greetings comic lovers and welcome back to casually comics the channel where we chat
all things comics reviews of comics new and old to history to anecdotes to really wherever our
whims take us Lian Harper lives science news that has been met with a variety of reactions from
elation to yay do i need to start reading dc again justice really anne but also there has been yay
but not like this to no thank you to who so let's talk who is Lian Harper how slash why slash where
did she return and why are some people ecstatic about it and some less so we have a mission today
questions to answer but before we get started i'm Sasha and if you're enjoying this content you know
what to do hit that like button hit the subscribe button join us in this comic book journey if
you're feeling so inclined hit that join button down there next to the subscribe button to help
us produce more content and just follow some more whims so we can answer even more random comic book
questions like this one it's Lian time Lian Harper debuted in 1986 and the new teen titans number 21
this is from volume 2. she was created by marv wolfman and eduardo barreto volume 2 means this
is the second time they launched the new teen titans the first was in 1980 the second in 1984.
two runs now if one does a quick curse research on Lian she doesn't seem to be too big of a deal
but that's where wikis and blurbs online can be deceiving Lian Harper wood is the daughter of Roy
Harper former green arrow sidekick speedy then arsenal sometimes red arrow mostly arsenal and
her mother was a villainous cheshire the cover of the issue where she first appears is hyping
this up hard who is the father of cheshire's child only a question mark that warranted an
bang in my opinion also the question is answered instantly on the first page there is build up in
the issues prior boy you don't know how long i've waited for this moment you fathered our child then
left me only later did i learn you worked for your government that you were assigned to track me down
i didn't turn you in jade i couldn't i loved you even though i didn't want to i never knew about
a child you never told me yes they're spilling tea on both sides this issue is a really solid one and
works through a lot of things like both characters feeling their alternate lives have kept them apart
shade going from not even wanting Roy to see his daughter to eventually letting him see her her
name is Lian the graceful willow this for a time would be the only Lian sighting but roy wanted to
see his daughter on her first birthday no matter what so that truck that's back back back back'n
up he was also concerned about his daughter being raised by jade while she's still living her life
as an assassin action comics weekly is where Roy and nightwing confront cheshire with 618
from 1988 being the conclusion that sees Roy and Lian reunited and Roy ends up assuming custody of
Lian which he's thrilled with and jade ultimately comes to feel is better as well though the two
have a cordial enough relationship of course they're on opposite sides Lian vanishes for
quite a bit after that reappearing in batman plus arsenal in 1997. aside from the arsenal mini from
1998 which really should have made jade question whether leaving Lian with Roy was a good idea the
series where much of the fondness for Lian can be traced back to is from 1999's titans or rather the
titans it's dc you gotta have that determiner in there the titans is not quite as fondly remembered
as the new teen titans from the 80s but in many ways this series introduced a lot of lasting for
a time elements one of those was the fostering of Lian as a secure supporting character during that
series she grew from being a prop or plot point for her father or mother in terms of their growth
and instead began to be a character in her own right she had plots that dealt specifically with
her such as getting nannies and who was looking after her and her little child observations about
her environment one of her nannies was actually rose wilson aka ravager there was a whole really
solid good rose arc before they dived hard until she's gonna go mad like her father and gouge your
own eye out Lian came to feel like a part of the titans in a manner that echoed mascots of
times past she was a cute kid and people didn't mind having her around she added an element of
humanity for the proceedings of course this was before the era where civilian side characters
fell out of favor however whether or not one had strong feelings about her most remembered
her fondly from there she would be used sparingly and most likely she wouldn't have quite as firm
and devote a following were not for how she was killed yes killed where cry for justice there is
a lot of complaints against this series but this one the death of Lian could arguably be viewed as
the biggest this series has come up before on this channel for that threesome moment that launched a
battle between series author James Robinson and birds of prey author Gail Simone cry for justice
was a seven issue mini-series released in 2009 surrounding the idea that after final crisis
heroes needed to be more proactive you know the minority report argument or the later infamous
civil war ii argument over at marvel Lian died in the final issue of this mini killed when part
of star city was destroyed and it's devastating and just felt gratuitous and vicious it was a
catalyst for character moments that could easily have been achieved without it for example green
arrow killing Prometheus or Roy relapsing it led to quite a bit of outrage and questions about the
medium of comics in general were they becoming too brutal too harsh where had the fun gone and to add
insult to injury Lian stayed dead while many characters walked off an explosion like another
Tuesday Lian seemed gone for good she appeared again in convergence but most of those were just
stories to showcase elements of the pre-new 52 status quo which had begun in 2011 that fans had
missed in rebirth at the start of it there was no sign of her and she still seemed to be lost
and fans still asked where's Lian? well those who knew of her for it must be noted that at
this point much time had passed some felt the passion over her death and the injustice
of it lessened or many were now entering comics at these new jumping on points who were unaware
of her or didn't have a strong attachment to this past cannon so it was a surprise when Lian Harper
suddenly reappeared and in such a way that she'd actually been there before for a little while but
it just hadn't been established who she was so let's first hop into our in-canon reveal which
is upon us courtesy of dark knight's death metal which ran from 2020 to early 2021 in it wonder
woman brought about the omniverse a space where all cannons exist it's not clear if everything
is in continuity though which is basically a get out of jail free card slash pick which cans you
want to work with choose what you want but don't think about too hard because there are certain
events that can't possibly coincide they say that it means everything matters with some counter so
nothing does it's still unfolding we'll see where this experiment goes time recording maybe it'll
end up like zero hour and hyper time that was the thing that happened so Lian was officially named
in dc festival of heroes the Asian superhero celebration won her story was called masks and
was written by Ram V without by Audrey Mok the colors were by Jordie Bellaire who is
everywhere we've seen her work multiple times on this channel the story follows a character named
Shoes she doesn't remember much of her childhood what she does have is a recurring dream of a woman
in a Cheshire mask this woman carries hers with a church and leaves her on the steps
these days i ask myself what kind of person she was behind the mask is that who i'm supposed to
be shoes lives in alleytown the portion of gotham protected by catwoman she decides to don a mask
and try her hand at crime fighting it does not go well and she ends up being saved by catwoman
who it is revealed she has a personal relationship with only it's not too much of a reveal if you've
been following catwoman and future state more on that in a minute is that your mask it was just a
stupid idea selena unmasks to talk to shoes about finding herself and to not be in such a hurry to
grow up she's taken her under her wing as she has some of the orphans in the area the story ends on
the sun rising and the promise of more cheshire cat and the catwoman comic she is fully named as
Lian Harper in the bios at the story's end where her first appearance is given as catwoman 25 which
is the first appearance of the shoe's character who we now see become cheshire cat who is a
part of Selina's crew during the train heist and future state which seems to be the direction that
dc comics is headed at the time of this recording so now to the reactions some were thrilled to see
Lian alive and well and express the sentiment of finally took you long enough however it was
all met with unquestioning positivity some were not thrilled at what they felt was missing the
opportunity to see Lian grow up or to have her brought back again as a child similar to how many
were displeased with the aging up of jon kent some felt it was a missed opportunity or messed up the
already skewed age scales past a point that they could suspend this belief while others felt more
of a just go with it accept it let people have nice things both are just different ways to enjoy
things and for those invested in interconnected canon these questions make sense and will still be
asked in spite of the omniverse and the omnivore should not be used as a way to silence questions
they are still there regardless of what birth we're in others aren't thrilled at them taking
leanne down the anti-hero path as leanne was a girl raised by heroes surrounded by them and
there were many stories to explore there and while potentially her striking on a path similar to her
mother's could be an interesting plotline some thought of the way it was introduced here was
cliche or well-trodden territory that didn't need to be explored again and that there's potentially
something more interesting to be done with her original backstory so there are some
who are waiting to celebrate till they see what happens if it's bad please take it back we've got
disappointment at home it must be noted that shoes slash cheshire cat can engender and already does
have a separate fan base who are not connected to her passes Lian or are not connected to it outside
of a tangential or referential way so when you became a fan slash your breath of knowledge and
investment in past lore can and will impact how you feel about this reveal heck you could be an
old school fan prefer this different strokes for different folks but that is the return of Lian
in a nutshell are you excited about the return of Lian do you like shoes as a character these
nicknames for the alleytown kids Shoes Skidmark please some better names for the alleytown kids
again how do you feel about things seemingly hurtling towards future state tell me everything
down below while you're down there please do all the Youtube things like share comment subscribe
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to spend discussing comics with me i always appreciate and i will see you again soon bye