David Schwartz, how do you deal with a company that is excited about you but
may not have budgeted enough to afford you do you have more resources on
challenging salary situations I do those are in the bootcamp and I would also if
you are not I don't believe you were in the bootcamp if you check out I think I
did a video way back when that talked about being overqualified now I know
they didn't say David you're overqualified but you have the same
problem as somebody who is overqualified where they they don't want to give you
they don't want to give you the requisite salary it check that video out
search my youtube channel for overqualified that's all you need to do
and an old video is gonna come up that's a little bit blurry through I don't know
if it was a clip from one of my life casts way way back in my other in my
other home but I talked about when you get in a situation like this you have
different options you could accept the budget that's lower if you really love
the company but that's one option the other option is you can press back which
is I would definitely press back about why I'm worth it right you want to
convince them you need to demonstrate that and you got a hope that they're
able to go and create that budget if if they can't the other tactic that you
need to employ that I talked about in the video is about the counter to them
is not about money it's about changing the scope of the role so if you've only
budgeted eighty thousand for this role and I'm a hundred thousand dollar person
a year then could we consider augmenting the scope of responsibilities to warrant
the but the the compensation level that and that's commensurate with the value I
will bring you that is commensurate with the value I will bring you it's not
budget that I want or the you know you want the but you want the budgeted low
it's what I think I deserve it is not about what you think you deserve it is
about the value you are going to provide and you want
be paid fairly in relation to the value you are going to contribute folks you
need to loop that eight o'clock thirty minutes into this session go back for
any of you that are in negotiations about compensation you need to write
that language down okay I want to be paid commencer to the value I will
provide that is objective right it has nothing to do with how you feel about
yourself if you've convinced them in the interviewing process that you will
contribute that value that is how you sell yourself you do not get what you
want in this world with employers because you asked for it you get what
you want in this world because you convince them that you are worth it I
would look that a few times because that's the fact and the biggest mistake
I see people making is they talk about what they want instead of the value
they're gonna bring okay so you got it you gotta get that straight and I would
practice that line those lines flower it up any way you want but take that out
there and go get them all right and good luck with that all right Mabel let's see
if I could get back up to main ball oh here we go
Mabel Hey with a nice picture how you doing Mabel how do you deal with the
salary question if they ask again cuz I already told them that I see a job as a
whole not just salary and did not give a number love it okay it's a couple things
number one I have two videos out there that is specific to how to handle the
salary question one of them has like a million five views I mean it's a lot
it's very popular it was an original one I created in 2018 I recently created
another one a couple of weeks back and and it's kind of a 20/20 update of the
best answer to you know what's your expected salary or what what you should
do to the salary expectation question if they ask you the salary and Mabel I'm
assuming that you're that you're you're talking about in the beginning of the
process or early in the process and they're asking you how much do you
want to earn or what do you expect or what's it gonna take to leave or some
other ridiculous question like that what I would do is I would go with the answer
that I've already packaged up for you just like Mabel is is citing here you
know money's important for sure but I look at this holistically right there's
a lot of things that go into it what I get to do who I get to do it with you've
obviously got benefits and all these other things career development whatever
is important you then the recruiter says nuh no I need a number because I'm lazy
and I don't you know I want to make sure that you know I'm not talking to you if
we can't meet your number when the recruiter has no no clue what they're
actually gonna pay you if they love you but some of the I not believe me I'm on
your side guys I know that these recruiters they get all orange and
yellow and red and they dig it all flamey and all that stuff no you got to
give me a number the next best route is not to give them a number but to ask a
question if they're gonna be this insistent just say okay well you know
what um I hadn't really thought about it so I'm
assuming that you have a budget in mind do you have a range that is acceptable
internally for this position if you share that with me I will let you know
if I'm comfortable with it don't give most of them will give you
that range okay they will and if if they don't that's ridiculous because if
they're if they know what the range is they may as well just tell you if they
need an answer they can that's the quickest and easiest and painless way to
get it and then you you can what I would recommend at that point this is me I
would just say yes that would be fine based on what I know at this moment
sounds reasonable okay now you get in there that can all
change right cuz you're gonna go through and discover a lot of things and all
those assumptions that you that you had that we're not your friend now become
clear you have much more you're much more clear-headed about this you have
clarity you have insight you understand the benefits package you understand the
job better you understand the people you're gonna be working with all those
other things that you now have stalled to get and that's how I would go about
that and what things symbian I thought things had gone well during the
interview but the salary discussion stall
they followed the suggestions on the videos but they seem to want me to give
a number not the total package thoughts I would ask them to give you an idea of
what they are thinking and I would really try to press them too and I would
say just what do you think is a fair offer and get them to start meaning give
you something to react to that's the advice that I would give you or anybody
if if they are absolutely insistent that you need to give them a number and you
are and I'm clarifying this because I know some of you guys are gonna probably
misunderstand what I'm saying I never like giving a number ever not in the
beginning not in the middle not at the end I know you have to do that on the
application many times but that's almost irrelevant when you get down to the end
if they're forcing you to give them a number number one I think that's a
little bit extreme I also think it's kind of silly and I also think it sends
a poor message about the type of company this is gonna be but let's just say sake
of argument that they're making you give them a number then what I would say is
well I can give you an idea what I think my salary is going to be can you give me
an idea what you know the bonus potential is what maybe what the health
care costs are and some of those other things because that would that would
that would influence the number I give you it's just s for that okay you'll say
I'll give you a number you give me that stuff okay if they say well we just
before we show you all that like now now you're getting now I'm getting weirded
out if they're not if they're not able to share these things like you get a 10%
bonus it's paid annually our benefit packages we can show you what that looks
like right because they're about to give you an offer so you're gonna need to see
those anyway I would ask for that because I would do everything I possibly
could to get more information so that the first number or range out of your
mouth makes sense okay so that's what I would do and if they said well we don't
want to give you any of that then I would give them a fairly wide range I
would be open to something between 80,000 and a hundred thousand and it
really depends on what all that other stuff is and that's what I would do
that's how I would play that and I that would frustrate the heck out of me if
they did that to me just that's how I feel about that all
right a B how do you determine how much more to negotiate for after given an
offer that's entirely up to you what do you want and it's not it's not as simple
as okay you gave me a hundred thousand I want one time because there might be a
bonus there might be restricted stock units you might be able to negotiate for
more vacation you might be able to negotiate working from home two days a
week there's everything is negotiable okay we and it's not just negotiable in
a starting job offer I did a coaching session last night
hours ago practically where she's a boot camper she's been in her job for a year
14 months we helped her negotiate the first offer she is now up for a
promotion we are I'm helping her negotiate her promotional offer so what
is it gonna be how would I handle it what would I say what would I ask for
but this is this is based on how much more you want now I had a clip that went
out on LinkedIn it might have been yesterday where I talked about you do
not get what you want in this world because you asked for it you get what
you want in this world with employers because you convince them that you are
worth it how much you ask for is a function of how much more you do want
but how convincing you were throughout the process that you showed them that
this is the value that I am going to bring and I want to be paid commensurate
with the value I'm going to contribute and based on what you were asking me to
do the targets we've set the things I'm handling the things I'm doing the
business I'm going to bring in the business I'm running whatever it might
be this is what I want based on that so I can't tell you how to determine how
much that is and I would not again going back to my previous point that I made
with Ivana I would not be spending a lot of time
trying to determine is this company underpaying overpaying or whatever no
look run your own race think about that
situation there are no people there are no two offers that can actually be
compared because there are so many even though you try there are so many
variables with this company in this company
how much do you value the people that you're gonna work with how much do you
value the training that they are going to to give you right how much do you
value the flexibility in your schedule how much do you love the
responsibilities you're gonna get what about the healthcare what about the
benefits what about all these of the employee stock purchase program what
there's a million different things that go into what makes that entire value
package money is only one part think of it as a hundred percent pie filled with
wedges the wedges can slide right this wedge can shrink if I get a bigger piece
of this of this portion of the pie right all right so Adam asks how do you
suggest handling salary negotiations via email or verbally now I'm glad you put
the word negotiation in there any negotiation for a salary or any kind of
job offer I would never under any circumstance
no exceptions zero exceptions literally none ever do this via email why number
one it's too easy to misconstrue what you're
asking for number two you can't iterate the negotiation real-time with the
person and determine are they willing to budge
are there other alternatives are there more creative options to satiate what it
is that I need the spirit of what I need you're never going to be able to do that
going through email now what would I use email for if I'm in the salary
negotiation process use it for things like can we said okay I got your I got
your digital offer or I got it in the mail or I got it online or I got it from
the system right that's basically how they get it
to you they either give you a link into a
system because they want you to sign something in their system or they'll
email it to you or they literally will mail it that's becoming less common but
some people some companies still do that for the pomp and circumstance of it all
so can we set up it I got it could we set up a time to talk logistics
all right that's okay now if if they come back and they say well do you have
any insight as to I do have ideas but I really prefer to share them live okay do
not give them anything via email the other thing that you can do is if you
then talk you go back and forth according to all my salary negotiation
tactics you go back and forth and then they email you back and they say hey
Adam we're good to go we're gonna give you everything you asked for
great give me the thing I'll sign it that's it right they gave you everything
Adam we gave you 90 percent of what you asked for
are you good with that if you're good you tell them if you need more time you
say you call it right you don't say anything unless it's yes affirmative
send me the form send me the link to the system whatever it is okay so you do not
want to go back and forth I really want to drive this home you will bundle I
mean you you will buck bumble fumble I mean you people it's it's very difficult
use it for logistics handling that's it at that very sensitive time it's very
important and you should not be going back and forth a lot one iteration one
and a half that unless and unless it's very very complicated and filled with
many different components that are assets that offer you should not need
many iterations because then it you know everybody gets sour so I hope that helps
that's a that's a great question that's a great question juice box get an offer
it's give Jim a big congrats good good for you buddy about worried I'm going to
leave money on the table and negotiations should I counter only once
or twice Jim if anybody ever countered on me twice I would I would rescind the
offer okay you you want to shoot for an iteration
so I'm an I'm the employer I'm going to present an offer to you you want to go
off and you want to think about it if you want to think about it and get back
to me great give me the data i'ma look at it
and then I'm gonna say yes or no okay or or you might say Andy I want 10,000
more I might say Jim I'm gonna give you five if you say Annie nup can you go
7,500 that's gonna irritate me okay because if I'm giving you my counter on
something as tight as that I don't want to mess around
if however it's a very complicated structure like Jim here's your salary
Jim here's your sign-on bonus Jim this is the monthly Commission's
this is the quarterly MBO bonus here's the year-end corporate annual bonus
here's your restricted stock units here's your spiffs here's your okay you
got all this stuff you're trying to monkey about with if it's complicated
like that then then it's okay to iterate again okay but I I feel it's more of an
int so if you come back to me and say I want 10 more on the base I want 20 20
more on the sign-on bonus I want the Commission's to go from 2% to 3% and so
on and so forth now I've got to look at all this now there's a number of things
that we can do to move this up and move that down and all that good stuff
you do not want to go around more than one and a half times so just kind of
keep keep that in mind but I I would not be going in thinking I got a counter
twice I need to go in thinking I gotta crush this which I hope you know you did
you say you're about to get an offer hopefully they're gonna make a good
offer hopefully it's gonna be super close and hopefully you're gonna make
one pass that's what you shoot for that's the goal because that keeps
everybody's emotions intact - meaning you don't join being sour they don't
join feeling like they overpaid you and being myth and then put a bull's-eye on
the back of your head that you better hurry up and produce that's how I that's
why I look at that but if you have a simple pace truck
like salary or salary and bonus one shot