geoff: The U.S. Senate has bad
blood with ticketmaster after
the company botched ticket sales
for Taylor Swift's upcoming
tour.
In a hearing today, the senate
judiciary committee hammered
ticketmaster not just for the
ticketing buckle, -- ticketing
debacle, but also for its
near-monopoly in the live music
industry.
The senate judiciary committee
today tore into ticketmaster
after the fiasco last fall over
Taylor Swift tickets.
Some senators unable to resist
references to her songs.
>> Ticketmaster ought to look in
the mirror and say, "I'm the
problem, it's me."
>> A lot of people seem to think
that's somehow a solution.
I think that's a nightmare
dressed like a daydream.
Geoff: The committee called the
hearing following public outrage
over ticket sales for Taylor
Swift's upcoming concert tour.
Thousands complained about being
unable to get ticketmaster's
site to load.
Others couldn't access tickets,
even though they had a pre-sale
code.
Ticketmaster ultimately canceled
sales to the general public,
leaving lots of fans ticketless
and angry.
>> I have never been more mad at
a company than I am at
ticketmaster right now.
>> Tickets in the sections I was
trying to get tickets for are
now on stubhub being resold for
thousands of dollars.
>> ♪♪ The seats I had, so
excited, finally showed up on my
And when the page was finally
loaded the transaction couldn't
complete ♪♪
geoff: Ticketmaster blamed the 3
and a half billion requests for
tickets they received from fans,
bots, and scalpers.
>> This is what led to a
terrible consumer experience,
which we deeply regret.
We apologize to the fans.
We apologize to Ms. Swift.
We need to do better and we will
do better.
Geoff: Critics say the company
wields too much control over the
live music industry.
Testimony today from
singer-songwriter Clyde
Lawrence.
>> Due to live nation's control
across the industry, we have
practically no leverage in
negotiating them.
If they want to take 10 percent
of the revenues and call it a
facility fee they can.
And have.
Geoff: Ticketmaster and live
nation merged in 2010 --
combining ticketing, artist
management and venues under one
single powerful company.
Some Democrats have advocated
for breaking up the company,
saying it violates antitrust
laws.
>> You have clear dominance.
Monopolistic control.
This whole concert ticket system
is a mess.
It's a monopolistic mess.
Geoff: While Republicans called
ticketmaster out for subpar
service.
>> If you care about the
consumer, you're going to hold
the price down, cut out the
middleman.
>> Why is it you have not
developed an algorithm to
determine what is about and what
is a human?
The bank can do it and the local
power company can do it and you
can't.
Geoff: Taylor Swift, for her
part has called the
ticket-buying experience
excruciating.
Senator Amy klobuchar led
today's hearing and joined us
live from the capital.
You said that ticketmaster and
live nation are the definition
of a monopoly.
What problems does this create?
Senator klobuchar: It is not
just Taylor Swift, we appreciate
her fans making antitrust sexy
again, but it is not just her,
it is bad bunny fans, Harry
styles fans, Springsteen fans.
Many artists and bands through
time, way back to pearl jam,
have brought this to the
forefront.
The other piece about it is
ticket prices.
A government study found a 27%
average, this was a few years
ago, were fees.
In some instances it was 80% of
the price.
As you heard from Clyde
Lawrence, he said that he
literally gets only six dollars
for an eight-member band for a
lot of these ticket sales.
What is the answer?
That's what we were focused on
today.
It wasn't Democrats or
Republicans in asking the
questions because there were so
much unity taking on a company
that has a monopoly on
ticketing, 70% to 80% to penning
on how you look at it, does the
promotions and owns the arenas
or makes them take three to five
to seven your contracts to get
their services, icing out any
competition.
Geoff: You mentioned the
dominance ticketmaster and live
nation have, should that company
be broken up?
Sen. Klobuchar: That is clearly
one option.
It worked with AT&T only got
better long distance rates and a
brand-new cell phone industry.
It could work here.
2010, I voiced concern about the
merger back then, and it is
something the justice department
I am sure will be looking at.
The other pieces of this will be
legislation to at least make
sure we have transparency on
these fees and that the fan
experience does not involve
getting on the website and the
price takes up as they get to
the end of purchasing their
ticket.
Speculative tickets that people
are trying to sell that are not
even there.
For ticketmaster and live nation
to blame everyone else, whether
it is the bots or a cyberattack,
it makes no sense when they have
this extreme monopoly power.
The purpose of this hearing, I
think we accomplished it -- get
the public some knowledge, get
under oath testimony from people
who want to see change and
ticketmaster for the justice
department to use, and find
bipartisan support with
colleagues to move forward.
Instead of throwing popcorn at
CEO's, I think it is time for
action.
Geoff: Ticketmaster came to
today's hearing with some
suggestions on how to improve
the ticketing marketplace but
they said they want better
enforcement of existing anti-bot
legislation, they want to ban
speculative selling, ban
websites that deceive consumers,
they want to mandate pricing so
that fans can see the full cost
of tickets.
Why is that insufficient?
Sen. Klobuchar: First of all,
there was a lot of support for
some of these changes and I
think they've also intimated it
would make some changes, at
least the band member that was
one of the witnesses.
But it is not enough because
they still have this monopoly.
Arenas have told us and we heard
testimony today that they are
afraid to use competitive
services because then they will
not get the acts.
You also have the fact we have a
fan expansive having to pay for
all of these fees and the fiasco
when there is no one else to go
to.
That's why the justice
department is reportedly
investigating this.
Our information will help them
greatly in that investigation.
It's also why we need to look at
legislation beyond this.
I believe we need to strengthen
our antitrust laws overall.
75% of American industries we've
seen more consolidation, from
caskets to cat food.
If we are just going to accept
these conservative court
decisions that narrowed the use
of antitrust laws, we will see
this happening over and over
again.
There are some critical things
we can do to put the burden on
merging companies or companies
engaged in discriminatory
conduct to prove it does not
hurt competition, as opposed to
putting it all on the
government.
We have just successfully given
a major shot in the arm to the
antitrust enforcers when it
comes to resources with a bill
senator grassley and I and
others worked with -- worked on
in the house to up the merger
fees, on big companies, not
little ones, that will help fund
enforcers.
They can't take on the biggest
companies with duct tape and
band-aids.
They are a shadow of what they
were under the Nixon
administration.
Geoff: I want to draw you out on
that.
There are people who will watch
this and wonder why should
congress concern itself with
this?
The free market is crippled by
too much government
intervention, regulation.
And that the reason why
ticketmaster is dominant is
because it is best of brand.
Sen. Klobuchar: I don't think
the fans would agree that we
shouldn't have any competition.
So, first of all we have a bunch
of conservative supporting this,
you heard from them today.
They believe if you're going to
have capitalism that works, you
need to have antitrust
enforcement.
You go back to the founding of
this country and Adam Smith, the
godfather of capitalism, he said
watch out for the unbridled
standing army of monopolies.
Fast-forward to senator Sherman,
a Republican, fast-forward to
Roosevelt when he rode his horse
into the white house on busting
of the trust, that was a
Republican senator.
Over time it has been Democrats
and Republicans working together
to take on monopolies.
Back then it was a railroad
trust and now it is big tech,
ticketing and a what we are
seeing right now.
We simply cannot say it is ok
and we will not do anything
since the advent of the
internet.
We cannot do that.
We have to take some action.
I was heartened by today's
hearing and I believe if you
believe in capitalism and
competitive responses to things,
you have to unleash competition
and not allow monopolies to
dominate a market, and that is
exactly what is happening right
now in ticketing.
Geoff: Senator Amy klobuchar, we
watch a lot of congressional
hearings around these parts, and
today's was really interesting.
I get for being with us.
Sen. Klobuchar: That's a good
pbs adjective, I appreciate it.
I just want to see action.
Thank you.
Geoff: You can watch the full
hearing online at
pbs.org/newshour.