Shapiro: One of the tough things I would suggest
that we face up to
is that you have a lot more control
over your own behavior and the decisions you make
than the supposedly
widespread unconscious bias of people you've never met.
Student: Unconscious bias is a concept well-documented
in psychological studies,
which is basically that people associate negative things
with people of color and positive things with whites.
Given that that is true,
how does white privilege not exist?
Shapiro: Okay, so you're asking about unconscious bias.
I apologize because it's kind of echoey.
But the question was,
if there is unconscious bias,
just to repeat it so I'm making sure I get it right.
If there's unconscious bias,
how does white privilege not exist?
Student: The question is
given that there is unconscious bias,
how does white privilege not exist?
Shapiro: Number one.
When I speak about white privilege,
I'm speaking specifically about behavior.
There've been no studies,
and really I've looked at these studies,
the connection between what they call implicit bias,
this is their favorite phrase now,
implicit bias, unconscious bias, and bias behavior
has yet to be proven at any level
that is even remotely necessary
to be used in, for example, a courtroom,
which is why it's never been used in a courtroom.
It is also true that there is no way,
there really isn't, there's been no proven way
to alleviate what they call unconscious bias.
Which means that we're ghost hunting.
What I would suggest
is that if there is unconscious bias,
and I'll acknowledge the possibility or the reality
of unconscious bias.
If there is,
I don't care about what's in people's heads
so much as what they do.
If you point me to a racist behavior...
Don't worry.
I'll let you respond.
If you point me to a racist behavior,
I'm happy to stand alongside you and protest it.
What I can't do is protest about things in people's head
that I don't know about
because I'm not a mind reader.
Student: Okay. So that's a really interesting response.
And to that I have two questions.
Firstly, what I've heard you say is that
the way people think doesn't affect their behavior.
That's the first thing you've said.
I'm really curious if you can give me
another example of a thought that somebody has
which doesn't affect their behavior.
Do people who support Trump not vote for him?
I'm very curious about that.
The second thing that I want to ask
is that if it's something that it's hard to fix,
does it mean we shouldn't do anything about it?
You said, 'Oh, I don't know if we can change
how people think.'
Does that mean we shouldn't try?
Shapiro: First of all, not a great impression.
But beyond that.
[Audience laughter]
[Audience applause]
My voice isn't that low.
But beyond that,
as far as the first question,
which is do people have thoughts
that don't manifest in behavior?
Yes. All the time.
Student: For instance?
Student: For instance, every thought that you have about
walking up here and strangling me right now.
Student: I wasn't actually thinking about strangling you.
Shaprio: I assume we have thoughts all the time
that don't manifest in behavior,
and this is true every single day.
We consider thoughts that cross our minds.
The problem with unconscious bias
is the idea is you don't even know
that you're having the thought.
How can you stop it
if you don't even know that you're having it?
But then we should be able to gauge the unconscious bias
and its impact on behavior.
That's why it's unconscious bias
as opposed to conscious bias.
I think the idea behind unconscious bias
is that it's not even a ghost.
It's a ghost of a ghost
because you don't even know you're having the thought.
The whole idea behind diversity training
is the idea that you can retrain people
to stop their chain of thoughts
so that it doesn't manifest in behavior.
I don't think that every thought manifests in behavior.
If it did, then
every time a man saw a good looking woman
walk down the street,
a straight man saw a good looking woman down the street,
we'd have a real mess on our hands.
[Audience laughter]
The second question
was a little too broad for me to respond to,
which is just because something is tough,
don't we have to face up to it?
Yes. We have to face up to tough things all the time.
And one of the tough things
I would suggest that we face up to
is that you have a lot more control over your own behavior
and the decisions you make
than the supposedly widespread unconscious bias of people
you've never met.
[Audience applause]