(upbeat music)
>> Announcer: Live from Barcelona, Spain,
it's theCUBE.
Covering Cisco Live 2020.
Brought to you by Cisco and it's ecosystem partners.
>> Welcome back to Barcelona everybody.
This is theCUBE, the leader in live tech coverage.
We go out to the events
and extract the signal from the noise.
My name is Dave Vellante, I'm here with my co-hosts
Stu Miniman, John Furrier is also in the house.
We're here with Ryan Rose, Technical Program Manager
at Cisco Devnet.
Ryan, great to see you.
What's goin' on? >> Hey, thank you so much.
I'm really glad to be here.
>> You know, we have a soft spot in our heart,
for Devnet, because of course, we're in the Devnet zone,
Devnet is the reason why theCUBE originally
came to Cisco Live, and so it's been awesome
seeing the evolution and the ascendancy of DevNet.
It's now mainstream, you get a lot of love
on the main stage, and really, it is the linchpin
of the next generation of training and certifications
for the engineers, the network engineers.
So, tell us, give us a little quick history of Devnet,
You've been here since the beginning,
you remember the first Devnet.
>> Oh yeah, in fact, so during my time at Cisco,
like I was originally in learning at Cisco
and being able to move over into Devnet,
but I remember the very first Devnet experience
that I had, and it started back when Devnet started
about five years ago now.
It was at Cisco Live San Francisco.
At the time, they had split us across two streets,
you know, they were trying to put, Cisco was trying to put
a lot of activities going on in San Francisco.
And they put Devnet in this walkway
that was next to the Moscone Center,
and, inside the Moscone Center.
And when you went in there, it was packed.
I mean, it was just shoulder to shoulder.
Everyone there was just so excited
because everyone was trying to learn,
like, what is Devnet?
And now, to look back on that, it's just so crazy
how people have just been so quick to embrace
the Devnet mission, the Devnet philosophy.
Really getting into automation and programmability.
And it's so exciting for us every year to be coming back,
seeing you at theCUBE, being here in the Devnet zone,
and being able to help people continue on that journey.
Yeah, it's been great.
>> Yeah, so, and we got some hard news to talk about today,
I said in my breaking analysis this week
that Cisco, when it rose, it pulled a number of levers,
and one of them was really creating the role
of the Network Engineer, the CCIE, and the certifications.
People have really understood the challenges
of what Stu calls the dark art of networking.
And now you're bringing that sort of hardware certification
to software, so let's get right into the news.
What are you guys announcing today,
and why is this important?
>> Thank you so much for letting us talk about this
because I think everybody has been really excited
since Chuck came out in San Diego,
announced the Devnet certification,
said they were going to be, the new exams
were going to be available February 24th,
so we're about a month out from there.
And to help people get started, we just announced here,
about two big new offerings.
The first is our Devnet Associate Fundamentals Training.
Which we'll be launching on February 21st,
so that way we can help individuals that are looking
to start building up the skills and the exam readiness
that they need to pursue a Devnet Associate Certification.
We also announced our new Devnet Study Group Platform.
Because we don't want people to just find the tools
and the training that they need at Devnet,
we want them to find each other.
We want them to not just build together,
but learn together.
So we will now have a brand new Devnet Study Group
Platform to help people have that type of interactivity.
>> Ryan, I'm curious if you have much visibility into
who's going to be taking these.
You know, how many of them are the ones that,
are the NetVets, the CCIE's that have done this
year after year, and how many are new?
>> Oh, I will tell you right now,
we are actually getting this really wide and diverse
audience, in fact, in the Devnet zone,
we are providing a presentation on getting ready
for Devnet certification four times a day,
and it is packed every time we do it.
And the audience is networking engineers,
veteran networking engineers.
When we ask people in the crowd
how many of you have certifications,
how many of you are CCIE's?
We get a wide variety of CCIE's.
This morning, we had a crew of software developers.
So, we are getting people that are coming from
kind of, all job roles, at all stages in their career.
What they're embracing is that Devnet philosophy,
around coding, around automation.
They want to bring those practices back,
whether that's DevOps, whether that's bringing
a greater understanding of programmability,
and so we're actually getting everyone,
whether again, they're veterans or brand new.
>> Yep, now I love that, because about 10 years ago
there was this big movement, and they said,
network engineers, your future is miserable,
you all need to learn to decode, throw out what you learned,
and fast forward to today, there's multiple paths
to get there.
As you were talking about, there's diverse backgrounds,
there's lots of ways to be relevant to automation,
of course, is hugely important.
Coding is a major piece of it,
but it's not, forget everything that you knew,
it's how everything all works together.
>> Yeah, I completely agree.
I feel like, especially because the Devnet certifications
aren't just the, are only one part of the launch
on February 24th.
In fact, the entire certification portfolio,
and I know you're going to have other Cisco leaders
on to talk about this, that is also being updated
and launched on February 24th.
And what I think you're going to see here
is that flexibility that is in the program now,
where you can actually have elements of automation
baked into that network engineering journey.
So you can still have the elements that people
have been focusing on and building upon,
except now you can stack on these new skills as you go.
>> So, if I go back 10 years, maybe even a little bit more,
but certainly 10 years ago, people were reticent
to embrace automation.
You know, you sort of alluded to that Stu,
but now in this day and age,
automation is fundamental.
You can't scale without automation.
And so the Devnet zone
is really about taking
beyond that existing skill set, going to the next level.
Okay, so if you think about the network engineer
and the training that they've gotten in the past,
to deploy, manage, and optimize networks,
automation comes in, simplifies all that.
How do you describe what the future looks like
for that engineer that's been Devnet certified?
What are they doing?
>> Oh, I think that now it's like, it opens up
a brand new horizon of tasks and even efficiencies.
New things that people have yet to even,
or new job roles that even starting to emerge.
A really good example, and one that we even talked about
here at the Devnet zone, is the DevSecOps engineer,
or the SecDevOps engineer.
It's not that, and Susie has even talked about this
as well too, Susie Wee, who leads Devnet.
It's that jobs are changing, and roles are expanding,
and so rather than just having this opportunity
where you're looking at supporting a network
or acting as a network administrator,
now with automation, to your point,
we actually can expand the opportunities
of the roles themselves,
and really open up things like,
maybe you want to add those security automation elements,
maybe you're interested in adding the collaboration
automation elements, but whatever you are looking to do,
the way that the program is built,
post February 24th of 2020, you're able to actually
have the opportunity to add in those skill validation
exams, really build upon where you want to go.
So I would say the horizon is wide and bright.
>> So, to carry this up further, my question is,
so the lines are blurring between, you know,
Dev and Ops, right, and then, so a network engineer
is going to become more Dev oriented,
do you see them actually either contributing to
or, certainly contributing to, but actually developing apps,
say for instance, for the Edge?
Maybe you can talk about that a little bit.
>> Well, we are actually encouraging,
as we have more and more people join the Devnet
community, we actually have two elements, two exchanges,
our automation exchange and our code exchange,
to really help people as they're moving through that.
We're already starting to see that learners,
individuals, are coming through Devnet,
making that change themselves, and actually
contributing code to our code exchange,
but also adding use cases to our automation exchange.
So that way they're able to show not only how they're
implementing these cases, buy why they're doing it.
And the types of business outcomes that they're achieving.
So that's a practice that has already started to take off.
And I think certifications and things like
the automation exchange, they go hand in hand,
building the skills, and then adding to the program.
>> Well, you hear in the keynote today, all the talk
about bringing IT and OT together.
Again, part of that, I've always said that the edge
is going to be won by developers.
Because critical infrastructure needs to be secured.
And, you know, developers, the DevSecOps role,
and I think this crowd is actually going to be
an important lever in terms of bringing those two
worlds together, your thoughts on that?
>> Yeah, I actually think that that bridge
is something that everyone is crossing right now.
And, in fact, that's one of the motivations
behind the updates to the certification portfolio.
In fact, you'll find that we have parts
of the portfolio that are shared between
the hardware side and the software side.
So that way we can have people as they're
making that transition, as they're starting to move
into that world, that larger world of network
automation, we're actually having it be more of a clear
journey for them, so they're able to work that
into their own certification pouch.
And I would say that these people that are here
in the Devnet zone, they're the pioneers.
They're the ones that are out there on that edge
that are doing that exploration and building
these new things, these new worlds that we
are going to start experiencing in automation.
>> And I guess Stu, it goes without saying,
but it's worth saying, this is really all
about programmable infrastructure, infrastructurous code,
bringing the cloud operating model to your data,
to your infrastructure, wherever it lives, right?
>> Yeah, so Ryan, one of the things that struck us
is not only is there so much enthusiasm,
but the breadth of the offering here,
everything from, here's some cool Meraki IOT things,
to you, you talked about security, automation
sprinkled throughout, can you just remind our audience
a little bit as people get through the certifications,
you know, what are some of the PaaS that they have
for different parts of the portfolio?
>> Oh, absolutely, so the certification journey
that we have right now within Devnet, we actually
align it to all of our five major technology tracks
right now, so there are pathways within the portfolio
around enterprise networking, security, collaboration,
service provider, and also data center.
But we also have pathways, as well, around application
buildouts in IOT, and Edge computing, WebEx,
and also, we have an entire practice that's now just
dedicated to DevOps.
And because DevOps is a concentration that can be,
that is a horizontal throughout all of the certifications,
this is something that you can now add to your journey.
So we can actually have people here, and in fact,
we've been answering this question more and more,
how do I become more proficient at DevOps?
A part of that is now in the certification journey.
And so we've done that here.
>> You should mention that we're in the IOT takeover
right now in the Devnet zone.
>> So Ryan, what about the partner ecosystem,
talk to us about how, what impact do they have,
how much of the ecosystem is getting involved
in certifications too.
>> Oh, well, I will say that we've actually,
we've brought in a lot of people to help us
develop this program initially.
And I know that you're going to have additional
Devnet leaders, they're going to be coming on,
talking about partner ecosystems, so I don't want
to take anything away from them, but I will say this.
There is a lot of excitement because of the fact
that when we brought the Devnet certifications out
and what that would mean, for example, the new
Devnet partner specialization.
This is something that has been embraced by our
partner community, but it's been embraced by the
developers, whether they're our partner developers,
they're our customers, or our networking engineers.
Now that they have these as options for them
to pursue, we have only been met with like
positive enthusiastic engagement.
And in fact, even now, we're starting to see
a lot of people that aren't asking anymore,
in fact, going back to San Francisco,
when everyone was saying, what is Devnet,
now they're asking how do I Devnet.
And it is so great to be able to come and show them
not only the certifications, but the associate
fundamentals training, these new Devnet study group
platforms that we have to show them you know the what
now, here's the how.
>> So, how challenging, cus I was talking to a lady
on the floor yesterday, and we were chatting,
and I said, "you were CCIE", she goes,
"Oh, it's my dream, you know, I'm working my way there,
it's very challenging, but I'm doing really well".
Similar challenges, presumably, to get Devnet certified?
>> Yes.
>> How trivial.
>> No, it is not trivial.
It is a certification in the exact same hallmark
that we hold CCNA, CCNP, and CCIE.
The Devnet certifications are just as rigorous.
And so we are giving people a lot of tools
to help them get ready.
And in fact, one of the things that we've done
to help people on this journey take the initial steps,
is we are not holding back any secrets.
We've hosted every one of our exam topics for all 10
of our Devnet exams at developer.cisco.com/certification.
There you can find out the exact skills we'll be testing
you on for all of those exams.
But we went a step further.
We found every Devnet learning lab that you can take today
for free to start getting ready on that exam journey.
And so for every single exam,
you can find training that you can engage with.
So as people are starting this journey,
if they want to get ready and just build their skills,
especially if they're starting at zero,
for example, if they think python is just a snake,
we have a learning lab for them.
So we have an entire plan that's built so they can
start getting ready, and advance and move forward
for that certification process.
>> What should a college kid do to get prepared for this?
If he or she wants to get into IT,
become a network engineer, or Devnet is interested in them,
what should they take, what courses should they
be interested in?
>> Oh man, that is a great question.
We talk to a lot of people that are in a CS program,
or computer science program, and so many young people
that are moving through college now,
they're already in the habit of programming.
They've been working on things,
they might have even been programming their own
video games, or adding something to the new
Mario games where you can actually build your own levels.
What I would recommend to every young person,
and in fact, to anyone that's on this journey,
come to Devnet.
We have an incredible amount of tools.
At developer.cisco.com, just by signing up,
you get access, not only to training that can take you
from zero to coding, to making your first API call,
to finding our Sandboxes, where you can take
that theoretical knowledge and put it into practice
using Cisco hardware and tools,
and then you can also find use cases there too.
I think everyone is often just looking for
where can I start, how do I start.
Devnet is gone so far as to even have a Start Now area
on the Devnet main page.
So when you come to Devnet, we're always trying
to meet you where you're at.
If you're a veteran networking engineer,
if you're a veteran developer, or if you're
just starting out, you're a college student,
we've got a plan for you to be able to take.
>> Awesome, right, check it out folks, you know,
career builder, Cisco's always been renowned at that.
Thanks so much for coming on theCUBE,
it's great to have you.
>> Oh, hey, thank you so much for having me.
>> You're welcome, all right, keep it right there buddy,
we'll be back with our next guest
from Cisco Live in Barcelona.
You're watching theCUBE.
(upbeat music)