Oh, okay. Why? Why do I have to cover?
Wearing a hijab is a choice. Right?
So it's our fault. And we are... we have no choice in the matter of,
or we have to protect ourselves because men can't control themselves .
Did you choose to take your hijab off?
I never had a hijab.
Okay, you never wore it?
Okay.
Are you telling me that as a woman, you choose not to wear the hijab?
I say no, and I will prove it. Let me tell you how.
In this Islam, you say, you know what?
I don't know, I don't like this.
- Okay, why do I have to cover?
- Okay. - Why? - Firstly, because number one, firstly,
because God said so.
Why do I have to- - No, okay, but like, so why?
Why is it- - Yeah. - That if I am not covered, for example.
- Yeah.
- I truly believe also that in Islam,
if you are a true believer of Islam.
- Yeah. - You also believe that, for example,
let's say I am a practicing Muslim and I'm not with hijab.
- Yeah. - That I can still go to heaven 100%.
- Okay, if you don't wear what? - A hijab.
- Yeah, no one said- - No one said, you go to hell if you don't wear it
by the way. - I know, I know.
- Yeah. - That's what I'm saying. - That's why I say that
wearing a hijab is a choice, right?
- No, it's not a choice.
Let tell you something.
- Okay. - And you're gonna like this.
- So you're telling me it's not a choice?
- No.
- Let me tell you why?
- But if I don't do it, and I am a practicing Muslim-
- I won't go to hell, but it's not a choice?
- You will go where?
- I'll go to hell. - No, who said that?
- So, but what, no, no.
- Is there any prescribed punishment for a woman that doesn't wear hijab?
- No, but then why is it forced upon me
if it's not something that will lead me, for example, so yeah.
So why is it something that is not a choice,
so you don't have a choice you have to cover,
but if you don't cover and you are a practicing good Muslim,
that does not mean you'll go to hell.
But you have to cover, why?
- Okay, good question.
Have you read a book called "Beauty Sick"?
- No.
- Okay, I want you to buy this book if it's possible.
- What's it called?
- "Beauty Sick".
- "Beauty Sick"?
written by non-Muslim..
- Okay.
- It's a very good book.
- Yeah.
- Now this book is very interesting because we have this false notion-
- That when a woman takes her hijab off,
she chose to take it off.
I believe this is the biggest false fallacy ever.
- Okay. - You know why?
- Why? - Because, I'm asking you a question.
Did you choose to take your hijab off?
- I never had a hijab.
- Okay, you never wore it.
- Never.
- Okay, are you telling me that as a woman
you choose not to wear the hijab?
- Yes. - I say no, and I'll prove it.
Let tell you how.
Are you telling me that the beauty industry,
the females around you, the society that you live in,
have no effect on you and the way you are perceived.
And that has no element on you that you may feel,
because the book that I referred to you
called "Beauty Sick" tells you about women
who are beauty sick.
Their sickness is beauty.
- Okay.
- Which is what?
When someone comes to me and says,
I choose to wear the hijab.
I'm like, please don't lie.
You wear the hijab 'cause Allah told you to,
and now somebody comes and says, well,
that Islam is oppressive.
And I say, well, no, hold on a second.
Because the very woman who wear mini skirts,
who go get their, excuse me, their breasts done.
- Their backside done, their hips done, their nose done,
can you imagine they smash their nose?
You know your nose, it gets smashed.
- And then reshaped.
This is very important. - (indistinct) someone.
- The point is this, are you telling me these people
go and say, I choose to?
No, you don't choose to.
You do it because the beauty industry,
the standards that the society have put a bar on,
you are trying to reach those at the cost that you can even lose your life.
There was a Mexican, Brazilian woman who died
because she got implants on her backside.
- Yeah, yeah, yeah, I saw that, but- - She died, so this-
- But then your argument is actually nul and void
because the same way that a woman will choose
or has no choice to wear hijab, but also does these things to herself-
- Yeah.
- And it's like, oh, that's not her choice.
- Yes. - Then where do you meet in the middle?
And where is the choice?
- This is where you meet in the middle.
The point is this, nobody has a choice. Listen carefully.
- But then why do you have free will
if you don't have a choice, what's the **** point?
If God, sorry, excuse me for swearing.
- It's all right.
- So why has God... Okay, so your argument here is telling me
that God gives you free will and allows you
to have free will, but you do not have a choice-
- Okay, let me-
- In any matter?
- No, listen to me carefully.
You have free will, you have a choice in what sense?
Which one to follow.
- So you're given free will just to choose God?
- No, no, no.
Listen, let me explain.
- Right, no?
- Let me explain it.
- Okay.
- For example, both of them don't have no choice.
The one who goes and gets her nose done and has make up
and can't leave the house without makeup,
being in front of the window for two hours, et cetera.
Okay, and the woman who wears the hijab-
- Yeah. - They are both told to do so.
One is told to do so by the one who created us - By God and one is told by the society?
thank you.
Now, one second.
This is where it's crucial.
- Which one is deserving of being listened to
the One who Created you or Society?
- I mean, if you believe-
- Not believe, if arguments say-
- If you believe.
- If God exists.
- Okay. - And He's telling you, and by the way,
we as men cover up as well.
- I mean, yeah, but that's a theoretical question
that you're asking me because how like- .....
- But I'll ask you theoretically.
- Yeah, so if someone was-
- Who is more deserving of being obedient to?
- I mean, if that is your argument-
- Then of course it's your Creator, that obedience over society.
So what we learn here, sister today,
both individuals have no choice.
They are both told to do something.
- Okay. - One is from the Creator.
- Yeah. - One is from the creation.
- This is where I accepted Islam because I said,
hold on a second. - Okay.
- And I'll give you this personal story. I used to have a jumper like this.
It was a black one.
- Okay. - I thought I looked really handsome in it.
No, I genuinely thought I look,
I look very good in this jumper.
I mean, I think I look very good.
Maybe some people might differ
and I used to hate the jumper, it used to make me itch.
When I used to be in the club, I used to itch,
but I just hated about, I was like, no, I look good, yeah?
I said to myself, you know what?
I'm the biggest slave, this is my master.
This jumper is my master.
It's like girls who walk into clubs with this much heels
and they have to take it off in winter
and it's freezing cold.
Have you ever stood on pavement?
But when I look at them, I feel the pain, I feel the pain.
And the thing is I'm like, that is your slave.
And just as me,
when I was getting a jumper or driving a certain car,
or going to the gym, I'm not saying, you can go to the gym for healthy reasons.
- So you're basically saying, you'd rather be a slave-
- To the one who created me-
- To someone bigger than me-
- Exactly. - Than to the society that I live in.
- You know why sister?
- Because the creation is never gonna happen with me.
When I die, they're gonna back bite me. They're gonna talk bad of me.
The Creator is the one that's gonna be with me.
He's the one who created me.
He deserves my worship.
Why would I go and try to please a group of people
that are never gonna be happy with me?
And the one who created me deserves it.
And guess what?
Once I became a slave to Him
is when I found my true freedom.
Once I became a slave to Him-
- That's a very good point honestly.
- Sister, the point I'm trying to say here is this, yeah?
-it's a good point.
- Thank you, may Allah bless you.
Thank you, I appreciate.
- It's logical.
- And this is the key sister, you know why?
Because at this moment-
- Yeah. - That is when it clicked me.
And I said, wow!
All this life, my masters were females.
My masters were the jumper I used to wear.
My masters was money.
I used to live a lifestyle and do extra hours
so I can drive a certain car.
I used to go to the gym.
Yes, obviously for health reason,
but I wanted have big bicep
so when I walk and wear that jumper,
the girls can be like, wow, look at his biceps!
I used to live, these were my masters.
These were my Gods.
You know what I said?
When I said, (There is no god but Allah).
I said, I am free from all of you
because I wanna worship the One who has created me.
And this is where we say sister,
when we talked about choice, the one that takes a hijab,
look, we have a lot of hijab influences.
We take the hijab off and they go, I chose to.
No, you didn't.
You getting older and you look,
you feel like you're getting wrinkly and ugly
and you're showing the hair as beauty.
And that is the reason why you're told, don't say,
I chose to.
Say, but I was forced to.
- But then there's like, so in terms of the not having a choice there-
- Yeah.
- For something like that.
- Yeah, for example, it then comes down to equality again,
which literally just circles us all the way back, but...
- [Man] Can I add one point?
- Yes, yes. - yeah.
- [Man] (indistinct).
- No, no camera.
- [Man] You know why you're talking-
- Can we have your voice?
- [Man] Yeah, you know why you're talking about choice?
- Yeah.
- [Man] You don't have a choice
whether to wear clothes or not, do you in a society?
- Yeah, you don't.
- [Man] No, so there's a certain level of dressing decorum,
regardless of however liberal you are,
you cannot come naked.
You have to wear a (indistinct),
this is imposed upon you, right?
- Yeah.
- [Man] Similarly, you should not equate
someone putting on clothes to someone who the society
tell you to put on clothes, to society tell you
to take it off, this is a false equivalence. - Yeah, no, no, no, that was...
Yeah, yeah, that wasn't the point.
- You have to be on camera, Bro, allow this camera.
Let's speak to the family, I call them, I call them.
But did you get what I'm trying to say?
- No, no, no, no, I understand.
- You know why it relates to you perfectly?
Because sometimes we go into this mentality
where we think the life I'm living, I'm free.
You are not, your influenced one way or another,
because why as a woman, for example, the question is,
and this is what's so beautiful about Islam.
Let me tell you something.
Before I used to see women as a piece of meat.
Wallahi I had no respect for them.
You know why?
Because the society made me like this.
And when I came to Islam, a woman,
they became human in my eyes because Islam told me
that you honor them, you respect them.
It's not, what is she?
You're talking to her.
You're not talking to someone else.
- [Man] Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- And this is the issue sister,
and there's men here, there's men everywhere.
The point is this,
and I'm not saying women are perfect.
There are a lot of, women as well.
Let be honest here.
The point is this, that women are sexualized.
Man, I'm walking down, I'm driving down the ...
- Okay, okay, no, no, no.
- Okay, I'm I in trouble?
- Now you're bringing a whole new conversation into it.
- Okay.
So it's our fault and we have no choice in the matter of
or we have to protect ourselves
because men can't control themselves.
- No, I never said that.
I never said that.
- Oh my God and women are sexualized!
- I never said that, I never said that.
Did I say that? No. - Women are sexualized.
- No. - Why are we sexualized?
Because the brain of men can't separate it, for me-
- What does Allah say in the Quran?
You know what Allah says in the Quran?
- I don't know, you tell me, you're the expert.
- Okay, sister, I'm not the expert.
I'm a nobody.
I think you know much-
- No, you're the expert, tell me why.
- We're both not the expert.
- Tell me why.
- Sister Allah says in the Quran,
tell the believing men to lower their gaze.
- Yeah, they should.
- One second, Allah doesn't say women cover up
'cause men can't control their self.
- I know, but why?
But then why?
So if men shouldn't be gazing and sexualizing-
- Yes. - And making all of this.
- Yes. - Then why do I-
- Yes. - And you have no choice.
- Yeah. - But to also cover up to protect myself.
- No, no, no, no, no, no.
- For what?
- Listen to me. Allah says to me,
tell the believing man to lower their gaze.
- Okay.
- That means if she's in a bikini and she's in a niqab,
if she's in a jilbab, irrelevant, I have to lower my gaze.
I'm not gonna say, oh, she's wearing a bikini,
man can look at her now.
- No, no, no, no. - Or she's wearing niqab,
I have to lower my gaze, period.
- Okay.
- Now-
- But then why?
- No, no, no, you know what that means?
That means this notion that men can't control their self,
that's why Allah tells you to cover up, is not true.
Because Allah tells who?
The believing men first.
Tell the believing men to lower their gaze.
- Okay, (indistinct).
- Now Allah works in a micro level.
You know what that means?
- Yeah. - You're training your young boys-
- To respect women by lowering their gaze.
- Now how does Allah deal with it in a macro level?
By saying, do not sexually objectify women.
Now, if I am looking all around me and I see bikini woman
in there that's talking about chocolate.
And I'm thinking, what's chocolate got to do with a bikini?
- Yeah.
- And then I'm seeing a woman over there,
arguments say, dressed up in this way and that way,
the society is sexually objectifying women.
Look, I was watching a documentary yesterday, yeah?
- Yeah. - It was talking about in the 1970s,
Times Square in New York was a, oh, it's disgusting.
- Yeah. - There was a man who killed 80 prostitutes
and these women were de...
They were not human.
- Yeah, dehumanized.
- There was a study that was done-
- Yeah. - That looked into a man's brain.
They showed him woman in bikini.
The part of the brain that lights up for tool you ...., screwdriver?
- Lit up.
You know what that means?
He didn't even see them as human.
The part of the brain was like, this is an object.
How does a human being and a lot of serial killers,
you know how, they had something in common.
They always watch pornography.
The point is this, men are created visually.
If you sexually objectified women to such a level,
men lose respect.
This doesn't mean that a person has a right to go
and abuse or rape or whatever,
just because a woman is dressed up in a certain way.
There are women who are dressed up in hijab in the niqab that get raped.
- The point is this sister, everyone has a role to play.
My role is I lower my gaze,
but I would not also like you to,
this woman to be in my face
or dressed up in a certain way where I'm like,
well, I would not like to see that.
The point is this, Islam deals,
given the responsibility to both.
It doesn't say, hey, you men are animals.
You are to blame.
It's your fault, you cover up.
Islam doesn't see that.
- But the same way that women are sexualized,
men can be sexualized as well.
So then why are men?
- How?
- You can sexualize, I'm sorry, but-
- My sister, let me tell you something, yeah?
- Men can be sexualized too.
- Let me tell you why sister, yeah.
I've never seen a woman ever go and say,
you know what?
Let me go and there's a picture of a man's calves,
let me go and stare it.
That's not her nature.
You know nature- - Men go and stare at women's calves?
Bruh, okay, I don't know what, calves?
- Sister, sister.
- Just calves?
- Sister, sister, sister-
- Calves? I know men's mind.. - I know (indistinct) that lose their mind,
they lose their mind when they see a toe.
Okay, when they see ankle,
his temperature starts rising.
His blood pressure goes somewhere else.
The way we're created sister, we are visual.
We are so visual that...
The point is, that's why for example- 430 00:14:02,000 --> 00:13:40,575 So what I'm trying to say sister,
What I am telling you, sister, is that Allah is telling you,
this is the best way to live your life.
And I'm telling you sister, look here.
There's a lot of things I had to give up
when I came to Islam.
A lot of things I did not want to let go of,
but let me tell you something, letting go of them,
it made me who I am today.
Islam is the solution.
There is no other religion I'm telling you,
it might sound here, okay, here we go, my religion is...
I'm telling you, we can prove it.
I'm not here to talk, I can prove it.
Islam gives me purpose.
I know my purpose.
I know why I'm here, I know where I'm going.
I know what to live by.
If we live by these laws, et cetera,
wallahi I'm telling you, life will not be,
you know, utopia, yeah?
Okay, the point is this though,
that we will have a good way of living.
Yes, in the Muslim empires, there was killing.
There was things that happened.
But the point is this, Islam is the best solution.
And guess what?
You are going to live by a way of life anyways.
And you already are.
Live by the one that God sent you
because that's the best.
- You make very good points.
- I had a very nice conversation with you.
- Me too, sister, Alia.
- I know I've been trying-
- Oh my gosh!
I think it's been an hour probably.
- I think so too.
- Thank you.
Sister Alia look, thank you.
We don't shake hands.
- We don't.
- Yes, but you know why? - Why? - 'Cause, out of respect.
But the thing is you see-
- Why? - I see that as a little bit disrespect.
- Good, but we need to end it with this.
You know why?
Because there was, I think,
you know the MeToo movement?
Remember the MeToo movement.
- Of course, I know the MeToo movement.
- You know now in workplaces, back in the day,
not back in, a couple years ago in the workplace,
they could touch a woman like, you know?
- Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- They can't do that anymore.
- You know in the workplace they have to leave the door open now.
- Do you see Islam has come and told you, look,
prevention is better than cure.
Islam is one solution.
It doesn't say drink alcohol then we'll take you to rehab.
Islam says, don't drink alcohol.
The point is this sister, me and you, for example,
a handshake is nothing.
We can say, okay, what's the big deal?
- But it's interesting that you see as a sign of respect.
- But to me, I feel like I'm honoring you so much
that I don't even wanna shake your hand.
Not because there's anything wrong with you,
because you know why?
'Cause that's the level of respect I have for you.
But society's made it seem as if you know what?
Look how disrespectful he is.
- No, I don't think you're disrespectful.
It's your prerogative to not wanna shake my hand.
- No, I do, 'cause I honor and respect you.
- Well, thank you.
- (speaks foreign language) that's why I do it.
- Shukran.
- May Allah bless you.
You are a lovely person.
- You too. - It was lovely talking to you, sister.