitsu we've got amazing
stuff what do you mean when you go to jujitsu like you there's a lot of
hanging out you mean talking about like yeah you're friends of course so some
people they'll be like hey I'll go to jujitsu meanwhile new baby whatever hey
I'm gonna do Jitsu but then they'll roll for the hour hour and a half and then
three and a half four hours later they'll come home yeah I also just I was
doing jujitsu here's the benefit like yeah you did the jujitsu for hour and a
half the other for what however long you were cruisin with your friends in the
lounge drinking acai yeah don't do don't
confuse it is or gotta have balance or use it you know how people use it like
that it go but you know yeah that's good and you know these questions what I
liked about them is you saying hey you know basically put the extreme ownership
attitude into the UFC cage and let's see how it does in these problem examples
hmm so I think I think it does alright or just get your home gym you know yeah
I definitely recommend the home gym