- I thought you were going to say, a lovely couple.
(laughing)
Sorry, sorry.
(laughing)
Sorry, sorry, sorry.
My name is Junaid, I'm 46-years-old,
I converted to Islam in 2003,
so about 13 years.
English through and through, England born.
I was born in Sheffield, I live in Wakefield
in West Yorkshire now.
But yes, as English as I think you can get.
(laughing)
I'm of a Christian background, Church of England.
My parents were, definitely had a belief and a faith.
We did Sunday School up to the age of maybe four, five,
six years old.
At that point, we moved house, and as we moved house,
I think that never continued.
A belief in faith was always there in the household,
but not necessarily a driven religious belief or faith,
but it kind of always fell within me,
as I grew a little bit older, because it was
covered at school, we always looked at religion,
religion was something that was very important.
I then started actually going to Christian groups myself
at not much older than that, probably eight, nine,
10-years-old.
That carried on for quite a few years,
so it was always a belief and a faith,
and you know, a need or desire to know about religion.
Then I kind of hit the mid teen years
and kind of, if you like, the religious side,
the religion side faded away a little bit,
the faith never did, the being religious,
if you like, never faded, but the attending classes,
the, you know, going three, four times a week,
going on Fridays, going on Sundays,
that subsided, shall we say, and the things
that teenage boys do kind of took over.
You know what I mean?
And as I went through from that stage,
there was always this belief,
there was always this faith, I knew there was
something bigger than me.
I never really thought about what it was,
and it was only later on that I realized,
I always had that faith and that belief,
but if nothing else, it came down to,
generally speaking, people are good,
if you do good things, good things will happen,
if you give, you'll get.
You know, just a nice approach to life but,
not a formal religious
aspect within my life, if that makes sense.
I say, I had a good job, I had a nice car,
lived in a nice house, I had the trappings of a great life,
and my job at the time, I was in training,
so I delivered training courses.
I'd been doing it for quite a number of years,
I was well educated, a masters degree,
and the training that I did was in a very
white male dominated industry, so it was
training to white guys who have a certain mentality
and a certain mindset, a very macho kind of mindset,
and the way that they live their life,
you know, the work and play was all
kind of geared around the same issues and the same things.
And one of the courses that we ran on a very regular basis
was a two week residential training course,
so it was based in a hotel, all the training
was done in the hotel, we were a resident
in the hotel, so you've got a load of guys
in a hotel where they can pretty much
do whatever they want in the evenings,
and all they've gotta do is wonder out of their room
into a training room the next day, and that kind of
cultivated a certain attitude and mindset
across the course, which was amusing at time,
shall we say.
And it was always the same kind of things,
the same kind of people.
And then, one course, we had somebody on the course,
people went into the bar in the evening,
and this person wasn't drinking,
and given the kind of people that we had there,
it was sort of, why are you not drinking?
And they explained it was, A, because they were Muslim,
and also, the reason they weren't eating
during then, they weren't drinking anything
was, it was actually Ramadan.
So, my ignorance for Islam knew no bounds
at this point, I didn't, through circumstance,
didn't really mix with Muslims,
didn't know Muslims, didn't know anything about Islam.
And people were asking these questions,
and I found the answers really interesting,
so I just found myself sort of gravitating
towards this person and having a conversation,
so, oh, when you say you're fasting, what does this mean?
When you say Ramadan, what does this mean?
And then when it gets to religion, what does this mean?
It was quite, it was an enlightening, eye-opening,
incredible experience really, 'cause all of a sudden,
and I've kind of categorized it afterwards
or explained it afterwards that I found,
I was receiving lots of answers to questions
I didn't realize I had, and it all made perfect sense,
and it was all very rational, and it was just like,
wow, oh, so this is the same religion, in effect,
I mean, this is what I've lived for all of my life.
It's not your religion and my religion,
there's no difference, it's the same, also,
Jesus Christ is an amazing individual,
but he's not God.
He's an individual, he's a person, he's a prophet,
that kind of makes more sense, you know.
And just lots of things, and conversations,
and sort of, across these two weeks
where everyone else would disappear to the bar,
I would be just sat there tapping this person
for information and just pulling information out
and conversing, and gradually
all these lights were coming on,
and it just made so much sense.
And I wasn't looking for it, I wasn't seeking it,
I didn't feel a need for anything in my life,
but all of a sudden, ping, ping, ping,
all of these answers were coming,
and literally, over two weeks,
I think even I was thinking, okay,
this is really cool, this kind of makes sense,
but then that breeds an awful lot of apprehension
and I'm not gonna do this.
You know what I mean?
No, this can't possibly happen.
So, there's lots of issues, lots of potential problems.
So, we kept in touch after the course,
because the course is residential,
they move back to their part of the country.
We kept in touch, and I just became, I think,
the most annoying person in the world,
'cause I was just, so what about, on the telephone,
so what about, so what about,
and just question after question after question
after question, and I think I recognize that
I was looking for the flaw, I was looking
for the thing that would stop me ultimately
taking this step that I think realistically,
I knew ultimately I was going to take
you know what I mean?
And I was looking for the flaw.
So what about this and what about that,
and asking all these questions,
and the patience of this individual
was phenomenal, was absolutely,
I think that God sends angels in many forms
and whoever was guiding them was just,
it was incredible, because I must have annoyed
the heck out of them.
So, I'm asking question after question
after question after question, yeah,
trying to find the flaw, trying to find the thing
that would stop me making this move,
and eventually, this might have been six months,
they tell me, find this book, read this book,
obviously, the Quran, you know, take this,
just have a look, and then I'd ask another question,
and then I'd read something and I'd ask a question,
and they just answered these question,
answered these questions, answered these questions.
And eventually, I don't know, maybe five, six,
seven months, they kind of said, right,
I think it's time for you to visit a mosque,
I think it's time for you to go and,
I can answer so many questions, you know.
What do you think?
And I was like, yeah, wow, okay, let's do that.
I just said, well, so what do I do,
how does that happen?
I've never been in a mosque.
I'm comfortable when it's church,
I'm used to that, I've never been into a mosque.
And so they gave me a few, you know,
take your shoes off at the door, it'll be fine,
it'll be fine, everybody will like you,
it won't be a problem.
I go to the mosque by myself, I drive up,
and then I drive past, and then I drive past,
and then I drive past, and then eventually
pull up the courage, and I've never felt so white,
I've never felt so nervous, this is a confident guy,
and all of a sudden I'm sweating, and I kind of went
into this place and I see these shelves with shoes
on them, so I'm thinking, okay.
So I'm kicking my shoes off, and a chap just came out
and said, hi, can I help you?
And I'm thinking, oh, he obviously thinks I'm here
to check the fire escapes, you know what I mean?
And he's just, can I help you?
And I say, well, I'm really interested in Islam,
and I wondered if you could maybe answer some questions.
Bang, the cake came out and the tea and the drinks,
and people came around, it was just, the warmth.
Everything I'd been told would happen happened.
It was quite extraordinary, and, you know,
hours later, I left the mosque just
already a different person.
Just the warmth and the, I don't know...
Just the attitude that people had that I'd seen
in this other individual and then other people since then
was magnified, if you like.
And so, it was easier to explore and ask the questions
and get a bit more guidance, and then
very shortly after that, I accepted Islam
and, yeah, no turning back.
It was extraordinary.
But from nothing, from I wasn't seeking anything
to really don't want to do this, you know.
How can I stop this happening, to,
okay, there's no flaw.
Every single question has a rational answer
to it, has an explanation,
and it just made sense.
Everything that I'd done as a child,
so, who was Noah, who was Moses,
who are these people I've kind of heard of,
and they're all explained.
All of these things were now explained.
It all made just perfect sense.
When I made my Shahada, it was quite
an extraordinary experience actually.
Approaching it, I assumed it would be really difficult,
I assumed there would be lots to it,
I assumed, I just, again, assumption, assumption,
assumption.
I'm not born into this.
I didn't know things that other people may take for granted,
I had absolutely no concept of,
and once they get explained to me,
not all you'll be doing is.
And I said, well that seems really quite straightforward.
You know, we'll give that a go.
So, as a result then my pendulum swings
so far the other way where I thought,
oh, this will be easy then.
This will be really straightforward.
It was very simple.
It was very straightforward but, the transition
was really quite visceral and quite extraordinary.
There's just this,
I want to say a feeling of warmth or a glow,
I don't know really how to describe it.
But there was a physical manife...
There was a change, you could feel
the change, if that makes sense.
Where you just say these words
and you say them in Arabic and then somebody's
explaining what that means in English.
It's not just the case of, I'll say these words
and we're not going to tell you what the,
you know, it's well explained and told.
It's a very simple statement but such a profound
statement but such an obvious one.
You know, saying I believe in one God
and I believe that prophet Mohammed made peace
with people and it is his messenger.
And ultimately, you make in this declaration
and so simple, so simple.
And this, this, just this,
I'm repeating myself, I apologize,
but this warmth, this glow, this, I could feel
the transition.
It was extraordinary.
It was absolutely extraordinary.
And from then, the response
from people, that, it's like they were experiencing
it as well.
The utter joy and, (sighs).
It's very hard to explain.
It's very hard to put across but just people
were in a very, form an environment
but they literally leapt up and kept hugging me
and congratulating, it was amazing.
It was amazing.
It was absolutely incredible.
I mean the concern for me,
there were many as I say,
I was genuinely looking for the flaw.
I'm thrilled that I couldn't find it.
But the concerns were, I think a lot of them
were about perception.
How other people would perceive me.
So, as an example, living in the culture
in which I was raised, people drink.
And it's a large part of the,
when I say drink, they drink alcohol.
And it's a large part of the culture.
And not doing that might make it difficult
to mix with certain people and certain people
might even frown on that.
I mean, I now I think, hey ho, you know
what I mean, it absolutely has no bearing,
no impact now but at the time,
that was a big issue.
It was, it was not long after 9/11,
there was a certain perception around the world,
even with that as I say, my ignorance knew no bounds,
I didn't know a great deal about Islam
until meeting people and then it was a huge transition
cause the people that I was meeting
was so much in conflict with,
or how they behaved was so much in conflict
with what you were seeing and what you were hearing
and what you were being told.
It was extraordinary.
But you know, there was an issue
with regards to that.
And a lot of it, yeah it came down to the issues
of perception.
How would people view me?
I've worked for the same company for an awful long time.
I was well established.
I have a roll that put me out
into a huge network of people.
I stood up in front of people and delivered
training courses.
Could I, could I still do that if,
was my life going to change?
And were those changes going to be,
you know, ultimately negative?
Was it going to make my life more difficult?
I feel extraordinary even mentioning alcohol now
because at the time,
my God, even saying it feels,
it feels horrible saying it,
it feels weird saying it.
Cause at the time, just seeing a focal part
of so many peoples lives
and then now that it has absolutely no bearing,
you just think, why do people waste so much time,
money, and sanity, and why do they allow things
to just sap the goodness out of them.
I don't know.
Maybe I'm just going a little bit too far but,
absolutely no issue.
I much prefer not drinking.
I much prefer my children being in an environment
where they don't see alcohol.
I much prefer, or when they do see it,
it's hard to see alcohol in a positive form
when you're a child and all you see
is what it does to people.
Ultimately the issues that I had
certainLy wrapped around alcohol and perception,
how I would perceived and how I would be seen.
A, ultimately don't matter,
that they generally don't matter.
But the one thing that I found is,
I fundamentally don't feel like I've changed at all.
All that's happened is my life has just got better
and better and better and better.
Okay, I don't drink, no issue.
You know, it doesn't make any difference at all.
But all that happens is,
the circle of friends that you meet with,
just becomes different.
And from my point of view,
that's much, much, much better.
Because the circle of people I meet with
have a mentality and a mindset that
there's one God and we talk about God a lot
and you know, this comes into your life
and how it affects your life and you just
view things differently.
Fundamentally I don't think I've changed.
I've changed some of the things that I do
but overall I feel like I'm the same person.
I'm as good as I ever was.
It's just that now that goodness has a purpose
and a reason behind it.
Yeah, life's brilliant, all these apprehensions about
how will I be perceived?
There will be some people who wouldn't even know
that I'd converted to Islam.
Some people wouldn't even know
because I just live my life in a way that
I'd like to think people should live their life.
Yeah, so if there were any apprehensions,
it was the negativity that might come from
embracing and accepting Islam
and actually it's been nothing but positive.
Everything about the journey has been positive.
You start a new focus and a new drive
and a new reason for getting up in the morning
for the things that you do,
everything that you do is with a purpose
and with a vision and with a view.
If you take it to a very basic,
a very basic principle, it's to help
people around you and then ultimately,
you know, so that hopefully God will be happy.
Yeah, so overall, the change that Islam has brought
has been, well, nothing but positive.
It's all been positive.
There's all positive changes.
This change if you like, within your mentality.
When I get up in the morning I know why I'm getting up,
I know why I'm doing the things I'm doing.
But also I want to do things for other people.
I want to help the people around me.
One of the things I find in the Muslims that I meet
and the Muslims I speak to is this desire
to help those around them.
The desire to help your neighbor.
The desire to help anybody around you.
Whether they're Muslim or not, anybody that comes to you,
you're actively trying to find a way to help them
cause if you can help them,
if you can help their life,
if you can make their life a little bit better,
the world gets a bit better
then you know, God should be happy with that.
All of these things is what people should do.
But you now realize why you're doing it.
And it's an amazing feeling and it's there
all the time.
And I see my children doing it.
I see my children wanting to help other people.
I see my wife, all my friends,
it's extra...
You don't lose anything from that.
You're gaining all the time.
It's not about you giving things away.
It's what you get from helping other people.
So, the religion encourages you to help other people.
But all the time that that's happening,
you're growing and you can feel this,
yeah, this thing, you get a great feeling,
a great sense of joy whilst you live your life.
That's, as well as everything that you get
from the religion itself.
Just, your whole philosophy,
your whole way of life is,
what can I do to better the world?
What can I do to better the people around me?
And as a result, what can I do to improve myself?
I'm not one to giving advice
but my first piece of advice would be
ask questions.
There will be lots of things running around
your head where you're thinking,
well what about, what about, what about,
what about, ask the questions because I'm telling ya
there will be an answer and it will be an answer
that will make this journey more easy for you.
And ultimately, yeah, do it, do it.
I can't be one to tell you, and it is entirely
up to you, all I would say is,
the temptation to procrastinate and put things
off in life is a big one.
Not with this.
If you want life to get better and improve,
I personally would say, yeah, do it.
But that's up to you.
It's up to you.
Ask the questions, alleviate the doubt
and yeah, take the step.