FOLKS, YOU'VE COME ON A GREAT NIGHT.
MY FIRST GUEST TONIGHT IS AMERICA'S FAVORITE
ASTROPHYSICIST.
PLEASE WELCOME THE DIRECTOR OF THE HAYDEN PLANETARIUM AT THE
AMERICAN MUSEUM OF NATURAL HISTORY, NEIL DEGRASSE TYSON!
♪ ♪ ♪
>> GOTTA DO THE VEST GLI LOVE YOU'RE WEARING THE VEST DON'T.
IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN, YOU DON'T ALWAYS WEAR THE VEST.
>> IF IT'S HOT OUT, I DON'T WEAR THE VEST.
BUT IT'S FREEZING IN THIS STUDIO.
>> Stephen: YOU'RE WELCOME.
WE HAVE THE STARS OUT TONIGHT.
>> I ALWAYS NOTICE YOUR STARS.
THEY'RE BEAUTIFUL.
THEY'RE ACCURATE.
>> Stephen: AND WE HAVE THE PLANETS ON THE DOME.
>> THOSE ARE NOT ACCURATE.
>> Stephen: THEY'RE NOT, BUT THEY'RE FUN.
>> THEY'RE FUN, THEY'RE FUN.
>> Stephen: I NEED TO ASK YOU ABOUT SOMETHING THAT'S HAPPENING
BOTH IN SPACE AND IN POLITICS RIGHT NOW, IF YOU DON'T MIND
TOUCHING ON THAT.
THE SPACE FORCE THAT DONALD TRUMP IS VERY EXCITED ABOUT.
HE ANNOUNCED SPACE FORCE.
PEOPLE MAKE FUN OF IT, I AMONG THEM.
>> YEAH.
>> Stephen: I LIKE SPACE EXPLORATION.
I'M EXCITED ABOUT US CONQUERING SPACE SCIENTIFICALLY AND THROUGH
KNOWLEDGE.
WHY DO WE NEED THE SPACE FORCE?
WHAT DON'T WE UNDERSTAND ABOUT IT BECAUSE YOU SAY YOU'RE ON
BOARD.
>> JUST BECAUSE IT CAME OUT OF TRUMP'S MOUTH, DOESN'T REQUIRE
THAT IT THEN BE A CRAZY THING.
JUST-- I'M JUST SAYING.
>> Stephen: IT DON'T HELP.
( LAUGHTER ) >> SO --
>> Stephen: BUT WHY DO WE NEED A SPACE FORCE, NEIL?
>> I DON'T HAVE A HORSE IN THAT RACE.
I CAN TELL THAT YOU MANY PEOPLE ARE THINKING THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE
A SPACE FORCE BEFORE, AND NOW WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A SPACE
FORCE.
WE HAVE A SPACE FORCE.
IT'S CALLED THE UNITED STATES SPACE COMMAND AND UNDER THE
AUSPICES OF THE AIR FORCE.
>> Stephen: REALLY.
>> THE AIR FORCE LAUNCHES SATELLITES.
THE AIR FORCE PUT G.P.S.
SATELLITES IN ORBIT.
>> Stephen: NASA DIDN'T DO THAT.
THE AIR FORCE DID IT?
>> THE AIR FORCE DID IT BECAUSE IT WAS A MILITARY PROJECT.
>> Stephen: AND THEY HAVE THAT SECRET SPACE PLANE THAT STAYS UP
FOR, LIKE, TWO YEARS AT A TIME?
>> I CANNOT COMMENT.
>> Stephen: THEY DO.
IT LOOKS LIKE A LITTLE SHUTTLE.
>> IT'S A SECRET PLANE.
WHY ARE YOU TELLINGY EVERYBODY WHAT IT LOOK S.
>> Stephen: THEY LET US SEE IT LAND, THEY JUST WON'T TELL US
WHAT IT'S-- AND IT'S UNMANNED, RIGHT?
NEIL!
>> WHAT I'M SAYING IS-- >> Stephen: DO YOU ACTUALLY
KNOW WHAT IT'S DOING UP THERE?
>> I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING.
>> Stephen: OH, YOU SO KNOW.
I'M GOING TO GET YOU DRUNK.
( LAUGHTER ).
>> ALL I'M SAYING IS THE UNITED STATES SPACE COMMAND IS
RESPONSIBLE FOR ALL THE SPACE ACTIVITIES THAT THE MILITARY HAS
ENGAGED IN FOREVER, EVER SINCE THE 1960s, BASICALLY.
AND SO TO HAVE A SPACE FORCE, YOU JUST SLIDE IN ALL THESE
ACTIVITIES UNDER THIS NEW UMBRELLA, AND YOU MIGHT ADD A
FEW THINGS.
IN FACT, IF I HAD ANY SAY IN THE MATTER I MIGHT SAY WHY DON'T YOU
THROW IN SOME ASTEROID DEFENSE.
WE NEED THAT.
AND WHY DON'TY YOU CLEAN UP SPACE WHILE YOU'RE AT IT, GET
RID OF THE SPACE DEBRIS.
>> Stephen: HOW BAD IS OUR SPACE DEBRIS PROBLEM?
AND WHERE DID IT COME FROM?
>> IT'S RANDOM CHIPS OF PAINT AND BOLTS AND NUTS-- THERE'S A
LOT OF HARDWARE IN SPACE.
PIECES FALL OFF EVERY NOW AND THEN, AND IF YOU'RE IN ORBIT AND
IT FALLS OFF, THAT PIECE IS GOING 18,000 MILES PER HOUR.
AND YOU DON'T WANT TO BE HIT BY THAT.
>> Stephen: DO YOU HAVE A SPACE VACUUM?
ISN'T SPACE ALREADY A VACUUM?
HOW DO YOU SUCK IT UP OUT OF SPACE?
>> IT'S NOT A CLEAR SOLUTION TO THAT PROBLEM.
>> Stephen: THERE ISN'T.
A BIG NET.
>> DISMATS AIR FORCE TRACKS THESE PARTICLES SO LAUNCH
WINDOWS ARE PATROLLED WHETHER SOMETHING WILL GET HIT OR NOT.
>> Stephen: HONEST TO GOD, SPACE COMMAND OR NASA THEY'RE
TRACKING, LIKE, A BOLT?
>> YES, WELL, DEPENDING ON THE SIZE, YEAH, YEAH.
THEY'RE TRACKING THING THAT COULD HARM SUBSEQUENT
ACTIVITIES.
AND ALL I'M SAYING IS THIS IS NOT A NEW THING BECAUSE WE'VE
HAD SPACE ASSETS, MILITARY SPACE ASSETS SINCE THE 60s.
WHAT IS A SPY SATELLITE?
IT'S A SPACE ASSET IN THE SERVICE OF THE MILITARY.
THE 2003 GULF WAR WAS ENABLED BY SPACE ASSET S.
>> Stephen: OKAY, BUT HERE'S MY THING IS THAT IF YOU CALL IT
A "SPACE FORCE" YOU'RE INNATELY EMBRACING THE IDEA OF SPACE WAR.
>> YEAH, SPACE MUSCLE.
>> Stephen: SPACE MUSCLE, SPACE MILL IT TIRRIZATION.
ISN'T THE PROBLEM THE FUTURE IN SPACE, WE HAVE PEACE FRONTIERS.
WE DON'T HAVE WAR FRONTIERS.
>> WE TRIED.
IN 19 SCWEF, THERE WAS A TREATY PUT FORECAST BY THE U.N. AND
SIGNED BY PARTIES -- >> Stephen: INCLUDING THE
UNITED STATES.
>> INCLUDING THE NIGHTS YOOUTS.
TODAY 107 COUNTRIES HAVE SIGNED IT.
IT'S THE PEACEFUL USE OF OUTER SPACE.
IT'S A BEAUTIFUL-- YOU WANT TO SING KUMBAYA.
SPACE AND PEACE AND PROSPERITY.
IF YOUR ASTRONAUT IS IN TROUBLE, WE'LL SEND SOMEONE TO HELP YOU.
IT'S BEAUTIFUL.
>> Stephen: BUT WITH SPACE FORCE IT'S LIKE, "YOU'RE ON YOUR
OWN."
>> THERE'S A GRAY AREA IN THERE.
IT ALLOWS TO YOU DEFEND YOUR ASSETS IN SPACE.
SUPPOSE I HAVE A LAYS SCER YOU'RE COMING AT ME WITH YOUR
BAD SATELLITE AND I TAKE YOU OUT.
WELL, THAT'S DEFENSIVE.
SUPPOSE YOU'RE COMING AT ME AND I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO DO
SOMETHING BAD AND I TAKE YOU OUT PREEMPTIVELY, IS THAT DEFENSIVE?
>> Stephen: WHO ARE WE GOING TO BE FIGHTING IN SPACE?
IS THERE ANYBODY MILITARIZING SPACE IN AN, OVERT WAY THAT WE
HAVE TO BE PREPARED FOR?
>> WE'RE USING "MILL TIRRIZATION OF SPACE" AND YOU'RE THINKING
WEAPONS AND BOMBS DISPLI AM.
>> ISN'T SPACE ALL RIGHT MILITARIZED IF WE HAVE SOME
COUNTLESS NUMBER OF SATELLITES IN THE SERVICE OF MILITARY
OPERATIONS ON EARTH'S SURFACE.
>> Stephen: COULD WE FIGHT EACH OTHER UP THERE?
COULD OUR SATELLITE FIGHT A CHINESE SATELLITE?
>> YOU COULD, BUT IT'S KIND OF NOT WHAT YOU WANT TO DO, BECAUSE
IF YOU TAKE OUT THAT SATELLITE WITH A KINETIC KILL --
>> Stephen: MEANING A BOMB-- >> IT WOULDN'T HAVE TO BE A
BOMB.
A FAST-MOVING OBJECT IS KIND OF LIKE A BOMB.
>> Stephen: FIRE ONE OF THOSE 18-MILE-AN-HOUR PARTICLES.
>> CORRECT.
EACH BIT IS A PROJECTILE THAT CAN TAKE OUT YOUR OWN
SATELLITES.
WHAT PEOPLE ARE THINKING ABOUT FIGHTING AND-- IT'S NOT
REALISTIC FOR WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IN SPACE.
IN FACT, THERE'S SOMETHING CALLED THE KESSLER EFFECT,
ADVANCED IN 1978.
THE GUY CALCULATED, IF YOU HAVE A CERTAIN NUMBER OF SATELLITES
IN ORBIT, THERE'S A THREB HOLD, ABOVE WHICH IF YOU TAKE OUT ONE
OF THOSE SATELLITES INTO 10 PIECES THOSE 10 PIECE WILL TAKE
OUT 10 SATELLITES AND THOSE WILL TAKE OUT ANOTHER 10, FROM ONE TO
10 TO 1,000 -- >> Stephen: THAT'S WHAT
HAPPENS IN THE MOVIE "GRAVITY."
>> EXACTLY.
OTHER THAN THE ISSUES "GRAVITY" HAD, LIKE SANDA BULLOCK'S HAIR
NEVER WENT ZERO G.
>> Stephen: THEY HAVE HAIRSPRAY IN SPACE.
>> SO, SO, IT'S A DEVASTATING FACT THAT IF YOU TAKE OUT ONE
SATELLITE ABOVE A CERTAIN THRESHOLD, ALL SATELLITES CAN
GO.
AND THEN WAR IS DONE IN SPACE.
SO IT'S NOT REALISTIC.
LIKE IN WORLD WAR I WHERE THEY HAD MUSTARD GAS BECAUSE YOU
COULDN'T SHOOT PEOPLE IN THE TRENCHES.
BUT THE WIND CHANGED DIRECTION, AND NOW THE MUSTARD GAS IS IN
YOUR OWN DAMN FACE.
SO CERTAIN MILITARISTIC OPTIONS, WHICH SOUND LIKE SOMETHING THAT
WOULD HAPPEN, STRATEGICALLY WON'T HAPPEN.
>> Stephen: BAD IDEA IN SPACE.
>> BAD IDEA GR I W.
>> Stephen: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT HOW WE GREW OUR SPACE
PROGRAM DETAILED IN YOUR NEW BOOK "ACCESSORY TO WAR."
AND WE WILL BE BACK WITH THIS AND MORE NEIL DEGRASSE TYSON IN
JUST A MOMENT.