>> Joe Biden's wife, Jill Biden, was recently speaking to NPR, and she was asked some tough
questions, to NPR's credit.
One of those questions had to do with Biden's handling of the Anita Hill hearings.
Anita Hill famously accused Justice Clarence Thomas of sexual harassment.
And the way that whole hearing went down and the way the all-male senators questioned her
is now weighing heavily on Biden's campaign to be president.
And so of course, they're gonna get questions about it.
And what Jill Biden had to say, in my opinion, was problematic.
Take a look.
>> Well, I watched the hearings like most other Americans and so I mean, Joe said, as
I did, we believed Anita Hill.
He voted against Clarence Thomas.
I mean, he's called Anita Hill, they've spoken, he apologized for the way the hearings were
run, and so now it's kind of, it's time to move on.
>> There is one person who gets to decide when it's time to move on, and that one person
is Anita Hill, period.
Joe Biden's wife doesn't get to decide that.
Joe Biden doesn't get to decide that.
And this whole thing about he called her and apologized, yeah, he called her and apologized
after he got criticized for not calling her directly and apologizing to her directly after
he had already announced that he was gonna run.
That's an issue, right?
>> Yeah, I wanna tag on to the to first thing that you said though that Anita Hill is the
only person who should be able to decide whether we should move on.
But also right there in her answer, she said, we believed Anita Hill.
I believed her, he believed her, we believed her.
This man is still a sitting Supreme Court Justice.
If you believe that he sexually harassed an employee, and he is a Justice in the highest
court in our lands, no one should ever move on.
And you cannot have those two things come of your mouth.
You cannot say this man is in charge of all the laws in our land, and I think he's a sexually
harasser.
Down to the point to where I believe her, so I think he put a pubic hair on her can
of Coca-Cola.
But we should move on.
>> Right.
>> That is the most ridiculous thing I've heard all day.
>> I believe her when she alleges that he referenced porn and male genitalia, made her
uncomfortable in the workplace over and over again.
I believe her, but I think it's time to move on.
I mean that is is just-
>> But it's also the first time society is even dealing with this thing.
We didn't really, they didn't really talk about it at the time of the trial.
There wasn't this huge uproar of like, look at the way that Anita Hill was attacked.
She was almost put on the defense in her own hearing.
And so it's like, well, move on.
We just started.
>> That's such a great.
>> This conversation literally started concerning Biden's potential presidency, and now all
of a sudden saying move on is just like so premature for a cycle that hasn't been able
to evolve for a woman who hasn't fully been able to heal.
I mean, she said that she's never been satisfied with the way he's apologized.
So it's interesting.
I think that's a technique that Donald Trump has brought into American politics very much
is people saying not apologizing and not dealing with it.
And then all of a sudden saying well, I mean, how are you still talking about that?
How could you?
>> So what's just so bizarre to me, just even watching this whole, all these 2020 nominees
and all who have made mistakes in their past is that, think about this.
When you're a kid and you hate your brother or something and your mom says apologize,
everybody in the room knows you're not sorry.
But to move on, you gotta just say it.
>> Yeah, keeps getting out of the way.
>> Why aren't they just choosing to fake it?
Instead, they're choosing to double down on decisions that everybody around them is saying
hey, this is bad.
And instead of just faking a sorry and moving on, they're not.
>> Well- >> That's so weird to me.
Just on a, it's just be evil I guess, I don't know.
>> I like that you brought that up.
I like that you brought that up because you're right in that every interview that I've seen
so far where Biden is asked about this, he gets very defensive
>> Yeah.
>> Right.
>> And he refuses to take ownership, and I wanna provide my favorite example of this.
This was a fairly recent interview that Biden did.
And here's what he had to say about his handling of the Anita Hill hearings, take a look.
>> I wish I could have done more to prevent those questions and the way they asked them.
I hope my colleagues learned from that, learn from that.
My biggest regret was I didn't know how I could shut you off, as you were a senator,
and you're attacking Anita Hill's character.
Under the Senate rules, I can't gavel you down and say you can't ask that question,
although I tried.
And so what happened was she got victimized again during the process.
>> It seems like you get it now versus back in 91.
>> I think I got it in 91.
I don't think it, well, people have their own opinion.
>> Okay, so he says I tried to protect her from those inappropriate questions.
Except you didn't.
I mean, the Internet exists and so does this tape.
>> It is appropriate to ask Professor Hill anything any member wishes to ask her to plumb
the depths of her credibility.
>> Was that Biden trying to prevent the Senate Judiciary Committee from asking inappropriate
questions?
I mean, that was a strong attempt in protecting her, really, come on.
>> I mean, one of the things that I like about this country, and I really do, is that we
have a sin, apology, forgiveness cycle that exists.
And I think what he and Jill are trying to do is truncate that cycle to sin and forgiveness
without the apology.
>> And I don't think it works like that, and I do think that we should have a better system
actually, for forgiving people, I think we need that.
I think we're going to find that as more and more of people's foibles come out into the
open.
And that's important, especially with the election coming up.
But you have to do that middle part of apologizing.
>> I totally agree, I totally agree if it's a genuine apology.
People grow, people change.
They progress.
And there's no point in having apologies, unless we're willing to be open minded and
accept people for who they are now, right?
But the way that they've handled this and their defensiveness and refusal to take real
ownership of what really happened is, it puts people off.
And I don't agree with it, right?
>> Yeah.
>> You gotta take responsiblity.
>> You can also say something about apologizing and forgiveness.
I think that as long as what you did didn't put you in jail or death, that forgiveness
is subjective.
Cuz what often happens that people who are saying, hey you, all you victims, you need
to learn how to forgive.
They're just trying to get these really privileged positions.
So nobody's saying he should never work, he should never have a family.
People are saying this mistake was big enough that you shouldn't be the leader of the free
world.
>> Mm-hm.
>> That's a big deal.
>> Right.
>> Nobody's saying, there's a whole bunch of stuff down the line that you're stlil able
to do.
>> And when you think of it, though- >> I know.
>> You know what I mean?
It's like eople who wanna be back on TV again.
There are a whole bunch of jobs that you can do.
And those openings, it's fair for them to go to all of these people who have never done
that.
>> And I- >> You know what I mean?
>> I don't mean to compare Biden to Kavanaugh, but it does remind me of the sense of entitlement
that we saw from Kavanaugh during his hearings, right?
>> Right.
>> Where he felt entitled to becoming a Supreme Court justice.
>> Yeah.
>> As if that job had his name on it since the day he was born, and that sense of entitlement
should turn off every American, right?
Every American who's had to work hard to get to where they are in their lives.
That was a job interview for Kavanaugh.
It was not a moment for him to claim that it was something he's entitled to-
>> Death penalty hearing.
>> Right.
>> If people who defended him, I mean I think you said it so perfectly.
The people who defended him said it feels like he's on trial.
No, he's not on trial, he's at a job interview, and as an applicant he made a terrible applicant
to be in the highest court in the land.
As you said, that doesn't mean he never gets to work again.
>> No.
>> I think this is tricky when there's someone kind of at a lower level who gets canceled,
and we have to wrestle with that and say like, well, what are we saying?
Should this person never work again?
Should they do- >> But that never happens.
>> But that, yeah.
>> These people still run banks.
>> Right.
>> They're still lawyers, they're still police officers.
If always it's somebody who wants to be on TV again, somebody who wants to be famous
comedian again, somebody who wants to be a singer or rapper again.
Somebody who wants to be a Supreme Court justice, somebody who wants to be a president saying
hey, maybe you don't get to play in the NBA anymore.
>> Yeah.
>> But you can still coach little league.
And I know those are two different sports, I'm better than that.