>>> WE ARE GETTING A NEW INSIDE LOOK AT WHAT LIFE WAS LIKE FOR
THE GENERALS WHO TOOK THEIR ORDERS FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP.
IN OUR FIRST LOOK OF A NEW BOOK WRITTEN BY SUSAN GLASSER AND
ROBERT BAKER THEY DESCRIBE THE CHAIRMAN OF THE JOINT CHIEFS OF
STAFF GENERAL MARK MILLEY TALKING TO THE PRESIDENT BEFORE
TALKING THE TRACH JOB AND IT ASSURED HIM, MR. PRESIDENT, YOU
WILL BE MAKING DEET SIGNIFICANCES, I CAN GUARANTEE
I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU AN HONEST ANSWER.
I WILL GIVE YOU AN HONEST ANSWER ON EVERYTHING I CAN AND YOU ARE
GOING TO MAKE THE DECISIONS AND AS LONG AS THEY'RE LEGAL I WILL
SUPPORT IT. AS LONG AS THEY'RE LEGAL, IT WAS
NOT CLEAR HOW MUCH THAT CAVEAT EVEN REGISTERED WITH TRUMP.
JOINING US NOW IS SUSAN GLASSER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST AND
STAFF WRITER AT THE NEW YORKER THE CO-USER OF "THE DIVIDER"
BILLED AS THE INSIDE STORY OF THE FOUR YEARS WHEN DONALD TRUMP
WENT TO WAR WITH WASHINGTON. SUSAN, I REALLY WANT TO GET TO
YOU SPEAKING ABOUT YOUR BOOK BUT I WANT TO TALK ABOUT WHAT MAY BE
THE MOST INTERESTING PART OF IT, WHICH IS THE RESIGNATION LETTER
THAT MARK MILLEY WROTE BUT DIDN'T SEND.
I'M GOING TO READ A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT SO THAT YOU CAN SPEAK
ABOUT IT. THIS WAS DRAFTED IN JUNE OF 2020
AFTER WHAT HAPPENED IN WASHINGTON OUTSIDE THE WHITE
HOUSE WITH THE USE OF THE MILITARY.
AND HE SAID, IT IS MY BELIEF THAT YOU WERE DOING GREAT AND
IRREPARABLE HARM TO MY COUNTRY. I BELIEVE THAT YOU HAVE MADE A
CONCERTED EFFORT OVER TIME TO POLITICIZE THE UNITED STATES
MILITARY. I THOUGHT THAT I COULD CHANGE
THAT. I'VE COME TO THE REALIZATION
THAT I CAN'T. HE GOES ON TO SAY, YOU ARE USING
THE MILITARY TO CREATE FEAR IN THE MINDS OF THE PEOPLE.
THE AMERICAN PEOPLE TRUST THEIR MILITARY AND THEY TRUST US TO
PROTECT THEM AGAINST ALL ENEMIES, FOREIGN AND DOMESTIC,
AND OUR MILITARY WILL DO JUST THAT.
AND HE SAID, THIRD, I SWORE AN OATH TO THE CONSTITUTION OF THE
UNITED STATES THAT SAYS ALL MEN AND WOMEN ARE CREATED EQUAL.
HE SAYS, IT'S OBVIOUS TO ME THAT YOU DON'T HOLD THOSE VALUES DEAR
AND THE CAUSE THAT I SERVE. AND LASTLY, HE SAID, IT IS MY
DEEPLY-HELD BELIEF THAT YOU ARE RUINING THE INTERNATIONAL ORDER,
WHICH WAS INSTITUTED IN 1949. HE SAYS, YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND
WHAT THE WAR WAS ABOUT, IN FACT, YOU SUBSCRIBE TO MANY OF THE
PRINCIPLES THAT WE FOUGHT AGAINST.
BUT, SUSAN, HE NEVER SENT IT. >> WELL, THAT'S RIGHT.
IT'S REALLY -- IT'S REALLY POWERFUL TO HEAR.
WE MAY HAVE HAD A SENSE OF A CONFLICT BETWEEN TRUMP AND MANY
OF THE GENERALS WHO WORKED WITH HIM, BUT TO HEAR IN THEIR OWN
WORDS THEIR FEAR THAT THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES
WAS IN EFFECT A ROGUE PRESIDENT, THAT HE WAS NOT EVEN A
SUBSCRIBER TO MANY OF THE IDEALS OF THE CONSTITUTION.
AFTER LAFAYETTE SQUARE, THAT WAS A MISTAKE, THAT WAS A BIG
DISASTER IN MANY WAYS FOR MARK MILLEY, THE CHAIRMAN OF THE
JOINT CHIEFS AND THE THEN DEFENSE SECRETARY MARK ESPER
MARCHING THROUGH LAFAYETTE SQUARE.
IT GAVE THE APPEARANCE OF THE MILITARY PARTICIPATING IN
POLITICS. HE APOLOGIZED FOR IT, BUT HE WAS
AGONIZED ACCORDING TO OUR REPORTING ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT
TO RESIGN. CONSULTED WITH MANY WHO SAID,
LISTEN, WE DON'T HAVE A TRADITION OF RESIGNATION IN
PROTEST FOR OUR UNIFORMED MILITARY AND THAT IT WOULD
ACTUALLY BE MORE IMPORTANT TO REMAIN IN OFFICE.
REMEMBER, THIS IS SIX MONTHS BEFORE JANUARY 6.
SO TO READ THOSE WORDS NOW WHEN WE KNOW ABOUT THE CATACLYSMIC
ENDING OF THE TRUMP PRESIDENCY. THIS IS A THROUGH LINE WE FOUND
IN OUR REPORTING GOING ALL THE WAY BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THE
TRUMP PRESIDENCY, THE CONFLICTS WITH THE GENERALS, CURRENT AND
FORMER, BEGAN ALMOST FROM DAY ONE OF THE TRUMP PRESIDENCY
BECAUSE TRUMP WAS DETERMINED TO CHALLENGE THEIR CONVENTIONS.
AT ONE POINT A SENIOR GENERAL EVEN TOLD HIM THAT'S WHAT
DICTATORS DO, TO SOMETHING TRUMP WANTED TO DO.
>> THAT'S A HELL OF A RESIGNATION LETTER.
MARK MILLEY DIDN'T SEND IT, BUT HE LISTS OUT THE THINGS THERE.
THAT WAS REMARKABLE TO ME THAT HE EVEN THOUGHT ABOUT SENDING
THAT AND I GUESS WE CAN DEBATE FOR GENERATIONS ABOUT WHETHER OR
NOT IT WOULD HAVE HAD A BIGGER IMPACT HAD HE QUIT AT THE TIME.
SUSAN, SOME OTHER NEWS FROM YOU IN THIS BOOK WITH PETER BAKER,
YOUR HUSBAND, WHERE TRUMP IS QUOTED AS TELLING HIS
GENERALS -- AND I WILL READ THIS -- YOU EFFING GENERALS, WHY
CAN'T YOU BE LIKE THE GERMAN GENERALS, WHICH GENERALS, JOHN
KELLY ASKED, AND THEN TRUMP SAID THE GERMAN GENERALS IN WORLD WAR
II. THAT IN AND OF ITSELF
INTERESTING AND MAYBE DISTURBING TO SOME PEOPLE BUT THEN IT WENT
ON FROM THERE, A LITTLE BIT OF A HISTORY LESSON, SUSAN.
>> YOU KNOW, JOHN, IT'S BREATHTAKING, HONESTLY.
YOU KNOW, THIS IS A CONFRONTATION, A CONVERSATION
BETWEEN THE THEN WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF JOHN KELLY AND
DONALD TRUMP AND, YOU KNOW, YOU ALMOST CAN'T BELIEVE IT, BUT THE
PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES WAS UNHAPPY BECAUSE HE FELT THAT
HIS GENERALS AS HE CALLED THEM, THE AMERICAN GENERALS, WERE NOT
AS LOYAL AS HE PERCEIVED THE NAZI GENERALS UNDER HITLER TO
BE. HE THOUGHT THAT WAS THE BETTER
MODEL FOR A GENERAL. NOW, JOHN KELLY AS YOU SAID
SCHOOLED TRUMP AND TRIED TO SAY, WELL, WAIT A MINUTE, MR.
PRESIDENT, THEY WEREN'T COMPLETELY SUBSERVIENT AND THEY
TRIED TO HILL HITLER THREE TIMES AND TRUMP INTERRUPTED HIM AND
SAID THAT'S NOT RIGHT, THEY WERE COMPLETELY LOYAL.
SHOCKING. >> IT IS SHOCKING.
AND THE POLITICIZATION OF THE MILITARY WHICH MILLEY TALKS
ABOUT IN HIS RESIGNATION LETTER THAT HE NEVER SENT, THE FACT
THAT THE MILITARY IS SUPPOSED TO BE APOLITICAL IS A HALLMARK OF
AMERICAN SOCIETY AND IT'S SO INTERESTING YOU'RE DESCRIBING IN
SUCH DETAIL, SUSAN, HOW THE MILITARY ITSELF WAS FIGHTING TO
PRESERVE THAT AS A CIVILIAN COMMANDER WAS FIGHTING TO
BASTARDIZE THAT. >> YOU KNOW, I THINK YOU PUT
YOUR FINGER ON T BRIANNA. THIS IS LIKE THERE'S NO
HANDBOOK, THERE IS NO GUIDE IN THE CONSTITUTION FOR WHAT TO DO
WHEN THE PRESIDENT HIMSELF IS A NATIONAL SECURITY THREAT, AND
THEY BELIEVE -- YOU KNOW, THAT CIVIL MILITARY RELATIONSHIP IS
ALMOST A RELIGION FOR THE MOST SENIOR GENERALS, AS YOU KNOW, IN
OUR MILITARY AND I THINK THIS CONFLICT -- AGAIN, THE THROUGH
LINE -- THIS DID NOT START AFTER THE NOVEMBER 2020 ELECTION,
RIGHT? THERE WERE THESE CONFLICTS ABOUT
THE ROLE IN THE MILITARY, TRUMP WANTED TO CLOAK HIMSELF IN THE
POWER AND THE PHOTO OPS AND WHAT HE PERCEIVED TO BE THE STRENGTH
OF THE MILITARY FROM DAY ONE OF HIS PRESIDENCY AND, YOU KNOW,
WHAT I WAS STRUCK BY IS THE RECURRING THEME OF THIS.
YOU KNOW, THERE'S A FIGHT WITH THE GENERALS IN THE FIRST SUMMER
OF HIS PRESIDENCY OVER A MILITARY PARADE.
THAT WAS WHAT I WAS MENTIONING ABOUT THE VICE CHAIR OF THE
JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF IN THE OVAL OFFICE TELLING HIM, NO, MR.
PRESIDENT, WE CAN'T DO THE KIND OF PARADE YOU WANT.
THAT'S WHAT DICTATORS DO. RIGHT THERE IN THE OVAL OFFICE.
SO IT WAS A CONFLICT FROM DAY ONE.
>> WHAT OTHER JUICY TIDBITS ARE GOING TO BE OUT IN THIS BOOK?
WE ARE JUST GETTING A TASTE OF IT NOW IN "THE NEW YORKER," BUT
WHAT ELSE DO YOU HAVE IN THERE? >> WELL, IT'S COMING SOON, BUT,
LOOK, IT'S VERY -- THIS IS SIGNIFICANT.
WE FELT THAT IT WAS IMPORTANT TO DO A BOOK ON THE FOUR YEARS OF
THE TRUMP PRESIDENCY AND TO REALLY TRY TO UNDERSTAND THAT
THIS THREAT TO DEMOCRACY AFTER THE 2020 ELECTION DID NOT COME
OUT OF NOWHERE AND IN SOME WAYS GOING BACK TO THE EARLY YEARS OF
THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION THERE WERE SOME EXTRAORDINARY THINGS
THAT NEVER BECAME PUBLIC THAT HELPED TO UNDERSTAND THE MESS
THAT IT ALL ENDED UP IN. >> IT'S SO INTERESTING.
THERE'S THIS WHOLE ACADEMIC REALM OF CIVILIAN MILITARY
RELATIONS. IT CAN BE KIND OF LOFTY, BUT WE
SAW IT ALL PLAY OUT IN VERY REAL TERMS UNDER THE TRUMP
ADMINISTRATION AND HERE YOU ARE WRITING THIS FANTASTIC BOOK
TAKING US THROUGH ALL OF IT. SUSAN, THANK YOU SO MUCH.
AND THE BOOK OF COURSE IS "THE DIVIDER" AND YOU CAN PICK THAT
UP SOON. >> THIS FALL.