has been launched for women's writing on
politics and economics it's backed by
the New Statesman magazine and the
publishers farrago now I coincides with
the 20th anniversary of the Bailey's
prize for women's literature formerly
known as the orange price when I'm
joined now by helen lewis the deputy
editor of the New Statesman I one of the
judges for the new award of course
sender and the line is we call it by the
Conservative MP and best-selling author
Nadine Dorries and funny enough her
latest novel is today let's stay with
you Nadine Oh or what do you think then
about the overall issue before we
discuss the specifics of gender specific
women's specific book awards well I
think it's fantastic because you know
women outsell men by 7230 and
traditionally over time and has never
been recognized it's never been
acknowledged and you know we have the
Bailey's prize which i think is
celebrating their 20th anniversary this
year if i'm not wrong and i think and we
need more of it but what i would buy
only concerned with the New Statesman is
this really and that's that women don't
need another layer of prejudice because
they they experience it every day and
the New Statesman does have a brand and
it is a very left-wing brand and I just
hope that when they they judge and they
critique and look at the the entries for
their prizes that they leave their
politics at the front door and judge
every woman on her own marriage and not
what her political beliefs are well
we'll do that straight away then Helen
so it's not going down there a left-wing
tinder who you choose I don't think it
will do because it's about politics and
economics and I think it's about the
quality of the analysis and it's
possible to bring a very right-wing
analysis to a measure of those and do it
incredibly skillful in there's
definitely there's always been a place
for that in the New Statesman we've
always seen ourselves as being a kind of
quite a pluralistic place for debate so
there won't be a prejudice against
right-wing people but they have to write
as well as left-wing people there are
some questions being asked have been
looking on social media about it in
particular from women about it being
sponsored by baileys Bailey's you know
using it is a as a marketing attempt to
target the drink specifically at women a
Bailey's for the lady gun
I think if Bailey want to give money to
sponsor a fiction prize I can't imagine
they're doing that out of pure altruism
I don't think the world is awash with
with companies things at pure altruism
but you have to say is that worth the
trade-off if they decide that they want
to market to women I think that's
perfectly legitimate thing to do they're
going to stump up the money for it I
don't really see the problem with that
ok Nadine do you feel though on this
issue of politics and economics that
women just aren't taken seriously and
this of course some relates directly to
your experience in the House of Commons
no not at all I mean women are I think
judged with a a more opaque filters and
men both on their political opinion on
their position on politics whatever that
might be and there is far more I mean
you've just had Jess on a moment ago
there is far more victory Alec attack
aimed at women who have an opinion who
are strong and who right and it doesn't
matter whether they write about politics
or economics or fiction you know I've
experienced that myself you know even
though my book was a best-seller my
first book it was slated by the male
reviewers and I'm favorably reviewed by
the women and I think note that there
has to be a a recognition of the fact
but women have a tough time both in
publishing and if it is done in all
spheres of writing and the more prizes
that we have women only prizes the
better and if the men object then bring
on an all-male prize that's fine but you
know we really have to acknowledge this
women have had a tough time Helen lose
something you find yourself in a lot of
agreement there with video I know it's
quite it's quite shocking to me that we
find me an issue that brings me in the
Dean together but i think that there's a
point some people will say in their
shame it's shocking helen that it's um
that this prices is sex with you where
is the men's price but the trouble is
that a lot of prizes end up being men's
prizes by default this year the Samuel
Johnson prize for example and not
another non-fiction price has a long
list of 12 and there's only one woman on
that and the reason at the orange prize
read letter winners were women are yeah
but what happens is when you look at
these things in the round you discover
that men far dominate and as Nadine said
actually most most fiction is written by
women most fiction is bought by women
but yet for some reason we think that
the best fiction must be by and about
men but I mean let's mention other other
prizes of course the ground
the man booked a half of the last ten
winners have been women okay Hillary
Mantell twice we've got Elna cotton as
well and Enright and kiran desai and you
know this is for everyone one of the
things we do what is really interesting
to look at is the number of women who
don't have children and Dean's an
interesting example of it she got her
first book published after she her
children were quite a lot older and
actually one of the big things that's a
problem for women is they can't go to
literary festivals to promote their but
they can't come on TV to promote their
book because I got caring
responsibilities that men don't have and
I think it's interesting to question
when you look at the number of women who
winning prizes actually how many of them
do have those caring responsibilities
interesting point you care to comment on
it Nadine well it's absolutely true also
the other thing of course helen is that
you didn't have time to write your books
when you're a mother and you have caring
responsibilities and that is an issue
you know I write my books very early in
the morning and once my children have
left home and I think a lot of women are
in the same position as I am they don't
have the time or the mental space
actually to do what they've always
wanted to and many women don't actually
have the confidence it takes the
experience of a lifetime of mothering of
achieving both in your career and I'm
parenting to give you the confidence to
be able to write because I speak to so
many women now who contact me who wants
to write but don't feel that they can
put their book out there yet and that's
a great shame and I hope actually the
more prizes we have and the more
acknowledgement of women in publishing
but that will change and helen lewis I
mean is it what the books are about or
is it just the fact that they're written
by women i make i suppose in the case of
this particular prize it's not about
women writing for women is it no
although there is a problem i think
there is a kind of great men of history
theory that a book about you know a
general for example is deemed to have a
kind of status that maybe about a female
pioneer wouldn't and i think if you look
at something like last year's Oscar
nominated films for the best picture
they were all actually about men's lives
and i think there's this kind of idea
that if you write a book about a man's
life that's quite a big political
statement if you write a book about a
woman's life it's sort of but you know
kind of it's a memoir or biography it's
somehow diminished by being associated
with being feminine yeah thought about
it Nadine I want to read you a quotation
from it's a blog i read about someone
who dumb just got selected
to stand as a member of parliament they
subsequently got in and they they went
through a short list that had 12 men on
it and five women and one through and
the blog says this the crunch question I
want to ask myself is this if one of my
three daughters became an MP as a result
of being selected by an all-woman
shortlist how pride would I feel I know
the answer I would want them to compete
on merits because they are worthy of
that now who said that that was me I'm
actually that still holds true I think
when you're applying to the electorate
to be elected you're not only being
elected by women you're being elected by
well who make up fifty two percent of
the population you're being elected by
everybody and therefore the process to
put you in the position of standing
before that electorate should be
equitable and you should be selected by
an equal number of men as you are
winning but I don't think you can
conflate standing for public office with
the the fact that seventy percent of
women are the successful writers against
thirty percent of men that is a
different dynamic as an statistic but
can I just make this point Gemma on what
we've just on the previous discussion
you know I just like to say to Helen but
literary prizes very rarely go where the
readers are and whereas they're very
valuable and very important and I fully
support and applaud them though it seems
to be this chasm of what readers buy and
what an almost elitist group of judges
and those who critique that the work for
prizes deem us worthy of prize and I
think that's a chasm that has to be
crossed so that the public can be
involved and interested in these
literary prizes as much as the
publishing world is okay