HE ACCUSED RUSSIA OF ATTACKING
HUMANITARIAN CORRIDORS. SS OPEN
ALLOW THE FULL EVACUATION OF THE
CITY.
>> JOINING US A MEMBER OF THE
FOREIGN RELATIONS COMMITTEE,
REPUBLICAN SENATOR ROB PORTMAN
OF OHIO AND MEMBER OF THE ARMED
SERVICES COMMITTEE, DEMOCRATIC
SENATOR RICHARD BLUMENTHAL OF
CONNECTICUT WHO RECENTLY
RETURNED FROM A TRIP TO POLAND
WHERE HE MET WITH BORDER
OFFICIALS AND UKRAINIAN
REFUGEES.
>> YOU ALSO MET WITH AN
AMBASSADOR, LAST NAME
BRZEZINSKI, AND HE TOLD US THAT
HE WAS REALLY IMPRESSED WITH THE
BIPARTISAN NATURE.
>> YEAH.
>> OF --
>> SEVERAL GROUPS.
>> OF REPUBLICANS, DEMOCRATS,
TALKED ABOUT YOU ALL AND SEVERAL
OTHERS THAT REALLY, YOU ALL ARE
STANDING SHOULDER TO SHOULDER
TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE BEST
WAY FORWARD NOT ONLY FOR UKRAINE
BUT FOR THE WESTERN ALLIANCE.
>> AMERICA'S STANDING SHOULDER
TO SHOULDER WITH UKRAINE AND
ACROSS THE SPECTRUM AT HOME
TALKING ABOUT THIS.
THEY GET IT.
SEEING ON TV SCREENS EVERY
NIGHT, BARBARIC.
COWARDLY ATTACKED.
THE SAME TIME TROOPS ARE MAKING
PROGRESS ON THE GROUND PUSHING
RUSSIANS BACK, EVERY NIGHT
RUSSIA'S SHELLING THESE CIVILIAN
TARGETS.
HOME, HOSPITALS, CHURCH,
SCHOOLS.
I MEAN, IT'S HORRIBLE.
WE MET WITH THE REFUGEES COMING
ACROSS THE BORDER, AND IT WAS
HEARTBREAKING.
THEY'RE CRYING AND ASKING US TO
DO MORE.
>> TALK ABOUT THAT.
>> HMM.
>> THE GREATEST CRISIS, REFUGEE
CRISIS SINCE WORLD WAR II.
>> YOU KNOW, YOU THINK OF THE
MAGNITUDE OF IT IN THE NUMBERS,
THE STATISTICS ARE JUST --
DAUNTING.
3 MILLION -- CHILDREN AND WOMEN,
BECAUSE THE MEN HAVE STAYED
BEHIND TO FIGHT, BUT IN
INDIVIDUAL TERMS, I AM STILL
HAUNTED BY THOSE FACES AND
VOICES, PARTICULARLY OF THE
CHILDREN CARRYING THEIR PETS OR
THEIR STUFFED ANIMALS, AND THE
MOMS, ALL OF THEM JUST WANTING
TO GO HOME.
THEY JUST WANT TO GO HOME.
ONE WOMAN SAYING TO ME THROUGH
HER TEARS, NOTHING IS SAFE.
REMEMBER, THEY HAD JUST BEEN
THROUGH A BOMBING 12 MILES AWAY.
>> YEAH.
>> FROM THE UKRAINIAN BORDER.
WHERE THE RUSSIANS, THREW
MISSILES AT THEIR TOWN, TRAINING
CENTER, AND THEY WERE FLEEING
FROM THAT BOMBING, JUST 12 MILES
AWAY COMING ACROSS THE BORDER.
SO IT IS REALLY A HAUNTING
CATASTROPHE.
>> SENATOR PORTMAN, GOOD
MORNING.
YOU TALKED ABOUT THE HORRORS
THAT YOU'RE HEARING ABOUT FROM
THESE REFUGEES.
WE'RE HEARING THEM AS WELL AS
THEY CROSS INTO POLAND.
MORE THAN 2 MILLION OF THEM.
YOU TALKED ABOUT PRESIDENT
ZELENSKYY'S REQUEST TO DO MORE.
HIS BIG REQUEST THAT THE WEST
HAS NOT COMPLIED WITH IS A
NO-FLY ZONE.
I GATHER THAT YOU'RE IN FAVOR OF
THAT.
CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG.
WHAT ARE YOUR CONCERNS IF THERE
IS A NO-FLY ZONE IN PLACE?
DO YOU SHARE KEARNS WITH A NATO
JET, SAY, SHOOTING DOWN A
RUSSIAN PLANE?
>> I DON'T THINK THE NO-FLY ZONE
IS WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NOW.
I THINK WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AN
EFFECTIVE NO-FLY ZONE TO HAVE
ENOUGH ANTI-AIRCRAFT WEAPONS AND
ENOUGH PLANES TO BE ABLE TO
ENFORCE A NO-FLY ZONE OVER SOME
OF THESE CITIES THAT ARE JUST
GETTING MERCILESSLY SHELLED.
>> SAYING UKRAINIAN DOING BAD
AND NOT NATO TROOPS?
WHEN YOU SAY THE FACT OF A
NO-FLY ZONE?
>> WHAT HAPPENED LAST NIGHT,
VERY POSITIVE.
SLOVAKIA GAVE UKRAINE A 300s,
THE BEST ANTI-AIRCRAFT SYSTEM WE
HAVE AMONG ALLIES IN THAT REGION
AND BACKFILLED BY GERMANY AND
NETHERLANDS.
WHEN THE PRESIDENT GOES TO NATO
TODAY HE HAS TO ASK THEM TO DO
MORE.
STEP UP IN TERMS OF ALLOWING
WARSAW COUNTRIES THAT HAVE
WEAPONS INOPERABLE -- UKRAINIANS
KNOW TO HO USE THEM, INCLUDING
THE MiGs.
MiG-29s AND BACKFILL AND HELP
THEM.
WE SHOULD DO THE THING.
THE MOST POSITIVE THING I'VE
HEARD IN THE LAST FEW DAYS.
STEPPING UP, GERMANY, SLOVAKIA.
RICHARD TALKED ABOUT THE BOMBING
THAT OCCURRED OUTSIDE OF LVIV
WHEN WE WERE THERE, FIVE HOURS
BEFORE WE GOT THERE.
MOST MISSILES WERE SHOT OUT OF
THE AIR BY ANTI-AIRCRAFT
WEAPONS.
THANK GOD.
SOME GOT THROUGH AND KILLED 35
PEOPLE.
WOUNDED 134.
BUT WE NEED MORE OF THAT, AND
THERE'S NO REASON, JOE, WE
SHOULDN'T BE PROVIDING MORE.
RIGHT NOW IN OUR STOCKS HERE IN
AMERICA WE ARE TOLD FROM PUBLIC
REPORTING WE HAVE S-300s GOT
YEARS AGO.
>> AREN'T WE SENDING SOME OVER?
>> SENDING SOME.
THE KIND WE'RE SENDING NOT AS
POWERFUL OR EFFECTIVE AS THE
S-300s.
WE'RE SENDING SA-8s, LOWER
ALTITUDE.
WE NEED TO DO THE HIGH ALTITUDE
STUFF BECAUSE MISSILES ARE
COMING IN FROM RUSSIA, FROM
BELARUS.
>> DO YOU AGREE?
>> I AGREE TOTALLY.
A LOT OF ORDNANCE IS COMING FROM
OUTSIDE OF UKRAINE'S BORDER.
A NO-FLY ZONE REALLY WON'T
PREVENT A LOT OF THE BOMBING,
SHELLING, MISSILES.
I AGREE TOTALLY WITH ROB THAT WE
CAN SEND MORE OF THE AERIAL
DEFENSE, BUT ALSO MORE DRONES.
CALL ON OUR ISRAELI FRIENDS,
PERHAPS, TO CONTRIBUTE MORE
DRONES.
WE CAN PROVIDE MORE OF THE
TURKISH DRONES, WHICH PROVED
VERY EFFECTIVE.
>> LET ME STOP AND ASK.
WHY HAVEN'T WE DONE THIS
ALREADY?
I -- I -- I DO WONDER.
>> EASY FOR US TO SAY, BUT --
>> NO.
I JUST WONDER.
WHAT -- WHAT ARE YOUR NATO
ALLIES WAITING FOR IN TERMS OF
DRONES?
WHAT ARE WE WAITING FOR IN TERMS
OF ANTI-AIRCRAFT?
I MEAN -- I KNOW TURKEY'S DOING
MORE THAT IS THE QUESTION.
>> WHAT ARE WE WAITING FOR?
HERE WE ARE -- WE HAVE WAR
CRIMES, SENATOR.
>> DAY 27, JOE.
27 DAYS.
>> DAY 27.
SO --
>> DO WE WAIT UNTIL THE 50th
DAY?
HOW MANY MORE UKRAINIANS DIE
BEFORE WE GIVE THEM WHAT THEY
NEED TERMS OF ANTI-AIRCRAFT
WEAPONRY?
>> PRESSING AND TALK ABOUT THE
BIPARTISAN NATURE OF THIS TRIP,
CAME BACK PRESSING MORE FOR THE
URGENCY OF ACTION, AND NOT ONLY
ON A MILITARY FRONT ALSO THE
ECONOMIC FRONT WHERE STRONGER
SANCTIONS AND SENATOR PORTMAN
THE EXPERT ON THIS.
FORMER TRADE REPRESENTATIVE, BUT
IMPOSING THESE SANCTIONS ON ALL
THE RUSSIAN BANKS.
STRANGLE PUTIN'S WAR MACHINE
DENYING REVENUE FROM OIL AND
GAS --
>> AGAIN --
>> THAT'S A BIG TOPIC AT THE
NATO SUMMIT.
>> OKAY.
THAT'S MY QUESTION.
WHEN YOU SAY WE SHOULD BE DOING
DRONES OR MORE ECONOMIC SUPPORT,
ARE WE TALKING WE, THE UNITED
STATES, OR NATO AS A WHOLE?
BECAUSE NATO AS A WHOLE, WHAT
HAS NATO DONE?
ACTUALLY --
>> STARTING TO STEP UP MORE.
SHOULD HAVE STEPPED UP EARLIER,
IN MY VIEW TO DO MORE HELPING
BACKFILL AND THE ANTI-AIRCRAFT
WEAPONS.
AT THE SUMMIT MOST IMPORTANT TO
HAPPEN IS FOR PRESIDENT BIDEN TO
MOVE FROM ORGANIZING THIS, WHICH
HE'S DONE WELL, LEADING, AND
LEADING MEANS AN EMBARGO ON
RUSSIAN OIL AND GAS, BECAUSE THE
NUMBER ONE SOURCE OF REVENUE FOR
RUSSIA, OF COURSE, ITS ENERGY.
FUELING THIS WAR MACHINE.
ALL OF THESE SANCTIONS COMBINED
ARE NOT AS EFFECTIVE AS SAYING,
YOU KNOW WHAT?
NOT ONLY THE UNITED STATES NOT
BUYING MORE OIL.
FOR US, RELATIVELY A SMALL PART
OF OUR TOTAL CONSUMPTION, BUT IN
EUROPE, THESE NATO COUNTRIES.
THEY NEED TO ALSO STOP THIS,
SALE OF THIS, PURCHASE OF
RUSSIAN ENERGY.
THAT'S FUELINGING THE WAR
MACHINE.
WE NEED TO HELP BACKFILL THEM
INCLUDING WITH L & G.
PRODUCE THESE L & G PORTS,
EXPORT PORTS AND IMPORTS
RELATIVELY QUICKLY.
GET MOVING.
PROVIDE THE ENERGY THEY NEED.
WE'VE GOT IT, OTHER COUNTRIES
TO.
QATAR AND OTHERS WILLING TO STEP
IN AND HELP.
THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT
COULD COME OUT OF THIS SUMMIT.
CUT OFF REVENUE TO VLADIMIR
PUTIN.
>> ONE MORE POINT, BECAUSE WE
BEGAN ON THE HUMANITARIAN
CRISIS.
HOPEFULLY THIS WAR WILL END
SOON. AND THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN, WHO
AND THAT PRESIDENT BIDEN, WHO
HAS DEMONSTRATED EXTRAORDINARY
LEADERSHIP UNIFYING YATENATO AND
LEAD FROM THE FRONT.
PUSHING BIPARTISAN SINCE THIS
AND URGE THIS KIND OF ACTION
CONTINUOUSLY AND CONSTANTLY BUT
ALSO IN POLAND WHEN HE VISITS
THERE, HE WILL SEE THIS
HUMANITARIAN CRISIS AND HOPE
HE'LL LEAD AS WELL MOBILIZING
THE WORLD TO DO MORE TO HELP THE
POLS WHO HAVE OPENED THEIR
HEARTS AND ARMS AND A WAY THAT
IS SO INSPIRING, AS HAIR OTHERR
THE REFUGEE SITUATION IS VERY
UPLIFTING IS THE REACTION OF THE
POLISH PEOPLE.
THE POPULATION OF WARSAW
ACCORDING TO MARK BRZEZINSKI
GROWN 10 PERCENT.
THINK ABOUT THAT.
10% INCREASE.
A HUMANITARIAN EFFORT THAT
REALLY SHOULD UNITE THE WORLD.
>> LET'S TALK ABOUT JOE BIDEN'S
LEADERSHIP.
BOTH OF YOU SAYING HE NEEDS TO
LEAD.
HE NEEDS TO -- NEEDS TO -- HE'S
ORGANIZED, AND -- BOTH OF YOU
SAY DONE A GOOD JOB.
>> HE IS, YEAH.
>> ORGANIZED IT.
NEEDS TO LEAD IT.
OBVIOUSLY, I KNOW YOU UNDERSTAND
BETTER THAN MOST.
THERE IS IS A BALANCING ACT.
YOU CAN'T GET TOO FAR AHEAD OF
THE GERMANS OR TOO FAR AHEAD OF
THE FRENCH.
IT IS A CONSTANT BALANCING ACT.
IS IT NOT?
BECAUSE, YOU KNOW.
WE'VE GOTTEN AHEAD OF OUR ALLIES
BEFORE OVER THE PAST 20 YEARS,
AND IT HASN'T ALWAYS WORKED OUT
VERY WELL FOR THEM A. BALANCE,
BUT THEY'RE AHEAD OF US ON SOME
THINGS YOU KNOW.
SEIZE, FREEZE ASSETS OF
OLIGARCHS AND PROVIDING THAT
FUNDING FOR REFUGEE CRISIS IS
ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL.
GONE AHEAD OF US IN TERMS OF
TRADE.
SAID NO LONGER GET MOST FAVORED
NATION STATUS TRADING WITH
EUROPE.
YET WE'VE GET TO LEGISLATION
HERE IN THE CONGRESS THAT'S
STILL KICKING AROUND IN PART
INITIALLY PRESIDENT BIDEN
OPPOSED THAT.
FIVE THINGS OPPOSED AND LATER
DID THE OIL EMBARGO.
>> PASS THEED THE HOUSE, NOT THE
SENATE.
>> ADDED THINGS ON SENATE WASN'T
HAPPY ABOUT.
>> YOU GOT GIVE JOE BIDEN A BILL
BEFORE HE SIRENS THE BILL.
>> INITIALLY OPPOSED DOING IT.
MY ONLY POINT, THINGS THAT
EUROPEANS HAVE DONE AHEAD OF US.
NOT ENTIRELY ABOUT US TELLING
THEM TO CATCH UP.
BIG ISSUES, MILITARY ASSISTANCE
TO UKRAINE TO DEFEND THEMSELVES.
PARTICULARLY ANYTHING THAT HAS
TO DO WITH STOPPING THESE,
THESE, AS I SAID EARLIER,
COWARDLY AND BARBARIC BOMBINGS.
NEED TO HELP MORE ON.
DRONES, FOR EXAMPLE.
HELP US MORE.
TURKEY CAN HELP MORE THERE.
SECONDLY, GOT TO BE SURE THIS
OIL EMBARGO, OIL AND GAS EMBARGO
HAPPENS.
THESE ARE AREAS HE HAS TO KIND
OF GET NATO FRIENDS OUT OF THEIR
COMFORT ZONE AND LEAD.
LEAD BY EXAMPLE.
>> LET ME ASK THIS QUESTION TO
BOTH OF YOU.
SAY THERE'S A CHEMICAL WEAPONS
ATTACK.
IN MARIUPOL.
A TACTICAL NUCLEAR WEAPON USED
SOMEWHERE NEAR KYIV.
DOES NATO NEED TO GO IN AT THAT
POINT?
SENATOR START WITH YOU.
>> I THINK DEPENDING ON ITS
LOCATION.
USE OF CHEMICAL OR BIOLOGICAL
WEAPONS OR A TACTICAL NUCLEAR
WEAPON POTENTIALLY ENDANGERS ALL
NATO COUNTRIES BORDERING UKRAINE
SIMPLY BY VIRTUE OF THE
POTENTIAL FOR CONTAGION OR
RADIOACTIVITY.
THERE IS A VERY STRONG CASE TO
BE MADE THAT IT IS POTENTIALLY
AN ATTACK ON NATO AND NATO DOES
NEED TO BE INVOLVED.
WE OUGHT TOISH ISHBE VERY, VERY
CAUTIOUS AND I GIVE THE
PRESIDENT A GREAT SCORE ON THIS
AS WELL.
DELIBERATE AND PURPOSEFUL TAKEN
ACCOUNT OF THE RISK IN A VERY
RESPONSIBLE WAY.
BUT I DO THINK THAT THE USE OF
THAT KIND OF, OF
NON-CONVENTIONAL WEAPONS, AS A
MEMBER OF THE ARMED SERVICE
COMMITTEE, I WILL SAY, ALSO, A
CYBER ATTACK POTENTIALLY
CRIPPLING OUR UTILITIES, OUR
FINANCIAL SYSTEM.
OUR HEALTH CARE SYSTEM.
AND WE NEED TO BE CAUTIOUS, BUT
ALSO WE NEED TO DRAW SOME LINES