>> Stephen: WELCOME BACK, EVERYBODY.
LET'S SAY HELLO TO OUR FRIEND, MR. JON BATISTE.
HELLO, JON!
>> Jon: HELLO.
WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH YOU?
>> Stephen: CONGRATULATIONS, TWO GRAMMY NOMINATIONS TODAY!
>> Jon: YES, INDEED.
OH, I'M SO GRATEFUL AND THANKFUL THAT THE MUSIC IS CONNECTING
WITH PEOPLE AND ADDING TO PEOPLE'S LIVES.
>> Stephen: WELL BE DESERVED.
YOU AND WORRY WONG.
THAT'S THE NAME OF THAT ALBUM.
>> Jon: "MEDITATIONS."
"MEDICATIONS.
AND "CHRONOLOGY OF A DREAM."
YOU WERE THERE.
>> Stephen: I WAS THERE.
AS A MATTER OF FACT I WAS JUST LISTENING TO THE VERY THOUGHT OF
YOU, YOU AND RACHEL, THIS WEEKEND.
AMAZING.
>> Jon: OH, YES.
>> Stephen: YOU'VE GOT MY VOTE.
>> Jon: HEY, NOW, LET'S GET IT!
COME ON!
>> Stephen: LET'S SWING THIS ONE.
>> Jon: YEAH, YEAH.
>> Sephen: HEY, STICK AROUND, I'M ABOUT TO INTERVIEW BARACK
OBAMA.
I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO LIKE IT.
>> Jon: I HEARD, I HEARD.
I THINK I WILL.
>> Stephen: JON BATISTE, EVERYBODY.
>> Jon: LATER ON.
>> Stephen: THANKS, JON.
FOLKS, YESTERDAY, I HAD THE HONOR TO SIT DOWN WITH OUR 44th
PRESIDENT, BARACK OBAMA, WHOSE NEW BOOK, "A PROMISED LAND," IS
OUT NOW.
JIM?
WELL, PRESIDENT OBAMA, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING ME TODAY.
>> IT IS WONDERFUL TO BE HERE.
THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.
>> Stephen: IT'S GOOD TO SEE YOU.
>> IT IS GOOD-- IT IS GOOD TO BE SEEN.
I'VE BEEN SEEING YOU ON TELEVISION, BUT IT'S GOOD TO SEE
YOU IN PERSON.
>> Stephen: THAT'S NICE.
HOW OLD ARE YOU?
ARE YOU-- ARE YOU-- ARE YOU 18 AND 54?
>> I'M NOT THE DEMOGRAPHIC YOU ARE LOOKING FOR.
>> Stephen: IT DOESN'T COUNT.
I APOLOGIZE, IT DOESN'T COUNT.
>> MICHELLE SAYS HEY.
>> Stephen: GOOD.
>> YOU KNOW SHE LOVES YOU.
>> Stephen: I HAVE REALLY ENJOYED SPENDING TIME WITH HER
OVER THE LAST FOUR YEARS.
>> I KNOW, AND SHE ADORS YOU.
SHE THINKS THE WORLD OF YOU.
I THINK YOU'RE OKAY.
>> Stephen: CAN WE JUST TAKE MOMENT-- I CAN JUST-- AND I WANT
TO TALK.
I JUST WANT TO TAKE A MOMENT TO DRINK YOU IN FOR JUST A MOMENT.
BECAUSE I'M HAVING TO GET USED TO LOOKING AT A PRESIDENT.
( LAUGHING ) AGAIN.
YOU KNOW, I'VE GOTTEN OUT OF-- I'VE GOTTEN OUT OF THE HABIT.
I HAVE TO WARM UP FOR JOE BIDEN.
I DON'T WANT TO PULL ANYTHING WHEN I SEE HIM TAKE THE OATH OF
OFFICE.
YOU HAVE TO EASE ME INTO THIS A LITTLE BIT.
>> JOE'S GOING TO BE AGREEMENT.
>> Stephen: I HAVE NO DOUBT.
>> AND KAMALA IS GOING TO BE GREAT.
THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE BIG CHALLENGES AHEAD, BUT, YOU KNOW,
WE'VE GOT THE POTENTIAL OF RETURNING TO A PRESIDENCY THAT
IS ACTUALLY PAYING ATTENTION AND TRYING TO DO RIGHT BY ALL PEOPLE
AND NOT JUST SOME.
>> Stephen: A LOT OF ANNOUNCEMENTS OF CABINET
POSITIONS OVER THE LAST TWO DAYS?
>> YES, PEOPLE I KNOW.
>> Stephen: GUYS YOU KNOW.
THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF RETURN TO THE SORT OF-- THE STABILITY
AND-- WHAT'S THAT WORD?
COMPETENCY.
( LAUGHS ) OF YOUR EIGHT YEARS.
WHICH IS NOVEL.
WHICH IS AS GOOD AS A VACATION RIGHT NOW, SOMEBODY THAT
ACTUALLY WANTS TO DO THE JOB THEY'RE HIRED TO DO.
THAT'S AN INTERESTING IDEA, ISN'T IT.
>> Stephen: AND HAS EXPERIENCE, AND HAS READ ABOUT
STUFF, AND KNOWS WHERE COUNTRIES ARE.
IT'S GREAT.
>> Stephen: SO, HOW YOU BEEN?
HOW YOU BEEN THE LAST FOUR YEARS?
I HAVEN'T SEEN A LOT OF YOU.
>> NO.
>> Stephen: AND IT'S BEEN KIND OF-- I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE BEEN
PAYING ATTENTION-- IT'S BEEN KIND OF CRAZY OUT HERE.
( LAUGHING ) WE'RE ALL-- WE'RE ALL A LITTLE
TIRED.
THIS IS HOW I WANT TO SIT.
THIS IS MY ACTUAL-- THIS IS AMERICA'S POSTURE.
WE'RE A LITTLE BIT LIKE A BONED FISH RIGHT NOW, AND IT'S ONE OF
THE REASONS WHY IT'S NICE TO SEE YOU.
SO I'M-- >> LISTEN, I'M-- I AM GOOD.
>> Stephen: YEAH.
>> BUT I THINK THAT I-- I AM TYPICAL OF A LOT OF US WHO ARE
LUCKY ENOUGH THAT OUR JOBS HAVEN'T BEEN ENDANGERED, BECAUSE
I WAS ALREADY OUT OF A JOB AS A- AS A CONSEQUENCE OF COVID.
>> Stephen: DO YOU HAVE ANY PROSPECTS?
>> I HAVEN'T HAD ANYBODY IN MY IMMEDIATE FAMILY GET SICK.
YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THE BILLS.
AND, YOU KNOW, SO ON THE ONE HAND, WE'VE HAD OUR GIRLS AT
HOME.
THAT HAS BEEN A COMPLETE JOY FOR US.
I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THEM.
AND THEN, YOU KNOW, THE-- I THINK I'VE USED THIS PHRASE
BEFORE-- THE SHAMBOLIC NATURE OF THE GOVERNMENT RESPONSE,
OBVIOUSLY, HAS BEEN FRUSTRATING.
>> Stephen: ESPECIALLY AFTER YOU LEFT A GAME PLAN.
>> YES.
>> Stephen: FOR THIS VERY SPECIFIC THING.
AND TALKED ABOUT IT BEFORE YOU LEFT.
>> YES, YES.
>> Stephen: WHAT WAS THAT LIKE TO WATCH THIS RESPONSE?
THAT-- THAT'S THE FRUSTRATION.
THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN HARD FOR ANYONE.
I MEAN, YOU SEE EVEN PEOPLE LIKE ANGELA MERKEL WHO IS HERSELF A
SCIENTIST, EXEMPLARY, BUT YOU STILL SEE SOME SPIKES IN
GERMANY.
BUT LET'S TAKE CANADA, WHERE THE DEATH RATE IS 39% OURS PER
CAPITA, RIGHT.
THAT-- THAT'S A MEASURE OF IF WE HAD DONE THE WORK THAT WAS NOT
ROCKET SCIENCE, RIGHT.
WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT INNING VACCINES-- I'M GLAD TO SEE THE
VACCINES COMING ON BOARD.
BUT PRELIMINARILY COMMUNICATING EFFECTIVELY, RESPECTING THE
SCIENCE, NOT UNDERMINING THE LEADING EPIDEMIOLOGIST IN THE
COUNTRY AND SAYING, HE'S AN IDIOT.
YOU KNOW, BEING CONSISTENT IN TERMS OF MASKS AND SOCIAL
DISTANCING, NOT SUGGESTING THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS SOME ACT OF
OPPRESSION BUT RATHER JUST A COMMONNED SENSE THING TO PREVENT
PEOPLE FROM GETTING SICK.
HAD WE JUST TAKEN THOSE STEPS, THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT WE WOULD
HAVE SAVED SOME LIVES.
AND, IRONICALLY, THE ECONOMY WOULD BE BETTER BECAUSE WE WOULD
NOT BE SWINGING BACK AND FORTH IN THE WAYS THAT WE HAVE, AND
PEOPLE WOULD FEEL MORE CONFIDENCE ABOUT MAKING
DAY-TO-DAY DECISIONS ABOUT SHOPPING OR, YOU KNOW, GOING
OUT.
>> Stephen: BESIDES THE OBVIOUS NATURE OF THE
RESPONSIBLE THING TO DO.
>> YES.
>> Stephen: AND IS THE ECONOMICALLY VITAL THING TO DO,
ARE YOU SURPRISED THAT THEY DID NOT SEE THE POLITICAL ADVANTAGE
OF LOOKING LIKE YOU CARED.
>> YES.
AND I THINK THAT THAT IS A MEASURE OF HOW DETACHED FROM
REALITY AND HOW EMBEDDED IDEOLOGICAL AND CONSPIRATORIAL
THINKING HAS BECOME, WHERE YOU'RE DOING IT EVEN WHEN IT'S
TO YOUR DISADVANTAGE, RIGHT.
IN YOUR ORIGINAL SHOW, RIGHT, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS A-- YOU'RE
SATIRIZING A CERTAIN ATTITUDE.
BUT YOU NEVER THOUGHT THAT FOLKS WOULD ACTUALLY START BELIEVING.
>> Stephen: I DID NOT KNOW I WAS A PROPHET.
I THOUGHT I WAS A COMEDIAN.
>> YOU THOUGHT YOU WERE A COMEDIAN.
BUT NOW YOU'RE-- YOU COULDN'T MAKE UP SOME OF THE STUFF THAT
YOU'RE SEEING.
AND IT IS TO THE DETRIMENT OF THE COUNTRY, BUT AS YOU SAID,
IT'S ALSO-- IT RUNS CONTRARY TO WHAT WOULD HAVE BEEN SMART
POLITICS IF, YOU KNOW, THE REPUBLICANS WANTED TO MAINTAIN
THE WHITE HOUSE.
AND THAT IN SOME WAYS IS MORE TROUBLING BECAUSE NOW IT'S NO
LONGER EVEN STRATEGIC.
IT IS-- YOU'RE DRINKING YOUR OWN KOOL-AID IN A WAY THAT I THINK
IS TROUBLESOME.
AND ONE OF THE BIG CHALLENGES THAT JOE BIDEN IS GOING TO HAVE
IS TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO PUNCTURE THAT, YOU KNOW, INFORMATION
BUBBLE THAT-- NOT JUST REPUBLICAN OFFICIALS, BUT A
SIZABLE PORTION OF VOTERS ARE IN RIGHT NOW.
>> Stephen: THAT GETS YOU TO A QUESTION THAT'S BURIED DEEP IN
THESE PAGES RIGHT HERE, BUT IT COULD BE THE ONLY QUESTION I
ASKED YOU UPON.
IF I ONLY HAD ONE QUESTION TO ASK YOU RIGHT NOW IT WOULD BE,
"WHAT HAPPENS NOW?" WHAT THE HELL HAPPENS NOW WHEN
YOU HAVE HALF OR 70% OF THE REPUBLICANS, SO MAYBE ABOUT 40%
OF THE PUBLIC THINK THAT JOE BIDEN WON BY CHEATING, AND THEY
BELIEVE THAT ALL THESE FANTASIES BEING PROMULGATED ABOUT
DEMOCRATIC CABALS THAT SEEM TO BE PULLING THE STRINGS IN
STATES, DEMOCRAT OR REPUBLICAN, ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES.
HOW DO YOU THEN SPEAK TO THOSE PEOPLE, EVEN IF YOU ARE SOMEONE
LIKE JOE BIDEN WHO'S CAPABLE, BELIEVES IN A GOVERNMENT DOING
THE JOB TO SERVE THE PEOPLE, AND IS EMPATHETIC TO THE CONCERNS
AND NEEDS OF THE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T VOTE FOR HIM-- AND WE'LL
GET TO EVENTUALLY.
PART OF WHAT I THINK IS EXTRAORDINARY ABOUT WHAT WE'RE
ABOUT TO GO THROUGH IS YOU KNOW THAT JOE BIDEN ACTUALLY DOES
CARE ABOUT THE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T VOTE FOR HIM.
>> YEAH.
>> Stephen: AND WHY THEY DIDN'T AND WHAT THEY THINK.
HOW DOES HE REACH THOSE PEOPLE?
>> WELL, LOOK, I THINK HE'S IN A GOOD POSITION TO MAKE THE
EFFORT.
THE FACT THAT HE WON IS INDICATIVE OF THE MESSAGE HE
SENT OF WANTING TO UNIFY THE COUNTRY.
I DO THINK PEOPLE ARE EXHAUSTED BY JUST THIS KNOW--, YOU KNOW,
WORLD WRESTLING FEDERATION CONSTANT CAGE MATCH.
AND PEOPLE JUST WANT TO FEEL AS IF A DAY PASSES WITHOUT IT BEING
DOMINATED BY SOMETHING CRAZY COMING OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE.
>> Stephen: THAT PHOTO OPPORTUNITY AFTER Y'ALL HAD HAD
YOUR CONVERSATION IN THE OVAL OFFICE-- AND I DON'T WANT TO
SPEN A LOT OF TIME.
I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT THE PRESIDENT A LOT FOR FOUR YEARS,
AND I'VE HAD MY FILL.
BUT THAT I WAS A CHILLING MOMENT FOR ME TO WATCH BECAUSE I
PERCEIVED FOR THAT MOMENT THE DIGNITY OF THE OFFICE, OR RATHER
THE TRAPPINGS OF DIGNITY AND STATUS THAT FALLS UPON-- RIGHTLY
FALLS UPON THE PERSON WHO HOLDS THAT OFFICE IN THAT MOMENT.
AND I SAW THE WAY-- OR RATHER I HAD AN EMOTIONAL FLASH OF ALL
THE WAYS THAT COULD BE ABUSED OVER THE NEXT FOUR YEARS.
WERE YOU HAVING A SIMILAR FEELING IN THAT MOMENT?
>> YEAH, IT WAS A CONCERN.
>> Stephen: AND WERE THOSE CONCERNS BORNE OUT OVER THE NEXT
FOUR YEARS?
>> EXCEEDED.
>> Stephen: THANK YOU.
MR. PRESIDENT, WE HAVE TO TAKE A QUICK BREAK, BUT STICK AROUND
EVERYBODY, WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK WITH PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA.