>> GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO "CONNECTING POINT," I'M JIM
MADIGAN.
STATE OFFICIAL AND FEDERAL REGULATORS ARE STILL STUDYING
THE PROPOSAL FROM KIDD CHRIS SHOW ON KUFO AND TENNESSEE GAS
TO PLACE A NATURAL GAS TRANSMISSION PIPELINE ACROSS
NORTHWESTERN MASSACHUSETTS.
TONIGHT "CONNECTING POINT" CORRESPONDENT CAROLEE McGRATH
BEGIN AS TWO-PART LOOK AT THE CONTROVERSIAL PROJECT.
>> I'M JOINED BY BENJI BOROWSKI OF THE COALITION TO LOWER ENERGY
COSTS, AND STATE REPRESENTATIVE PAUL MARK FROM THE SECOND BERK
SHIRR DISTRICT, THANKS FOR JOINING US TODAY.
>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING YOUS.
>> I WANT TO START WITH REPRESENTATIVE MARK, WHY ARE YOU
OPPOSED TO THE PIPELINE FOR YOUR AREA?
>> THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY ARE OPPOSED TO THIS.
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT FIVE OPPORTUNITIES TO IN THE PATH OF
THIS PROJECT.
ONLY THREE ARE SLATED FOR THE ENTIRE STATE.
THE PEOPLE IN THESE VERY SMALL TOWNS --
>> TELL ME SOME OF THE TOWN.
>> DALTON, PERU, HINSDALE, WINDSOR AND NORTH FIELD, WINDS
SISTER AND NORTH FIELD SLATED TO HAVE SOME OF THE STATIONS.
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT LAND THAT'S BEEN UNTOUCHED BASICALLY SINCE
OUR COUNTRY BEGAN.
THEY ARE AFRAID OF THAT CHANGING, THEY ARE AFRAID OF A
GIANT PROJECT COMING THROUGH, DIRTY, DESTROYING PROTECTED
LAND, DESTROYING FORESTS, CHANGING THE NATURE OF THE
COMMUNITIES.
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT COMMUNITIES THAT AREN'T REALLY GOING TO
RECEIVE ANY BENEFITS IF THERE ARE BENEFITS OF THIS PROJECT IN
ANY WAY.
>> BECAUSE THERE'S NO GAS SERVICE IN THAT AREA, CORRECT?
>> ABSOLUTELY.
IN A TOWN LIKE WINDSOR THAT WOULD HOST A COMPRESSOR STATION,
THERE ARE ABOUT 800 PEOPLE.
THERE'S NO WAY THE SERVICE WILL BE EXPANDED TO THOSE HOMES.
>> TELL ME WHO WAS PART OF THE COALITION, BENJI BOROWSKI, AND
WHY ARE YOU IN FAVOR OF IT.
>> THE COALITION TO LOWER ENERGY COSTS WAS FORMED BASICALLY IN
THE FACE OF THE ENERGY CRISIS IN NEW ENGLAND.
AND OUR MEMBERS INCLUDE ASSOCIATIONS OF LARGE INDUSTRIAL
CONSUMERS, WE HAVE SKI RESORTS, DATA STORAGE CENTERS, COMMERCIAL
PROPERTY OWNERS AROUND BOSTON, AEROSPACE PARTS AND
MANUFACTURERS.
OUR POLICY EXPERTS ARE FORMER DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC UTILITY
COMMISSIONERS EN MASSACHUSETTS.
IN GENERAL I WOULD URGE TO YOU READ THE COALITION TO LOWER
ENERGY COSTS' STRATEGIC ENERGY PLAN FOUND ON OUR WEBSITE.
THAT SETS FORTH A FIVE-STEP PLAN AS TO WHY WE THINK INCREASED
NATURAL GAS PIPELINE CAPACITY WITH FORM THE FOUNDATION FOR A
CLEANER ENERGY FUTURE.
ONE THIS, PIPELINE AND ALSO THE ACCESS NORTHEAST PIPELINE, I
HAVE AS TO STATE THAT THE COALITION FAVORS A GENERIC
AMOUNT OF CAPACITY.
WE NEED ABOUT TWO BCF, INCLUDING THE NORTHEAST ENERGY PRESCOTT
AND SPECTRAS ENERGY PROJECT.
THESE WOULD ALLOW TO US COMPLETELY DISPLACE COAL AND OIL
FROM THE ELECTRIC SECTOR ENTIRELY.
AND SECOND, IT WOULD LOWER ENERGY COSTS ON THE HEATING AND
ELECTRICITY SIDE BY BILLIONS ANNUALLY FOR THE REGION, WHICH
WOULD ALLOW TO US BE COMPETITIVE WITH ALL OTHER AREAS OF THE
UNITED STATES.
MOST IMPORTANTLY, IT WOULD ALLOW IT TO BE POLITICALLY FEASIBLE TO
CONTINUE AND POSSIBLY IMPROVE OUR INCENTIVES FOR RENEWABLE
ENERGY AND ENERGY EFFICIENCY IN THE REGION.
THIRD, NATURAL -- THESE PIPELINES WOULD ALLOW OUR
EXISTING NATURAL GAS FIRED ELECTRIC GENERATORS TO USE THEIR
FLEXIBILITY TO BALANCE RENEWABLE ENERGY.
AS WE DEVELOP NOR RENEWABLE ENERGY AND THAT'S INTEGRATED
INTO THE GRID, OUR NATURAL GAS GENERATORS WILL BE LESS
IMPORTANT FOR THE ENERGY THEY PRODUCE, BUT MORE IMPORTANT IN
THEIR BACK UP ROLE.
FIFTH, ONCE WE HAVE A CLEANER AND CHEAPER FUEL MIX, WE CAN
WORK TOWARDS ELECTRIFYING THE HEATING AND TRANSPORTATION
SECTORS IN NEW ENGLAND, REALLY THE ONLY TWO SECTORS WHICH
HAVEN'T HAD EMISSIONS REDUCTIONS.
>> REPRESENTATIVE, WHAT YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT AS FAR AS
LOWERING ENERGY COSTS IN THE AREA.
>> FIRST, THE PEOPLE IN MY DISTRICT WOULD FEEL THAT NATURAL
GAS IS NOT A CLEAN ENERGY, AND ALSO NOT A RENEWABLE ENERGY.
THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER ALTERNATIVES IN RENEWABLE
ENERGY.
I'M A LEAD SPONSOR OF A BILL ON COMMUNITY-BASED SOLAR, WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT HYDRO AND A LOT OF DIFFERENT RENEWABLE ENERGIES
THAT COULD BE BROUGHT HERE, BOTH FROM WITHIN AND WITHOUT
MASSACHUSETTS, TO MAKE MORE OF A DENT IN BRINGING DOWN COSTS.
LOWER ENERGY COSTS IS IMPORTANT TO ME AND IMPORTANT TO THE
LEGISLATURE AND IMPORTANT TO THE PEOPLE OF MY DISTRICT.
OUR ELECTRIC BILL IN THE MONTH.
JANUARY MY BILL WENT UP TO $700 FOR ONE MONTH.
I DO HAVE ELECTRIC HEATING.
BUT I ALSO THINK THAT EXPANDING GAS CAPACITY ISN'T NECESSARILY
GOING LOWER ANY COSTS AT ALL.
WHEN YOU EXPAND CAPACITY YOU COULD BE INCREASING DEMAND.
IF YOU BRING A GAS SUPPLY INTO A NEW AREA, THE GOVERNOR OF MAIL
AND RHODE ISLAND REALLY ARE INTO THIS BECAUSE THEY WANT THE
SERVICE IN THEIR AREA.
WHAT'S TO SAY THE PRICES AREN'T GOING TO GO UP.
OR IF WE START TO EXPORT THIS, I WAS IN PITTSBURGH TALKING ABOUT
EXPORTED NATURAL GUESS.
THE UNITED STATES WANTS TO BE AN EXPORTER OF GAS AND OIL AND LESS
RELIANT ON FOSSIL FUELS FROM BROUGHT A GOOD GOAL.
>> OF COURSE.
>> TALKING ABOUT SPORTS, THE PRICES ARE GOING TO BE SET BY
THE WORLD MARKET, NOT BY ANYBODY HERE IN MASSACHUSETTS.
TO ME THERE'S NOT A GUARANTEE THAT ANY PRICES ARE GOING TO GO
DOWN.
>> YOU'RE NOT AGAINST SPECT RECYCLER A, THOUGH?
>> THE PEOPLE OF MY DISTRICT ARE NOT AGAINST IT BECAUSE IT
DOESN'T COME INTO THEIR TOWNS.
YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT EXPANDING EXISTING CAPACITY.
I THINK IT'S A VERY DIFFERENT ARGUMENT.
IF YOU TAKE AWAY THE FACT THAT YES, NATURAL GAS IS STILL A
GREENHOUSE GAS, IT'S METHANE BUT STILL GOING TO HAVE A
DETRIMENTAL EFFECT ON THE ENVIRONMENT AND CLIMATE CHANGE,
ET CETERA.
IF YOU TALK ABOUT EXPANDING SOMETHING THAT ALREADY EXISTS,
YOU CAN'T MAKE THE SAME ARGUMENT THAT YOU'RE COMING INTO A TOWN
THAT IS BASICALLY ALL FOREST AND TEARING IT ALL UP TO PUT A JOINT
STATION THERE AND A PASS-THROUGH THAT IS NEVER GOING SERVE THE
PEOPLE OF THE COMMUNITY.
WESTERN MASSACHUSETTS, WE'VE LIVED THIS BEFORE.
WE'RE CONSTANTLY TAKEN FROM GRANTED BY OTHER PARTS OF THE
STATE AND OTHER PARTS OF THE COUNTRY.
>> IT'S IMPORTANT TO SAY THERE IS EXISTING PIPELINE DOWN IN THE
SPRINGFIELD AREA.
YOU WOULD BE IN FAVORITE OF ADDITIONAL IMPROVEMENTS MADE TO
THAT, OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT?
>> THERE WOULDN'T BE THE SAME OPPOSITION TO EXPANDING PIPELINE
THAT ALL RIGHT EXISTS.
>> BENJI, ATTORNEY GENERAL MAURA HEALEY RELEASED A REPORT SAYING
THE ELECTRIC CAPACITY OF NEW ENGLAND WOULD REMAIN STABLE FOR
THE NEXT 15 YEARS.
SHE SAID THERE ARE CHEAPER AND CLEANER WAYS TO IMPROVE
CAPACITY.
WHAT'S YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT?
>> IT CERTAINLY IS A DATA POINT TO CONSIDER BUT I THINK THE
STUDY IS PRETTY FATALLY FLAWED.
IT BEGINS WITH THE QUESTION THE STUDY ASKED.
IT'S A QUESTION OUR EXPERTS HAVE ASKED 10 YEARS AGO.
THEY ALREADY KNOW THE ANSWER.
THE QUESTION IS CAN WE KEEP THE LIGHTS ON, ARE WE GOING TO MAY
WANT ELECTRIC RELIABILITY.
WE WOULD NEED ABOUT.24 BILLION COUPIC FEET A DAY TO JUST KEEP
THE LIGHTS ON.
WE HAVE AN INDEPENDENT REGIONAL GRID OPERATOR, WE HAVE
FIRST-DEGREE, THEY ARE CONFIRMED BY CONGRESS.
WORK.
NORTH AMERICAN ELECTRIC RELIABILITY CORPORATION.
WE HAVE STATE PUBLIC UTILITIES COMMISSIONS AND PUBLIC SERVICE
COMMISSIONS AROUND THE REGION.
THE EXPERTS IDENTIFIED THE PROBLEM YEARS AGO.
WHAT HAVE WE DONE?
ISO NEW ENGLAND HAS IMPLEMENTED THE WINTER RELIABILITY PROGRAM,
AN EMERGENCY SUBSIDY TO OIL FIRED GENERATORS BECAUSE OUR
NATURAL GAS PIPE LIONS ARE SO CONSTRAINED IN THE WINTER, IS
ONCH SAID IN ORDER TO MAINTAIN ELECTRICITY WE NEED TO ENSURE
ALL THE OLD OIL FIRED GENERATE RATERS HAVE OIL IN THEIR TANKS
TO BURN TO GENERATE ELECTRICITY.
THAT'S COSTED RATEPAYERS 40 TO $70 MILLION A YEAR.
WE ARE PAYING FOR THAT KNOW.
THE FERC HAS ALREADY APPROVED THAT PROGRAM THROUGH 2018-19.
IT'S GOING TO CONTINUE FOR THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS AT LEAST.
SO BASICALLY WE'RE GOING TO KEEP THE LIGHTS ON, EVERYBODY KNOWS
WE'RE GOING TO KEEP THE LIGHTS ON HE AND THE ANSWER IS THROUGH
OIL.
>> WE HAVE A LOT MORE ON THIS DISCUSSION.
WE WILL CONTINUE IT ON THE PIPELINE ON WEDNESDAY NIGHT.
I WANT TO THANK YOU BOTH FOR JOINING US, WE'LL SEE YOU AGAIN
ON WITH TONES TALK MORE ABOUT THIS.