Immunization - vaccines have been one of the greatest public health discoveries.
In fact, one of the reasons why the lifespan increased so much…
Sadhguru: Yes, definitely.
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: … is because of the availability of vaccines.
We used to lose you know…
Half the number of children who were born used to die
of pneumonia, diarrhea and other infections.
Today that mortality has been brought down significantly, thanks to vaccines but also
to antibiotics.
But now suddenly we are seeing a different trend (Sadhguru laughs).
If you look at the news, every day you hear about measles outbreaks
not in some remote corner of Africa but in France, in Germany, in Ukraine, in the
United States.
In fact, the President of the United States and most of the Mayors and Governors
have been speaking up about the importance of immunization.
Because if you take a disease like measles,
it's not enough for me to vaccinate my child and hope that it will be protected.
You need what is called “herd immunity” and to get herd immunity,
you need about ninety - ninety-five percent of the children in that community to be vaccinated.
So, an individual action –
a parent decides my child does not need a vaccine
because of whatever belief. It's sometimes religious,
but very often it's not religious.
And a recent survey just came out a few days ago, showed that
people believed in the safety of vaccines ninety-five percent and above in Asia and
Africa
but only seventy percent in Western Europe and even less in Eastern Europe;
only fifty percent of people… adults believe that vaccines are safe.
So there's… this is beyond logic, it's beyond science, it's beyond any factual information
that we give to people doesn't seem to be working.
And yet, it impacts many others.
You don't vaccinate your child but the child who gets measles and dies may be somebody
else's child.
And so I think it comes back to what you were saying about - it's not just yourself,
we need to think about…
you need to think about the humanity, community, society and most importantly, the planet,
where we live
and how we can modulate those actions.
Sadhguru: This is a phenomena that we must observe historically or within families or
individuals.
Human beings get tired of well-being; they want some trouble (Laughter).
They like trouble, you know (Applause)?
They like it really.
See, America spent billions and billions of dollars to build highways.
But now everybody buys off-road vehicles because people like some trouble.
Too much order creates a certain level of irritation
in the human being. He wants little chaos.
They must visit India (Laughter).
So this campaign is gaining momentum in… particularly in California, big time.
A whole lot of parents coming to me and asking this, I’m telling them, “Don't
be a fool.”
Because when you find your child is either crippled with polio or something else…
I remember this very well – when I was in school,
there were four children in my school…
I never stayed in one school for too long (Laughter).
So I was there maximum two years, three years in any given school - three was the maximum.
So, in that high school, where there was…
I was in one school for three years, in high school, there were four polio-affected boys
-
three of them boys, one girl - who came to school in what… in a wheelchair.
But many places the wheelchair wouldn't go in those days so they would drag themselves
and go.
Tch, it was so terrible to see them.
But today, even if you go to the remotest village in India,
even if you go to the government schools where we work,
there's not a single polio-affected child. It's fantastic to see that.
So we don't know the value of these things (Applause).
Unfortunately, we get tired of well-being, we want to invite some trouble.
But having said that,
I was talking to some of the parents in California;
they were saying they're being put through some
forty or forty-two different types of vaccines.
They're saying it is causing learning disability, this, that, for all kinds of things.
Maybe in United States- and I don't know what’s the situation in Europe -
maybe they are overdoing it a little bit.
Apart from treating the basic things which were affecting children which would cause
death or cripple…
you know, it would cripple a child,
I think they're attaining to… trying to give vaccine for just about everything (Applause).
This may be affecting!
I'm not a… some kind of a medical expert or something to make a commentary on this.
But from listening to the parents, this is what I gathered.
I don't remember all the things that they said they are giving vaccines for.
I thought some of them were just absurd; some of those illnesses a child can go through,
it's okay.
He catches a flu, if something happens,
it’s all right to go through those things when you're growing up.
But they're giving vaccines for a whole lot of things which is… which may not be necessary,
which today parents are apprehensive - maybe causing learning disability or some other
problem.
It may not be connected, I don't know but this is the fear that is being spread.
But the power and the well-being that vaccines have brought to our lives -
most of us are sitting here because we were vaccinated.
Hello?
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: Small-pox…
Sadhguru: Yes (Applause).
Otherwise we wouldn't be here. Definitely we wouldn't be here, many of us.
So, we should not… See the problem is just this, especially now
because social media and things we either go this (Gestures) extreme or that (Gestures)
extreme.
I feel being the World Health Organization, please look into this, I’m not an expert
but what kind of vaccines they’re giving in…
the spectrum of vaccines they’re giving in United States for example,
if it is too much, I think WHO should tell them “this much
is not needed - this is compulsory, rest is by choice.
”If it's made like that, I think there'll be a
more healthy proportion.
Otherwise, some parents are just not vaccinating their children.
I said, “You must be crazy. You’ll lose your child.
Anytime it can happen; the child goes to school and that may be the end of it.
But out of their… you know, their fear that vaccine is going to damage their brains or
something,
they're going for this kind of decision-making.
I think a clear statement from an organization like WHO would help parents to make a better
choice (Applause).
the
problem has been the “anti-vax campaign.
”Skeptics who have spread many, many…
There are side effects of everything.
Everything has a side effect but one in a million maybe, one in two million.
But they have been blown out of proportion and this gets circulated through social media.
So social media can have both very good benefits but also can propagate falsehoods very rapidly.
And I think one needs to be always a little skeptical
of things that we see on social media and…
and check for ourselves the veracity.
As far as WHO is concerned, we have absolutely very clear-cut guidelines on… on vaccination.
And there is, as I said, very clear guidance both for the public and for practitioners
on which vaccines are absolutely essential for all children.
Sadhguru: Well, I think it needs to be more published…
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: Perhaps it has to be more…
Sadhguru: Or if you give such knowledge to us, we will publish.
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: That will be wonderful.
Sadhguru: Because when I spoke to the parents, their concerns were genuine.
They are not… tch.
They are not those flaky, New Agey types.
They are genuinely…
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: Hmm… Well-educated.
Sadhguru:…concerned that this may affect their children.
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: You're right.
I think the messaging probably needs to be done through people whom they believe.
And some people believe the doctors but may… maybe they also like to hear it from… from
others.
So...
Sadhguru: If there is credible scientific information…
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: Credible - yes.
Sadhguru: And also clearly what is a must and what is choice…
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: What is a option.
Sadhguru: …if that is created, I think it'll be good.
Dr. Soumya Swaminathan: Thank you very much for this opportunity. Namaskar.
Sadhguru: Thank you.
Thank you (Applause)…