already got some good news and I have some bad news about the Mac Pro yes the
Apple silicon Mac Pro that apple is working on to fight AMD and Intel and we
got the news from Mark German the most prominent leaker out there and he says
the all-new Mac Pro is in testing yes it's still in testing it is coming but
we have a really bad downside the M2 extreme chip is likely canceled within
the article Mark Urban was saying that apple had plans for the Mac Pro to come
with two configurations one with an M2 Ultra which is the next version of the
current M1 Ultra we have in the Mac Studio and then a brand new double M2
Ultra that he dubbed the M2 extreme and the downside is that the company Apple
has likely scrapped that higher end configuration mostly because of the
complexity and cost of producing a processor that is essentially four M2
Max chips fused together which I'll show you what that's going to look like or
what that could have looked like later in the video but what makes the
cancellation of the M2 extreme so sad is because Mark German has been hinting at
this awesome chip for months even years way back in October 18th of 2021 he said
that the new Mac Pro is expected to come in at least two variations two times and
four times the number of CPU and GPU cores as the M1 Max and originally that
was 40 CPU cores and 128 GPU cores on the high end and to show you guys what
that would look like I've actually been making videos for the past few months or
even longer showing what that's going to look like and check this out from Ta
tech15 on Twitter you essentially have the M2 Max chip which in this new
generation it could look something like this and the main idea behind this is
that Apple could actually bin the smaller M2 Max dies and just pick out
the best ones and then combine them and then whatever doesn't do as well they
can just put into the lower end MacBook Pro and MAC machines to save money and
the worst part about all of this going on with the M2 extreme ship cancellation
is that we even had Majin Buu sharing different leaks and resources saying
that there would be extra DZ Excel sub memory controllers which is basically
Apple's Ultra Fusion connector that they introduced in the M1 Ultra chip that
combines two dies together they would essentially have multiple variations of
this to combine four dice together like you could see in this actual leak from
one of magic Boo's sources this is supposed to be called the Red Fern
processor and these are the extra Ultra Fusion connectors and you can see a
little diagram right here in the corner of the four dies and all of the
connections so we actually had real leaks of Apple working on a chip like
this but apparently it's now canceled now I don't know if you remember this or
not but I actually interviewed Mark German way back in July and he let me
know that Apple was working on an M1 Mac Pro but they actually delayed it until
the M2 version and within the inner he said that it would not be coming out
this year it would be delayed until 2023 maybe even as late as the summer and so
here we are in December and Apple has missed their two-year goal for the Apple
silicon transition which of course really sucks and now here we are with
even the M2 extreme chip getting canceled and now let me get into
explaining why that is such a huge deal well the M2 extreme ship was supposed to
be a symbol of the arm chip being ready to take over the PC industry it was
supposed to prove itself as something that can destroy the very best x86
Powerhouse chips like the thread rippers from AMD or the best xeons from Intel
that was why we were so excited about the Mac Pro and let me remind you guys I
actually did some some calculations on the multi-core CPU score of the M2
extreme the theoretical M2 extreme look at this 48
000 points beating out the threadripper
3990x and the Intel Xeon 3175x by a long shot I even showed you
guys some scores of these top end AMD epic processor not even threadripper
epic and it's right there scoring the same as those highest end chips
basically the highest scores ever and those are of course overclocked now my
Twitter take on this is that a non-xtreme M2 base chip Mac Pro will be
extremely uninteresting of course because we already have the M1 Ultra in
the Mac Studio a small machine so getting that same upgraded M2 Ultra
would be so disappointing in the Mac Pro because we already know the tech behind
it it'll just be an upgrade so Apple would have to discontinue the Mac Studio
and make the M2 Ultra chip exclusive in the Mac Pro now going back to the
Bloomberg article from Mark German he suggested that maybe it's because it's
just going to be too expensive with the M2 extreme version of Mac Pro probably
costing at least ten thousand dollars without any other upgrades now of course
that's very expensive but it actually disagree with that I think that the
price doesn't really matter that much because Apple allowed the current Intel
Mac Pro to be configured to over fifty thousand dollars and they didn't really
seem to care about the price being too high so instead I think that apple is
actually hitting some sort of other problems with this M2 extreme chip and
that is why they are canceling it and that's where we get into the next
section of why apple is canceling it let me explain my take is that it could be
the GPU scaling issues that we discussed in the past with the M1 family of chips
mostly starting with with the M1 Max where we started to see the GPU not
scale that well and then of course with the M1 Ultra chip it got much much worse
which I'm going to show you in just a second and my take is that if the M2
Chip is based on the same node as the M1 then the issues won't be resolved we
would need fully redesigned three nanometer cores which would fix the
scaling issues let me show you guys the 64 core GPU M1 Ultra now look at these
charts look at how bad the scaling is going up from 48 cores to 64. you barely
get any performance gain even worse look at this chart between the 48 and the 64
barely any difference at all and then even worse in our 8K Rod to 4K hvc
torture test it's almost the same speed for these two that is just embarrassing
so we ended up looking at the throttling and you can see how much the 64 core M1
Ultra throttles you can see that it throttles from 1255 to
752 throttles like crazy but here is the main thing you have to realize the
throttling actually wasn't from overheating or anything like that
because you can see that the 64 core M1 Ultra was actually the coolest out of
all of them 57 degrees Celsius so it had nothing to do with heat something else
was throttling the system and I believe it's a flaw with the M1 family of chips
and I don't know if you remember this but I release an exclusive thread on
Twitter about the design limitation that was overlooked by Apple Engineers when
they started working on the chips five to seven years ago and that was a
specific bottleneck in terms of the tlb or the certain kind of buffering cash
and to sum up this entire thread if an app isn't properly redesigned and
Rewritten to support apple silicon with metal like fully Rewritten it nicely
then it's not going to take advantage of the architecture and the GPU memory
system and what happens that you have a lot of stalled GPU thread groups which
causes the really bad scaling so basically the idea of how to fix this
scaling issue was that Future mship Families would have a big increase in
the tlb to solve this problem since developers are likely to be slow in
optimizing their apps and the Hope was that the M2 family of chips including
the M2 Ultra and M2 extreme would fix those issues but here is where we run
into a little bit of a problem I believe that the M2 Chip is a stop Gap chip that
I've been trying to say for a long time showing you guys that the M2 Chip is
based on the a15 cores and it's basically the smallest year over year
Improvement in geekbench and single core multi-core for basically years and I
showed you guys reviews from places like notebook checks showing that you have to
push 27 more power into the M2 Chip to get 12 more multi-core CPU performance
and then even Mark German during my interview with him said that the M2 is a
stop Gap chip word for word from the mouth of Mark German himself so the idea
is if the M2 Chip is really a stopgap chip a tuned up M1 and if the rest of
the M2 Chip family including the mg Pro M2 Max M2 Ultra theoretical M2 extreme
if that was also based on the same design language as the M1 then the
theoretical M2 extreme would have had much worse scaling than the ultra and
that scaling could have been so bad that it would be embarrassing to release that
4 die M2 extreme chip at such a high cost especially since we would be there
testing it and showing off the Bad scaling and telling you guys do not
upgrade to the new disappointing M2 extreme chip so that is my theory on why
apple is actually scrapping that high-end chip because the scaling is
absolutely terrible and they can't get a lot of performance out of it and there'd
be cases where the M2 Ultra and M2 extreme would not have that big of a
difference which is a massive problem because it would be a lot more expensive
and that right there bad scaling is my reason for why I think apple is
scrapping the M2 extreme chip in the Mac Pro and only giving us the M2 Ultra
which is of course very very disappointing and we might have to wait
until the M3 family which fixes those scaling issues before we see the M3
extreme but in the meantime I just hope we get an iMac Pro with the the M2 Max
ship hopefully that's a good machine because now I'm not really that excited
for the Mac Pro anymore if you disagree with me let me know down in the comments
below and if you're looking for a good Mac right now the M2 MacBook Air is a
pretty good one so check it out using the YouTube product tagging feature
thanks for watching check out one of those two videos right there and we'll
see you in the next video [Music]