From the start of the pandemic. Scientists have tried to determine
exactly where and how this novel coronavirus spread to humans. Did
it emerge naturally from the animal world and get transmitted to
people in Wuhan, China, or from a security breach at a research lab,
Also in Wuhan that has been the subject of an ongoing debate. William
Branham is back with details about new studies published yesterday
in the journal Science that point to the live animal market.
Judy, trying to understand Covid's origins has been a complicated
and politically fraught undertaking. For almost three years Now,
the trainees government has been accused of impeding a full investigation.
But this new research attempts to get the clearest picture to date
and I'm joined by one of its authors, Angela Rasmussen is a virologist
at the vaccine and infectious Disease organization at the University
of Saskatchewan. Dr. Rasmussen great to have you back on the news
hour, so the the
At the beginning of the pandemic. A lot of attention was focused
on this live animal market. And you and several of your colleagues,
including Michael, Laura B. Have got some pretty strong evidence
in your paper that indicates this was the epicenter of the outbreak.
What is that evidence plotted all of the early cases from December
of 2019.
On a map of Wuhan whether they were associated with the wanted market
or not, and many of them were. This was identified as a place that
was important early on in the outbreak investigation. We found that
whether those cases were associated with the market or not, whether
they've been to the market or not, they really clustered around the
market and formed almost a circle around the market.
Where the market was in the dead center. Another piece of evidence
is that we know that live animals, including some that were susceptible
to stars, coronavirus to infection were being sold at the wanted
market, including in November and December of 2019. And Furthermore,
there were environmental samples collected from the side of the market
where these animals were sold.
Um, that were positive for SARS Coronavirus to that really strongly
indicates that that those samples those environmental samples may
have come from the animals. And on top of that those samples were
often collected from things associated with animals such as cages,
hair and feather removal devices and carts. And then finally, there
were actually two different genetic varieties or variants of SARS
coronavirus, two that were at the market.
Linear J and lineage be initially We thought that lineage be was
spreading at the market, but we didn't understand that.
Lineage. A was also there until it was found in an environmental
sample. Um, this suggests that really there had to be two separate
introductions into the market. And the only thing that explains this
is two people independently coming to the market and being infected
with lineage and lineage about a week apart. The other major
Theory that has been bandied about over the last few years is about
the Wuhan Institute of Virology, which is a Chinese lab where Chinese
researchers and some American funded researchers were studying coronavirus
is and the theory was that the virus somehow got out of that laboratory
and then spread amongst people. What is your research indicate about
that theory?
So our research actually indicates nothing about that theory. Other
than the early cases were not clustered anywhere near the Wuhan Institute
of Virology, which strongly suggests that nobody actually in the
lab was infected. Um, on top of that no evidence whatsoever has emerged
since the very beginning of the pandemic.
That suggests that the Wuhan Institute of Virology was involved in
the outbreak in anyway, Some of your fellow virologists have said
that
Given that some of this research relies on Chinese data that we have
to take this with a grain of salt, because the Chinese have a great
deal of interest in
Pointing a finger at a more natural quote unquote natural
emergence of this virus at the market. Do you share that concern?
I disagree with that, for two reasons and first origins. Investigations
are usually very light on evidence and the evidence bases are never
complete. We found that we certainly had enough evidence to come
to the conclusions that we came to with a high level of certainty,
but the second objection I have to. That is the fact that actually
a market outbreak.
Looks really worse for the Chinese government than a lab accident.
Um, and the reason for that is that the live animal trade was integrally
involved in the outbreak of SARS coronavirus one in the early two
thousands, And at that time, the Chinese government said that they
were going to crack down on the live animal trade and regulate it
to be more safe and ultimately it became illegal.
Um, that means that essentially all of this live animal sales and
trading was occurring outside of the law. And so it was completely
unregulated. And it is, I think very embarrassing. Given that that
is exactly the same circumstances under which SARS coronavirus one
emerged. So is it your sense from all of your investigations into
this that
Are you do you feel? I know this is not the scientific term, but
100% sure that this market was the was the epicenter, Or is this
just the best science we have today, indicating that's the most likely
keys?
Well, so I personally do feel 100%. Sure, But of course, as I mentioned
there are other possibilities that could explain it. However, those
possibilities are vanishingly unlikely. Um, so I personally and very
certain that this does explain where the virus came from. Now that
said, there are still many open questions. How did those animals
get infected which animals were infected?
Uh, where did they come from? Who was exposed to them prior to coming
to the market. There are many open questions that still need to be
answered. But I feel that we really have closed the book on where
the outbreak began. And that was it that wanted wholesale seafood
market.
All right, Dr. Angela Rasmussen at the University of Saskatchewan.
Great to see you. Thank you so much for being here.