[MUSIC]
Filters, fuzzy backgrounds, hiding our videos, manipulating our microphones,
we now have more tools than ever to manage how we appear to others.
Yet the desire to manage the impressions we make on others is not new.
It is fundamental to who we are as humans.
Hello.
I'm Matt Abrahams and
I teach Strategic Communication at Stanford Graduate School of Business.
Welcome to Think Fast.
Talk Smart, the podcast.
I am really excited today to chat with Melissa Jones Briggs.
Melissa is a lecturer in organizational behavior at the GSB.
She combines her vast experience in performance and acting with a deep
knowledge of social science research, to provide our students with insight into
how power and Presence impact all personal and business interactions.
Plus she is just an all around great person.
Welcome, Melissa.
Thanks for being here.
I am so excited to have you on the podcast.
>> Thank you, Matt.
Thanks for inviting me into the conversation.
>> Yeah, great.
Let's get started with that conversation right now.
You could teach the very popular acting with power class.
Can you describe the focus of the class and
share a few key takeaways about how we can display a more powerful presence?
>> Absolutely.
In the course we use techniques from the performing arts,
paired with social science research to address
the challenges of responsibly using our power and using it well.
The challenges of interacting human to human.
So in large part in that it's a theatre arts class.
We give students the experience the knowledge and
ultimately the courage I'd to act outside of their normal comfort zone,
so that they can perform all kinds of roles with agility and range.
So class lectures and discussions focus on power as a force for good and
power and status dynamics are brought to life through acting training and
seen work in real world scenarios.
But you asked about the powerful presence.
I think the answer to that is summed up in another question
to an extent which is powerful for whom?
So, a key takeaway early in the class covers maybe three points.
The first is that power is a tool to serve others.
The second is that leadership is a role that you play like apart you play in other
people's lives.
And third expression of that role is your responsibility as a leader.
So our job is to bring ourselves or expertise, our voice our experience to
our leadership roles in the office at home in our communities.
>> So in answering your question to whom If I am a leader in an organization and
I want to make sure those around me see me as somebody who is
responsible is capable is one who deserves the respect that the position holds.
What are some things that I can do with my body, my voice to demonstrate that power?
>> The awarenesses of context and role and the range of the physical and
vocal behaviours required to perform that role as effectively as possible for
your people is what underpins the purpose of our work in class.
>> So I want to come back to you've mentioned the notion of context,
can you give us more detail on what you look for in the work that you do,
and guide others to look for when you're exploring the context and
trying to understand its impact on who we are, what we show, and how we communicate?
>> Yes clarity of context and role is important to the responsible use of power
and effective communication right especially across distance and
across dimensions of difference.
And so what that means as it relates to role, is what are my responsibilities
here in this room, in the present moment with these people?
What are my responsibilities in my larger role within the organization?
And bringing your full self to that role that you're playing in
the moment aware of the people the other actors in the scene and
their own needs aware of your physical and vocal cues what's available to you.
And of course the content and the space,
your movement through the space around you, the very specifics of where you are.
>> It sounds to me context and roller, intimately connected.
It's multi-faceted what you need to pay attention to.
I really like this idea a lot we have spent a tremendous amount of time
across these podcast episodes really thinking about who we are speaking to and
adding to that this notion of context and where you're speaking and
the role you have and are expected to play.
Just add more specificity to that type of reflection and
certainly we will adjust our communication based on context.
And I love that you're highlighting very specifically space the space we
are in that influences a lot of things and so thank you for delineating that and
helping us understand it better.
Much of what you've just mentioned though is non-verbal what we do with our body and
our voice, but what we say actually matters too.
I read a recent Washington Post article in which you talk about how language can
act as in your words armor against uncertainty and embarrassment?
Can you tell us more about how the words we choose to use or
not use impact how we come off to others?
>> Yes, that piece was about corporate speak unnecessary, meaningless jargon.
Choosing meaningless words distances us from people speaking cryptically
with no explanation intentionally or not can be a dominance display or
playing high status as improvisers like Keith Johnstone, Dan Klein would observe.
But they'd also agree that corporate speech can undermine power to
the impact of this kind of language depends on the context and the audience.
So it may read as intimidating if the jargon signals say an in group
language that the audience doesn't know.
But it can also be read as ridiculous if it's obviously meaningless language that
the speaker is using in an effort to raise their status.
It's natural of course to feel vulnerable right as the cat jump into
our frame here on video or children toddle into the room which
might actually happen >> [LAUGH]
>> It may be tempting to use more
corporate speak to make ourselves appear more put together.
But it's actually a retreat.
>> So the corporate speak the protection you talk about in the article is
really about being inauthentic is what it sounds like.
And I'm curious,
do you have a favorite corporate speak term that just really bothers you?
Is there one that just above all else you just like,
that's like fingers on a chalkboard.
>> One is operationalize.
I've also come to get really irritated by leverage,
that I haven't used either of those but I'm humiliated when I do.
>> The one that bothers me the most and it's not just in corporate speak is,
it is what it is.
That to me is just a wasted statement.
It doesn't say anything, so that that bothers me too.
Now managing how others see us is central to social life can
you help us understand what covering is and how to the stories
we tell help us cover or uncover information about ourselves.
>> Fear of backlash.
So the consequences like we discussed earlier,
the fear generally can lead people to downplay aspects of their identity
that may not align with the role expectations of the group majority.
So that's covering it's a term that was coined by the sociologist
Erving Goffman back in the 60s.
The downplaying of stigmatized identities.
So the identity may be apparent but
the individual downplays various aspects of it to assimilate to the majority group.
Kenji Yoshino is a professor of law at New York University and
he described this as a hidden assault on our human rights.
Men and women for example may cover within an organization that has a strong
masculinity contest culture by writing about long work hours or
strategically distancing themselves from caregiving.
So covering is a performance.
Many people cover in ways they may or may not be aware of.
>> And stories factor into that the stories we tell others and share.
Do you have thoughts on that storytelling?
>> I do because power and authority often determine which stories are centered and
which stories are marginalized.
And narrative revelation deepens our understanding of others so
by uncovering previously untold stories we can create environments
that invite new stories in and that helps shape inclusive and equitable work
cultures covering and uncovering are both calibrated performances.
So when it's safe you can uncover and bring more range to your role.
When it's not safe people who have the power to make it safe for
others to do that must and the craft of acting teaches us
to uncover it sets the stage to allow others to do the same.
So it sounds to me like uncovering requires both courage but
also support from the environment that you're in and
that support could come from leaders from having mentors or examples etc.
Is that right?
>> Absolutely not >> So a take home message might be that as
leaders we need to be thinking about what we can do in terms of our role modeling,
in terms of the environment we set up.
So that people feel safe and
comfortable to share some of these stories that might not typically be shared.
So thank you for explaining the concept but also for
encouraging us to set those kinds of environments up.
You and I have known each other for quite a while and
I always learned something about the guests I interview and it really,
impressed me with some of the incredible work that you've done with those who
are marginalized and underrepresented in business.
And I'm wondering if you could share what lessons and
tools you use to help people In those situations and
what can we do to support those lessons that you teach?
>> So much of the work like in class is about identifying and
revealing underdeveloped parts of ourselves to bring new
performance awarenesses and range to their roles.
A lot of its breaking habits.
Habitual ways of speaking and moving and
that calibrated uncovering the revealing and growing those underdeveloped
parts of ourselves helps us serve our organization and our people.
So it sounds to me like doing reflection on your communication,
your circumstance, your role, and then thinking about who you really are.
Maybe even itemizing the things that are important to you can set you up for
success when it comes to playing or acting in the work-life and
the work situations you find yourself in.
Is that an example [CROSSTALK] >> Yes and
bringing the you know being intentional about your objectives and
intentional about your role and your responsibilities in role because
you leaders have more power than they may realize and it's their right and
responsibility to harness that power as effectively as possible to embody yet.
>> So it's first and foremost paying attention to your situation and
then focusing on your intention once you have that information to inform how you
are going to act in that situation, is that right?
>> Yes.
>> I love any advice that can rhyme, so it's attention and
intention to adjust to the situation.
There we go.
I'm a happy camper.
>> So do I.
>> [LAUGH] Any last best practices or advice you would like to share to
help us navigate and manage our impressions and power?
>> The understandable desire, right that we all have to manage
impressions may undermine our larger objective and the impression itself.
I think that's something that's important to remember we've been talking about being
mindful and intentional and bring our full range but it's also important to be able
to let that go to rehearse and prepare and be able to let it go.
It's important to care, to make sure that you're caring but about the right thing,
the shared objectives, the audience.
So rehearsing to grow range being thoughtful and intentional,
even practice is critical.
But the whole point of all that work is then to be able to let it go and
be right there in the moment with the needs of your people.
>> That speaks to so many themes that have come up across our podcasts.
The notion of being present oriented, the notion about structure and practice and
reflection and how that can prepare you.
A great analogy I think is for anybody who's ever played a musical instrument or
has done a sport you do so many drills and so much practice.
So in the moment when you're playing the instrument when you're playing the game,
you can just be present and experience it and rely on the skills that you've
developed and to take that approach and apply it to our communication to apply it
to our work situations is so powerful, but not necessarily easy to do.
That's why we need expert teachers like you and
others to really help guide us along the way.
I really appreciate that that advice.
Now, Melissa, before we end,
I'd like to ask you the same three questions I asked everyone who joined me.
Are you up for that?
Yes.
All right, here we go.
If you were to capture the best communication advice you ever received as
a five to seven word presentation slide title, what would that title be?
Keep pace with the present.
>> I like that. >> Keep pace with the present that's on
master acting teacher Hugin who I didn't work with directly in New York but
I wish I did.
That's a quote from her which speaks to the practices of pace and
delivery of course, but also with how important it is to be right there.
>> I like that there is a flow, there is a rhythm to communication and
keeping pace with that, can really help accentuate what's going on and
can help you really connect and direct what's going on in the interaction.
So I appreciate that advice.
I'll be curious to hear your answer for
this who is a communicator that you admire and why?
>> Acting Professor Kay Kostopoulos can take any non-actor In the classroom or
off the street, she can put them in a scene cast them in a scene and
within moments, Matt coach them towards some moment of transcendent
human connection with their scene partner, with the text with the audience.
She does this with a delivery style that is extremely warm and very, very direct.
She commands audiences of hundreds as an actor and a singer but watching her
nurture a non-actor on stage into a moment of truth and growth is really special
her 1000s of students over the years will know what I'm talking about.
>> While the point about warmth being balanced with directness is a true art and
one that we can all work to develop because if you can be direct and
clear in what you're asking for but do so
in a compassionate inviting way that can make a big difference.
What are the first three ingredients that go into a successful communication recipe?
>> Generosity, which is a form of commitment to share your voice and
share the stage amplify other voices courage
to bring your full range to the needs of the present moment and
genuine curiosity not just about your audience are they with you but
insatiable curiosity about the human condition.
>> My goodness well we have to thank you Melissa for your generosity in sharing
insights that you've gained in your life and in the teaching that you do for
courageously standing up for sometimes people whose voices are not heard.
And for being curious in exploring these issues so that we all can benefit.
Thank you so much for what you've shared with us and for what you've taught us.
>> Thank you, Matt
[MUSIC]
>> Thanks for joining us for another episode of Think Fast,
Talk Smart, the podcast.
Produced by Stanford University's Graduate School of Business.
For more information and episodes, visit gsp.stanford.edu or
subscribe to our show wherever you get the podcasts.
Finally find us on social media at Stanford.gsb.