here's a Drake are you there sir
alright hi Drake how are you Jen would
like to talk to you alright I just want
to say I want to say I feel like an
official debate but it's one of those
fairly take turns with each other
talking sir what what was that I just
wanted to make sure like we go to head
fair conversation or hi we could both
have our fair points did you listen to
the last call yeah you were listening a
little bit did you think it was parent
fairly fair yeah okay okay so um you
know what we're running out of time here
we got some more callers on the line so
once you go ahead and and I guess tell
us what you want to talk about all right
it's agreed atheism doesn't have a
burden of truth right it's the rejection
of claims that haven't met their burden
of proof there's something in the proven
an atheist should accept the claim or
they would be maybe possibly
unscientific for an atheist to
disbelieve something that isn't true
even is okay
it's agreed there is no claim of which
is evidence will be true of which eight
years and currently disagree with so I
want to say asking to receive the Holy
Spirit they may be being filled with
emotion then falling down what causes
this what causes this phenomena I think
that's pretty well understood is it's an
emotional reaction to basically a social
situation when this happens in for
example in church there's an expectation
that people are going to receive the
Holy Spirit and that they're going to
behave in a certain way and usually
people that that undertake this ritual
have observed it many times and there's
a fair amount of social pressure in some
congregations for people to do this
it gets back to the last call and that
is somebody is told hey you're gonna be
filled with the Holy Spirit they pray
they get they have this feeling and then
they fall over and you're saying how do
you explain that well let's pretend that
I don't have any explanation for it at
all but I can look at the possible or at
least proposed explanations one is that
it's a natural response big you know
that's not tied to anything specific
about the religion because we see this
in all kinds of different religions and
even non religions - we could say that
oh they were in fact filled with the
holy spirit and that's what caused them
to fall down now we've got two proposed
explanations how do you figure out which
one is correct
because because it is worldwide it
happens all the time and that because
people accept it and explain it as their
own evidence as it being from the Holy
Spirit of God I would say because the
acts to receive the Holy Spirit and then
being filled with it or at least filled
with the emotion maybe being filled with
emotion then falling down to know that
what causes this so when I'm at the
craps table and I've got money on a four
and I and I plead for a four and I roll
the four is that divine intervention no
okay so you're willing to say that's not
divine intervention and yet you're
saying then because somebody asked for
the Holy Spirit and they think they've
received it that they therefore must
have I would say most evidence currently
it seems at least seems to point more
towards the source being God that's what
evidence how do you point towards God as
the source the Holy Spirit and then
falling down how is that evidence women
around the world all the time please
fill me with the Holy Spirit right now
and me too please no didn't happen and
you know what uh you know what it didn't
for the decades that I was a
bible-believing Christian either you
know it's fine that you can say this
sort of thing happens but when you
exaggerate we're going to point out how
silly that is some people don't
experience the motion sickness yes some
people that don't have don't experience
motion sickness correct other people do
and we can give them drown me in in
other drugs well no maybe some people I
don't maybe some people aren't capable
of experience they want some people are
and it actually it seems like most
people that through observations people
see it happen all the time
okay so when we've exposed that you
don't have any way to tell the
difference between whether it's the holy
spirit or not now you come up with an ad
hoc hypothesis that it's still the holy
spirit it's just that there's some of us
who can't possibly experience it how do
you know that's true
and by the way is that is that in
keeping with your religious teaching I
mean it doesn't do you think that God
can reach anybody or did he just make me
so that I can't have that experience I
mean I believe that some why don't I've
been to church for years and I believe
you have to you know you went to church
a long time Matt but uh yep I'm sure you
observed yourself people asked them to
be so the Holy Spirit and then stop most
people in my churches you're not really
I know I'm with the church and I've seen
it every time with the church people
always fall down yeah and and so and so
you're going to a church where the norm
is for people to fall down and I went to
a church where that wasn't the norm yeah
I in my church that was definitely not
the norm so it's definitely not
happening everywhere in fact if you had
fallen down in my church then when I
went to then someone would have called
911 to get you an ambulance because that
was not normal in my church now I've
been to I have been to other churches
I've been to Pentecostal churches where
they'll speak in tongues and flop around
on the floor alright okay
you believe that it might not be true
but it's true they definitely have
happened like every day okay yes we know
that people have this experience and
they claim that the source of this
experience is the Holy Ghost the
question is what evidence you have that
that's actually true
oh my point is that the most evidence I
guess that even if there isn't else
others like other than it being God all
of it is currently at least seems to
point more towards the source being okay
how can how can you say that the
evidence points towards God because I'm
going to say not only is there evidence
but it's satisfactory evidence because
you ask to receive the Holy Spirit first
so it'll point to God after you've
actually fell down and possibly even
been filled with so much emotion if we
were to test it and find yes there is
emotion involved because being filled
with the Holy Spirit
are you familiar with a guy named Jerry
DeWitt I mean most most times people
listen to music or what other occasions
do people fall down so much at church or
any other places or any other places
where people just fall down why is it a
good thing that people fall down oh just
what happens oh there's a Wikipedia
things about it yeah I understand
there's all kinds of stuff let me ask
you this if there is a God okay and
there's all kinds of people who believe
in this God and they think they believe
in the same God and church a when
they're filled with the Holy Spirit
they just feel good but don't fall down
and church B when they think they're
filled with the Holy Spirit they start
speaking in tongues and in church see
when they think they're filled with the
Holy Spirit they fall around and flop on
the floor and fall down
what kind of dick does this God have to
be did not actually provide actual
evidence to everybody else that he
exists rather than just making people
appear to do crazy unconnected things
while they're in church well I mean if
people ask to be so experienced their
body gets taken over with a little more
evidence of their mutant what more
evidence is needed I tell you what I
think the answered your own question
thanks a lot for the call drink because
if if your conclusion is that you really
just don't need any more evidence from
that you don't care that much about the
truth or how to fight yeah well my
question about Jerri DeWitt was that
Jerri has talked about this before
specifically with speaking in tongues
and that is that it's a learned behavior
and you know you learn by seeing this in
church over and over again so it's
there's no supernatural explanation or
anything there's nothing mysterious
about this people learn how to do this