Samuel: Adam, how's it going, buddy?
Adam: Hi Samuel. Hello. How are you?
Samuel: I'm good. Nice to talk to you. What's your-
Adam: What an absolute pleasure.
Samuel: What's that?
Adam: I said, "What an absolute pleasure." Just thanks for giving me the opportunity
to give you a ring.
Samuel: Oh, you're welcome buddy. What's going on then, buddy?
Adam: Basically, my situation ... as I said on Facebook, is I'm quite new to all this.
I'm a first year junior doctor. I'm 23. I've just come straight out of medical school.
I'm working in Liverpool. Basically, I've decided that I'd like to get into property.
I came across yourself online on YouTube. I've read your book. I really like to give
this property thing a go. I'm pretty motivated, but my problem is I'm extremely time time-poor
as a junior doctor. I'm in sort of 70 grand worth of debt.
Adam: Basically, I understand that cash flow's my biggest issue at the moment. I've decided
firstly to educate myself, really, go on your courses, and really sort of think about rent-to-rent
and ways that I can firstly sort of free up some cash flow for myself. That's the main
sort of short-term goal, with the long-term goal being really to supplement my wage so
I can have a bit more time to spend with family and stuff.
Samuel: Alright. Cool. Currently, you said you're £70,000 worth in debt, you're working
as a junior doctor. Are you living in Liverpool?
Adam: Yeah, I live in Liverpool in a flat just not too far from the centre of town.
I share it with friends.
Samuel: Okay. What's your plan then? How much income do you need in order to ... Did you
say about three or four K to become sort of financially free, so to speak?
Adam: Yeah, really, about 24 to 30. I mean, I do enjoy my job, listen. I do want to sort
of get through the first two years of being a junior doctor, and then I'm going to have
a little break. I'm going to have a little break and my third year, where I can have
some more time to sort of build up some more money and things, because there's a bit more
free in the third year, but I want to sort of supplement along the way. So it's 24 plus,
really, would be almost double my wage. I mean, I do a lot of overtime, but you can
earn quite a bit of money as a junior, but it's just the money's traded for hours and
lots of them, really.
Samuel: Yeah. How many hours are you doing at the moment as a junior doctor?
Adam: I can do anywhere between 50 to 72 a week. Sometimes, you can do 46-hour week.
I'm one night this week, so I'm doing eight today every day. So, I thought I've got our
bed for this one, so it's an important one to me. So I thought, you know, what an opportunity.
Samuel: And what's your salary?
Adam: My salary currently is about 36. I've only had two wage packets so far, and that's
sort of paying off my overdraft from my student accounts. I have some more overdraft that
are up to a bit grand or so, which is sort of my problem, to get out of that. It's all
zero percent interest that.
Samuel: Yeah. So what do you-
Adam: [crosstalk 00:03:00] start from zero.
Samuel: What do you want to be doing in 10 years when you're 33?
Adam: When I'm 33, hopefully I'll be a GP, part time with a sort of full time property
portfolio including sort of HMO's, and rent to rent, really? I really, I really enjoyed
... I think I really enjoy HMO was anyway. I used to help landlords when I was at university,
sort of fill the houses for them. I used to get the admin fees off them. So I've spoken
to a few in Liverpool, but as you can imagine we've been time-poor. So it sort of went off
towards the end of my medical school. Sort of a degree, but it was really helpful. But
then-
Samuel: Why do you want to build a property portfolio, though? If you want to be a doctor
and you really enjoy that and there's good money in that and you actually enjoy it, why
do you want also to have a property portfolio?
Adam: I think it was sort of last year I realised that to me, even though I do enjoy medicine,
life is about more than that and there's other things I want to do. When you meet most doctors
they're comfortable, but they're really sort of time restricted if you like. So, I think
I'd still like to see a GP, but my main terms, so I've got free time to spend with friends
and family. I mean I'm a [inaudible 00:04:18] extremely, quite a lot through medical school
and I just sort of have time to spend with them and taking those holidays and things,
just free up cash, really. I understand that as a GP, I can earn quite a bit, but it's
the time that's more important to me, really.
Samuel: That makes sense. So, for you then is, is the property game ... is this like
a three, six month plan? Is it a three, six year plan? I mean, when are you wanting to
see results and start getting income from property? Are you thinking longterm? Or are
you thinking more short term or both?
Adam: One of my biggest drawbacks in the past with things when I was at uni, was sort of
patience. I know property is a longterm game and I've tried to slow myself down a bit this
time. I know that I'm, I'm really good at finding deals and things, getting in contact
with people if I'm interested in things. But I know it's a long term game and I'd really
like to this time really gain the education that I need before jumping into it. Obviously
there comes a point where you've got enough education, you really just need to get your
hands in and dirty, but I'm not sure I'm at that point yet. I think I just need a bit
of a push, really just getting into.
Adam: I mean obviously the team and surrounding myself with people that do it every day will
absolutely bring me on leaps and bounds. So, short term I'd love to... by the end of this
year, I'd quite like to move out of this flat and maybe borrow some money off family or
friends to have my own house. So, right now it's friends just to free up cashflow. So,
that's short term, but then I'm really [inaudible 00:05:59] to have longterm properties that
could sort of capital growth is obviously a massive thing, but also I know the cashflow
in the meantime is just as important really. So, I can sort of keep my head above in the
positive. Really. So, both.
Samuel: So what, what do you want from me?
Adam: Just some advice really, Samuel. I've followed your story on YouTube and I've read
your book, and you've really inspired me. I was just wondering ... Me being so time-poor
at the moment, obviously it's a bit of an obstacle that you know, the amount of hours
I work and I am prepared to take time off to do courses and things. I think that's really
important and I understand that I need to invest time. But, if there's any sort of,
any advice you'd give me that was ... for me to be the most time efficient as possible.
Will it me sort of like [inaudible 00:06:48], or if you've got anything else you think and
sort of work that into my plan.
Samuel: Well, I think there's a few things that you could be and should be doing. The
fact that you're based in Liverpool is really cool because a lot of people live in areas
that aren't really very good for investing, and have to drive six hours each way to get
to a place such as Liverpool. Whereas this is on your doorstep. So, I think that, that's
a real thing that you've got going for you. Second thing you've got going for you is that
you are switched on. You've, you've managed HMOs before. You've worked with landlords.
You know the crack? I think you've got a lot going for you. I think the things that you
need to bear in mind is, if you've not got money to invest, so you need to do strategies
such as sourcing and rent to rents and stuff, that's fine, but if you've not got money and
you've not got time, there needs to be something. You know, you need to put something in.
Samuel: So, I know that you're willing and you're hungry and stuff, but it's not going
to happen for you, or by accident. You need to make sacrifice to make it happen. So-
Adam: I know.
Samuel: So, what I would probably say in regards to what strategy to use, I'd probably do three
things. I'd do number one, I think it would be really good if you got a couple of rent
to rents in Liverpool. You could do service. You could find a couple of apartments and
redo them as low rent to serviced accommodation. Now you don't have to spend loads of time.
Like literally some of the guys that I'm working with, they'll take a week or two off work
and in that week or two they'll go and secure two or three deals. So it's not like, oh,
you need to work really hard for six months. Literally, it's just a case of maybe a few
days. You know, making some calls, viewing some properties. If you find some apartments
in Liverpool in the right part of Liverpool that you can rent for say five or 600 quid,
and you can get permission to rent them out on serviced accommodation. Get a company like
Aviva to manage the apartment and you can rake it in doing that, and Liverpool's a cracking
area for that.
Adam: Absolutely. It's finding the deals, isn't it.
Samuel: Well yeah, but you can do that. I mean, you're a reasonably switched on. You're
in the right area. So I think that would be one strategy. The second strategy that I'd
use alongside rent to rent would be I would be sourcing deals. So, any property that doesn't
work for you ... Let's say you find a rent to rent deal, but you need to invest 10 grand
into it and it's like, oh, and then you need to furnish it and it doesn't really stack
up for you ... Then, I'd be going on Facebook groups, so I'd been finding Facebook groups
where they allow you to talk about deals that you've got and I'd be selling the deals.
Adam: Sure, sure.
Samuel: One deal a month, sell one deal a month. Two, three grand, it's like a full
time income.
Adam: Wow, okay. That's crazy. When it comes to sourcing, obviously I've packet I've read
that it's best to package the deal, the more money you make from it.
Samuel: That's correct. If it's just a lead, like, oh, I've got, I've got a potential deal.
I've just found it. Then yeah, you might charge a few hundred quid, but if you can package
it up ... you could even, I know you're time poor, but you could even put a little power
team together in Liverpool and package it up with the team and you know, really go to
town on it and although you're going to have to work quite hard because you're working
full time as it is, it's short term pain for long term gain, delayed gratification. Alongside
all this stuff that you're doing in Liverpool, I would be putting aside a portion of your
income and saving it. I don't know, are you saving money every month?
Adam: You said, am I?
Samuel: Yeah.
Adam: Yeah, I'm trying to save between 750 to 1,000 quid if I can. It's quite big, so
I'm on about two and a half a month roughly. I'm trying to save like a grand if I can.
Obviously the first few months just paying back my overdraft, but then after that I'll
be going into the plus. The other thing I didn't tell you actually is, I know my mum
and dad have literally got about 100 odd K sitting in the bank. Dad's 60, he's retiring.
He's always wanted to do the property. My worry is that should they lend some of that
to me? You know, because it's family, I really want to sort of make sure I'm confident with
it so I can get them a return if they want the things. I don't want to mess around with
someone so close to me.
Samuel: Yeah, alright. Tell your mom and dad, that you've got a brilliant idea and that
you're really confident you can invest that money really well. But, before you even talk
about doing it, you want to get some deals yourself first. So, don't let them spend it
or invest it with anybody else. Get yourself a couple of rent to rents in Liverpool. Source
a couple of properties in Liverpool to other investors and get some money. Then your confidence
will be through the roof. Your knowledge will be through the roof, you'll have some savings
yourself and you'll be thinking, right? And then borrow the hundred grand off the parents
and by a couple of big HMO's in Liverpool.
Adam: Fantastic. That sounds quality. When it comes to the power team and things, do
you think it is still worth me spending first few couple of thousand quid on courses and
things like that to get myself going?
Samuel: Courses are great as long as they give you a return on investment. When you
invest in a property you need to see a return on investment. In the same way when you're
investing in a course, you need to see a return on investment.
Adam: Yeah. Obviously that's very helpful. My current problems are understand rent to
rent principle. But A, I don't have a power team in place. So, I need to do that, and
I guess anyone can do that, just sort of network and go on courses. So, I understand courses
are very valuable and I'm trying to get to [inaudible 00:12:38] I've booked some time
off and then I'll come down wherever you are.
Samuel: Let me take some of that. Yeah courses, obviously I wouldn't run training programmes
if I didn't think they were good. When you just go and do it and going get the deals,
suddenly the power team just come into place. Suddenly the correct contracts just come into
place. You can spend a long time learning and planning, but when you just do things
have got to come into place. So, what will happen is you'll find a rent to rent deal
and you'll be like, "Oh my goodness. I've got this rent to rent deal. It doesn't work
for me, so I need send it on." Then you'll be thinking, "You know what? It's worth me
taking two days, my time to go and spend two days in a room filled with 2 new investors
because not only will I learn, but I know that I'll also flog a deal and make two grand."
Because, you're going with actual questions, with actual deals to have reviewed with properties
to sell because you've done it.
Samuel: So, I wouldn't delay the doing before the learning. Especially if you're not risking
anything. If you're about to invest 100 grand into something, then I'd say go get education
first, but for yourself, I think you just got to start doing. Also, in regards to your
finances, you're using words like, "I'm going to try and save a thousand pounds a month
and see what I can do." Most people, they spend all their money on bills and different
things and then they save and invest what's left, but when you do that, there's always
nothing. So what you need to do is, when you get paid straight away, boom, you need to
put a thousand pounds or whatever it might be, aside into a different account that's
locked away that you can't touch. Then, the rest you pay your bills and everything like
that.
Samuel: Second, where you pay yourself first. Then, what will happen is miraculously the
bills would take care of themself, but also you'll be saving and that way come six, 12
months, you'll have enough money to buy your first little property. You can buy it to live
in and rent the rooms out. By that time, you'll have experience. You'll have money to invest
in your own property, will have some rent to rent deals. You'll have sourced a few properties
and then you'll be in a position where you can borrow the money off your folks.
Adam: Unbelievable. That's really helpful ... appreciate it a lot. So, straight out
then, look for these rent to rent deals say online, and so I'll go and view properties
through the agents and things.
Samuel: See it as a hobby. Instead of saying, "Oh, I'm going to go around the shops and
buy some clothes and go for a mackey's." Say, "I'm going to spend three or four hours going
and viewing five or six potential investment properties." Then, when you're doing it. you'll
start to get really good questions and instead of looking for the answers, you want to start
looking for the right questions.
Adam: Sure, sure. So obviously, it's area dependent, the serviced accommodation in the
centre of Liverpool.
Samuel: Yeah.
Adam: So, not a bad idea, is it? Obviously, quite a lot of landlords here, so packing
it in currently anyway. [crosstalk 00:15:33]
Samuel: Yeah. Service accommodation ... Yeah, absolutely. I'd be wanting to do that in Liverpool.
Is there anything else you need from me right now?
Adam: No, no that's so helpful. Any other advice? Obviously, like you say, when I find
these rent to rent deals, first thing, "Oh God, what do I do with it? How do I get it
..."
Samuel: Which is the right kind of question. That's the right kind of question that, "Oh
my gosh, I've got this rent to rent deal. What do I do with it." That would be a brilliant
problem to have.
Adam: Yeah. Okay.
Samuel: Instead of having a problem at the moment. Your problem is, "Oh, I haven't got
time. Oh, I'm frustrated. Oh no." That's a terrible problem. The problem you want is,
"Oh, what do I do this rent to rent?" You're always going to have problems, but you want
the right kind of problems.
Adam: I understand. That's really helpful to hear. I appreciate your time a lot. Thanks
very much anyway.
Samuel: Very welcome, bro. Take it easy. Keep me posted.
Adam: Thanks for talking to me.
Samuel: See you, man.