>> From theCUBE studios in Palo Alto in Boston
bringing you data driven insights from theCUBE and ETR.
This is breaking analysis with Dave Vellante.
>> The term Supercloud is somewhat new,
but the concepts behind it
have been bubbling for years,
early last decade
when NIST put forth a definition of cloud computing
it said services had to be accessible over a public network
essentially cutting the on-prem crowd
out of the cloud conversation.
Now a guy named Chuck Hollis,
who was a field CTO at EMC at the time
and a prolific blogger objected to that criterion
and laid out his vision for what he termed a private cloud.
Now, in that post, he showed a workload
running both on premises
and in a public cloud sharing the underlying resources
in an automated and seamless manner.
What later became known more broadly
as hybrid cloud that vision as we now know,
really never materialized,
and we were left with multi-cloud
sets of largely incompatible and disconnected cloud services
running in separate silos.
The point is what Hollis laid out, IE
the ability to abstract underlying infrastructure complexity
and run workloads across multiple heterogeneous estates
with an identical experience is what super cloud
is all about.
Hello and welcome to this week's Wikibon cube insights
powered by ETR and this breaking analysis.
We share what we hope to learn
from super cloud 22 next week,
next Tuesday at 9:00 AM Pacific.
The community is gathering for Supercloud 22
an inclusive pilot symposium hosted by theCUBE
and made possible by VMware and other founding partners.
It's a one day single track event
with more than 25 speakers digging into the architectural,
the technical, structural and business aspects
of Supercloud.
This is a hybrid event with a live program
in the morning running out of our Palo Alto studio
and pre-recorded content in the afternoon
featuring industry leaders, technologists, analysts
and investors up and down the technology stack.
Now, as I said up front
the seeds of super cloud were sewn early last decade.
After the very first reinvent
we published our Amazon gorilla post,
that scene in the upper right corner here.
And we talked about how to differentiate
from Amazon and form ecosystems around industries
and data and how the cloud would change IT permanently.
And then up in the upper left
we put up a post on the old Wikibon Wiki.
Yeah, it used to be a Wiki.
Check out my hair by the way way no gray,
that's how long ago this was.
And we talked about in that post
how to compete in the Amazon economy.
And we showed a graph of how IT economics were changing.
And cloud services had marginal economics
that looked more like software than hardware at scale.
And this would reset, we said
opportunities for both technology sellers
and buyers for the next 20 years.
And this came into sharper focus in the ensuing years
culminating in a milestone post by Greylock's Jerry Chen
called Castles in the Cloud.
It was an inspiration and catalyst
for us using the term Supercloud
in John Furrier's post prior to reinvent 2021.
So we started to flesh out this idea of Supercloud
where companies of all types build services
on top of hyperscale infrastructure
and across multiple clouds,
going beyond multicloud 1.0, if you will,
which was really a symptom, as we said,
many times of multi-vendor at least that's what we argued.
And despite its fuzzy definition,
it resonated with people because
they knew something was brewing,
Keith Townsend the CTO advisor,
even though he frankly, wasn't a big fan of the buzzy nature
of the term Supercloud
posted this awesome Blackboard on Twitter
take a listen to how he framed it.
Please play the clip.
>> Is VMware the right company to make the super cloud work,
term that Wikibon came up with
to describe the taking of discreet services.
So it says RDS from AWS, cloud compute engines from GCP
and authentication from Azure to build SaaS applications
or enterprise applications that connect back
to your data center, is VMware's cross cloud vision
'cause it is just a vision today, the right approach.
Or should you be looking towards companies
like HashiCorp to provide this overall capability
that we all agree, or maybe you don't
that we need in an enterprise comment below your thoughts.
>> So I really like that Keith has
deep practitioner knowledge
and lays out a couple of options.
I especially like the examples he uses of cloud services.
He recognizes the need for cross cloud services
and he notes this capability is aspirational today.
Remember this was eight or nine months ago
and he brings HashiCorp into the conversation
as they're one of the speakers at Supercloud 22
and he asks the community, what they think,
the thing is we're trying to really test out this concept
and people like Keith are instrumental as collaborators.
Now I'm sure you're not surprised to hear
that mot everyone is on board with the Supercloud meme,
in particular Charles Fitzgerald
has been a wonderful collaborator
just by his hilarious criticisms of the concept.
After a couple of super cloud posts,
Charles put up his second rendition of
"Supercloudifragilisticexpialidoucious".
I mean, it's just beautiful, but to boot,
he put up this picture of Baghdad Bob
asking us to just stop,
Bob's real name is Mohamed Said al-Sahaf.
He was the minister of propaganda
for Sadam Husein during the 2003 invasion of Iraq.
And he made these outrageous claims of, you know
US troops running in fear
and putting down their arms and so forth.
So anyway, Charles laid out several
frankly very helpful critiques of Supercloud
which has led us to really advance the definition
and catalyze the community's thinking on the topic.
Now, one of his issues and there are many
is we said a prerequisite of super cloud
was a super PaaS layer.
Gartner's Lydia Leong chimed in saying
there were many examples of successful PaaS vendors
built on top of a hyperscaler some having the option
to run in more than one cloud provider.
But the key point we're trying to explore
is the degree to which that PaaS layer
is purpose built for a specific super cloud function.
And not only runs in more than one cloud provider, Lydia
but runs across multiple clouds simultaneously
creating an identical developer experience
irrespective of a state.
Now, maybe that's what Lydia meant.
It's hard to say from just a tweet
and she's a sharp lady, so,
and knows more about that market,
that PaaS market, than I do.
But to the former point at Supercloud 22,
we have several examples.
We're going to test.
One is Oracle and Microsoft's recent announcement
to run database services on OCI and Azure,
making them appear as one
rather than use an off the shelf platform.
Oracle claims to have developed a capability
for developers specifically built to ensure high performance
low latency, and a common experience
for developers across clouds.
Another example we're going to test is Snowflake.
I'll be interviewing Benoit Dageville
co-founder of Snowflake to understand the degree
to which Snowflake's recent announcement
of an application development platform
is perfect built, purpose built
for the Snowflake data cloud.
Is it just a plain old pass, big whoop as Lydia claims
or is it something new and innovative,
by the way we invited Charles Fitz
to participate in Supercloud 22 and he decline
saying in addition to a few other somewhat insulting things
there's definitely interesting new stuff brewing
that isn't traditional cloud or SaaS
but branding at all super cloud doesn't help either.
Well, indeed, we agree with part of that
and we'll see if it helps advanced thinking
and helps customers really plan for the future.
And that's why Supercloud 22
has going to feature some of the best analysts
in the business in The Great Supercloud Debate.
In addition to Keith Townsend
and Maribel Lopez of Lopez research
and Sanjeev Mohan from former Gartner analyst
and principal at SanjMo participated in this session.
Now we don't want to mislead you.
We don't want to imply that these analysts
are hopping on the super cloud bandwagon
but they're more than willing to go
through the thought experiment and mental exercise.
And, we had a great conversation
that you don't want to miss.
Maribel Lopez had what I thought was a really excellent way
to think about this.
She used TCP/IP as an historical example,
listen to what she said.
>> And Sanjeev Mohan has some excellent thoughts
on the feasibility of an open versus de facto standard
getting us to the vision of Supercloud,
what's possible and what's likely now, again,
I don't want to imply that these analysts are out
banging the Supercloud drum.
They're not necessarily doing that,
but they do I think it's fair to say
believe that something new is bubbling
and whether it's called Supercloud or multicloud 2.0
or cross cloud services or whatever name you choose
it's not multicloud of the 2010s and we chose Supercloud.
So our goal here is to advance the discussion
on what's next in cloud
and Supercloud is meant to be a term
to describe that future of cloud
and specifically the cloud opportunities
that can be built on top of hyperscale, compute,
storage, networking machine learning,
and other services at scale.
And that is why we posted this piece
on Answering the top 10 questions about Supercloud.
Many of which were floated by Charles Fitzgerald
and others in the community.
Why does the industry need another term
what's really new and different?
And what is hype?
What specific problems does Supercloud solve?
What are the salient characteristics of Supercloud?
What's different beyond multicloud?
What is a super pass?
Is it necessary to have a Supercloud?
How will applications evolve on superclouds?
What workloads will run?
All these questions will be addressed in detail
as a way to advance the discussion and help practitioners
and business people understand what's real today.
And what's possible with cloud in the near future.
And one other question we'll address
is who will build super clouds?
And what new entrance we can expect.
This is an ETR graphic that we showed in a previous episode
of breaking analysis, and it lays out some of the companies
we think are building super clouds
or in a position to do so, by the way
the Y axis shows net score or spending velocity
and the X axis depicts presence
in the ETR survey of more than 1200 respondents.
But the key callouts to this slide
in addition to some of the smaller firms
that aren't yet showing up in the ETR data
like Chaossearch and Starburst and Aviatrix and Clumio
but the really interesting additions are industry players
Walmart with Azure, Capital one and Goldman Sachs with AWS,
Oracle, with Cerner.
These we think are early examples, bubbling up
of industry clouds that will eventually become super clouds.
So we'll explore these
and other trends to get the community's input
on how this will all play out.
These are the things we hope you'll take away
from Supercloud 22.
And we have an amazing lineup of experts
to answer your question.
Technologists like Kit Colbert, Adrian Cockcroft,
Mariana Tessel, Chris Hoff, Will DeForest, Ali Ghodsi,
Benoit Dageville, Muddu Sudhakar
and many other tech athletes,
investors like Jerry Chen and In Sik Rhee
the analyst we featured earlier, Paula Hansen
talking about go to market in a multi-cloud world
Gee Rittenhouse talking about cloud security,
David McJannet, Bhaskar Gorti of Platform9
and many, many more.
And of course you, so please go to theCUBE.net
and register for Supercloud 22, really lightweight reg.
We're not doing this for lead gen.
We're doing it for collaboration.
If you sign in you can get the chat
and ask questions in real time.
So don't miss this inaugural event
Supercloud 22 on August 9th at 9:00 AM Pacific.
We'll see you there.
Okay. That's it for today.
Thanks for watching.
Thank you to Alex Myerson who's on production
and manages the podcast.
Kristen Martin and Cheryl Knight.
They help get the word out on social media
and in our newsletters.
And Rob Hof is our editor in chief over at SiliconANGLE.
Does some really wonderful editing.
Thank you to all.
Remember these episodes are all available as podcasts
wherever you listen, just search breaking analysis podcast.
I publish each week on wikibon.com and Siliconangle.com.
And you can email me at David.Vellantesiliconangle.com
or DM me at Dvellante, comment on my LinkedIn post.
Please do check out ETR.AI for the best survey data
in the enterprise tech business.
This is Dave Vellante for theCUBE insights powered by ETR.
Thanks for watching.
And we'll see you next week in Palo Alto
at Supercloud 22 or next time on breaking analysis.
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