should I read this question because this is a question for echo Charles so that
means I guess yeah well this part of it's two questions actually but I put
them together because they're pretty close Jaakko willing what brought you
and echo Charles together can we get the backstory there I liked the chemistry
echo Charles question for you to answer on Jocko podcast what have you learned
from Jocko and how has your life changed since this is echos first response to a
question don't screw it up here we go
chuckle you yeah of course which is funny because that's kind of how what
brought us together or part of what brought us together
and I think it's good that I answered this part because you probably remember
a lot less of it so I would say it was oh six I see I had seen you like the
first you know whatever within the first year of of joining with Dean in Oh five
but I didn't know you didn't talk to you nothing like that I just had heard of
you from Dean um and then in like oh six when we moved over to the boxing club I
rolled with you one time I was still a white belt and so they could have been
still oh five I don't know and then you know you beat me up and you kind of you
were just more like this stoic guy BC I would imagine the same guy that people
interpret you to be from the outside you know how like not intense but just real
like oh yeah just real matter of fact you know so he beat me up or whatever
and then I was so I since I had already heard you you were Dean's black belt and
you know all this stuff that I was like yeah that's about right you know he's
you know good you just do whatever beat me up but that wasn't really saying much
because everyone was beating me up and then um time went on I ain't see you for
a while and then um when I started to kind of get go so I was training with
Brent remember Brenton yeah I was training
with him and then with Ilyas a little bit and then you'd come back I was
competing and then you were just around for whatever reason and then yeah I just
started training with you I think that's that's when we opened victory
yes there's around the same time yeah yeah exactly
and then um yeah what was funny is that you never came off like once like like
knew you like immediately you never came off as this super intense person like it
was more like you were just sarcastic like well let you know like any other
like any other of my friends but you could still always tell that there are
something behind the scenes you know you know Jorgen said like he's seen you and
he was like there's this guy you know this I kind of got that same feeling but
you were always just like oh yeah this real matter-of-fact but fun funny like
kind of person whatever like but when I say matter of fact I mean like um like
that one this one tournament when it was kind of later where I lost to Sean
Roberts he got me with a gogoplata you know when you lose in jiu-jitsu Tran
and that was the first time I lost in since I went advanced you know because I
was doing a lot of noogie I had never lost in Sean Roberts keeps me with a
gogoplata so instead of you saying hey you know it's okay hey or nothing like
that you send me a text you're sitting across the arena you're right there you
send me texting hey you got caught with a go-go that's gotta sting I was like
aha whatever but I think that um that you know training together and just kind
of getting you know you you kind of had that thing that you could say that kind
of stuff because really it's not that serious you know yeah when I don't think
I don't think there's there's not many people who could have conveyed that
though you know it came I think you had to come from you anyway so yeah that's
kind of how we met I'd say and then um kind of after a while how did the idea
of a podcast come up because we we kind of talked about that a little bit before
I kind of forget the formation but it was in my mind when I went on Joe
Rogan's I think we had talked about a you know we should do something I think
you said to me like hey well you should do it and so when I went on Joe Rogan's
and he said you should do a podcast I think what Tim Ferriss said hey you
should do a podcast and then I kind of be you being a techy sound guy video guy
I just said hey do you know how to make a podcast
that's right I just said hey how do you know how to make a podcast I need to
make one yeah because everything is just a total caveman right yeah how do you do
I need a tape recorder what do I need you know that's what my and so then you
said yeah I know I I know how to do that I could make that happen and then you
said it'd be cool instead of just you sitting there talking if you had someone
to talk to and I said yeah you're right that would be cool and then you'd said
you'd be cool if it was me yeah well my selling point was that strange if it's
just you right just sitting there you know it's it's more strange and it's
better if you have someone to kind of bounce things off of especially someone
who can kind of be like whoa I'm just everyday guy like so I can like ask
questions that kind of reiterate the point right just someone who might not
get it yeah I had it all thought out you know in my mind I did anyway um but yeah
then yeah obviously Joe okay now was kind of the tipping point when he
suggested it yeah yeah I know that was a good great insight from Joe Rogan and
I'm glad he did and I'm glad you did I'm glad we did make this podcast happen so
to answer the question what have I learned and this is interesting because
I asked myself this exact same question like a week ago because I am literally a
different person now in ways that kinda are kind of surprising in a way so I'd
say the first thing that's kind of kind of not that surprising but it'sit's very
prevalent is when people blame when I see people blaming other people or
blaming me or I feel the compulsion to blame someone else it stands out like a
sore thumb almost like if if I've been feeling that
and it like almost like if I want to say something to indicate that I'm gonna
blame somebody or something it's almost like a red flag like I'm not allowed to
do that in my own mind it's like it's hard and fast rule and like I said they
just stand out like a sore thumb everywhere though on TV you know the guy
not even my conversation oh I see what you doing right there you know so it's
like it's like your whole way of life in that regard is just shifted extreme
ownership and the awareness of that yeah seeing it in other people or lack of it
and other people it definitely stands out like crazy
once you start thinking about it yeah and I have the luxury of being around
you talking about these things talking about examples of it every week right so
throughout the week I'm like I can't even help but notice it you know and
it's Fred it helps men because it applies to everyone
they've been everything like most relationships are gonna apply these
principles you know if you're involved in them so yeah it's all automatic now
so so when it comes to ownership and really blaming myself if anyone and
focusing on my responsibility in any scenario whatever it comes to automatic
now I would say so huge step I mean whether I make the right choices that's
always gonna be working product progress I think but as far as that attitude it's
automatic no that's awesome and then um in regards to okay so I've
always been into working out and so me not feeling like working out is I've
always felt like working out so as far as not feeling like it that wasn't
really a factor but in a bunch of other things in life it was a factor and so so
you're saying we not feeling like doing thanks um y-z yeah like oh I got it
I gotta go to the post office today and that's on the low end and then or the
other one is I don't know I don't know something more important right but maybe
I'll wait I'll wait til really the last minute or you know procrastination type
stuff so you're getting into the here and now yeah and not feeling like it
that means absolutely absolutely nothing something needs to be done and I don't
feel like it and you know how like you have you have certain ideas already
and then other ideas are introduced and then those ideas kind of mingle with
your existing ideas and they formulate this whole new course of action right so
the not feeling like it is no excuse that idea came in and so now I'm like it
morphed into this thing like me not feeling I could who guess what I'm gonna
do I'm gonna do it so it's almost like this personal challenge now you know and
man as far as results go and you get everything done I eat so much stuff done
and it's not so probably compared to youth
nothing but I get stuff done like so so many things done during the day that I
never thought that I could do that many things in a day that's all I was always
looking for maybe arrests or a nap or something like that but now everyone's
gonna all be challenging myself to do as many things as I can and be like solid
and on top of that and you're the one who said this was um one time one of the
things you were kind of tired and you were like you know what but I like this
I like just grinding and grinding and grinding and then at the end of the day
when I go and go to bed where my head just crashes into the pillow I like that
I was like yeah that sounds nice you know so when I approach things like
that now and also I think of all the good things that have been done like
great things and just good things or whatever if these people didn't do it
because they didn't feel like it like these things when they got done you know
so you got stuff to do you do it whether you feel like it or not that's what I
don't have for myself now and the last thing is I kind of knew this but man
it's so clear now that you can get certain messages and information and
tips and tactics and stuff from from people or the internet or books or
whatever but if you're not ready to accept them you just won't accept them
or they'll just go in one ear and out the other and a lot of time that has to
do with who's saying it so if like I don't know your neighbor some goof-off
he's drinking a beer smoking a cigarette is okay guess what you know you should
do this and it's it can be this great advice for you can be like I'm not gonna
listen to you I'm not even listening to you I'm not even get past that part the
fact that you're the one that's saying this already walled me off from what you
have to say and that's natural I think but a lot of these things like you're
reading these old books that have these messages that you've been saying so it's
not new stuff and a lot of stuff I heard that take responsibility for your
actions yeah how's that yeah that's not new you know if I busts out a hey you
guy on the street take responsibility for your actions if something comes up
I'm just saying he'd be like yeah that's nothing new I wouldn't stand out but for
some reason when you're saying it it gets you thinking yeah let me take
responsibility so that's so yeah it's a when it comes
to listening to you this podcast all the you know the answers you have for these
questions and any questions I even have it seems like it comes and I process it
way more readily then you know memes on Facebook or wherever yeah so yeah that's
awesome pretty trend that's that's really cool that's that's great to hear
and I've I mean I've definitely seen a transition in everything you're doing I
mean everything you're doing is spot-on yeah and that's legit you know it's it's
legit to see it's legit to see someone moving towards their potential as a
human yeah that's awesome to see yeah and another thing that kind of I came to
as not a conclusion but it which is a result it's not a direct like you didn't
tell me this but this is what all my existing thoughts mixed with all your
input kind of arrived at one of the things is that it's up to you it's up to
me what I spend my time doing totally up to me and it's up to me what I feel my
fill my head with so you know I used to have these shows that I loved why I love
to watch Hawaii five-o and shark tank and that's kind of it I don't really
watch that much TV but those do that's maybe you know two hours or so that I
could be reading something that's gonna help me through the rest of my life or
getting better at something that's gonna help my you know relationships or career
or something like that and I use that example because that seems pretty pretty
like not inconsequential inconsequential could because it's only two shows it's
not like I spent 10 hours a day watching TV it's just to show so there's no harm
in that right but it's that's up to me I'm not missing out by missing Hawaii
five-o not missing out that's not gonna affect my life in any negative way in
the future at all I don't want to affect my life in any way actually but if I
read something useful educate myself in you know whatever arena that's gonna
prove my interest or my or my relationship or something like that that
will that will help me ya know either I've that's one of the
things I've noticed in our show up show up at the studio and you'd say I was
reading this book today about you know how we could get this to sound better
and I read this thing about you know you're coming back and with all this
information and it was something that just transitioned in your brain where
you said you know what I could be watching TV in wasting my mind or I
could be applying myself and learning yeah and that's that makes a huge
difference rather well one of the things I read
actually and I read it on what I want to say Wikipedia this specific thing but
there's this this automatic way of thinking and it's called hyperbolic
discounting right and all that it all that means is you choose immediate
payoffs versa and I kind of mentioned this before choosing media payoffs
versus long-term payoffs right and it's there for a reason survival mechanism
and all these ways but it's old it exists for an you know an environment
that's not current so if you can basically a be aware that and combat
that where don't do the immediate payoff things so just take take what you're
about to do evaluate it is this gonna help me other than the pleasure that I
see whether that in regards to food drinking TV shows like if you watch a
reality TV check yourself on down and ask yourself is this gonna help me in
the future and typically that and that the answer for those types of things are
gonna be no and then consider an alternative that you can do and a lot of
the stuff can be pleasurable that will help you in the future
and it's totally up to you it's totally up to you why not make the good choice
yeah and the payoff not only is it bigger it lasts longer yeah
and the immediate payoff is gone it's just a memory