"WASHINGTON POST," PHIL RUTGER AND DAVID JOLLY.
WE’VE GOT THE WHOLE TEAM
GATHERED TODAY.
GATHERED TODAY. THE PRESIDENT HAS PUT SOME OF
HIS TOP AIDS, TOP CABINET
SECRETARIES IN TOUGH POSITIONS.
I GOT INTO IT WITH MIKE POMPEO
TRYING TO BACK UP SOME OF WHAT
THE PRESIDENT SAID BEFORE ON
FRIDAY.
FRIDAY. THEN OVER THE WEEKEND ESPER
EFFECTIVELY TRIED TO BACK UP
WHAT SOME OF THE COMMENTS HAD
BEEN.
BEEN. HE WAS PUT IN A POSITION WHERE
YOU COULD LIE, I GUESS OR BREAK
WITH THE PRESIDENT.
>> THAT’S RIGHT.
WE’VE SEEN OVER THE PAST WEEK
THE MACHINERY OF GOVERNMENT, THE
TOP OFFICIALS IN THE MILITARY
AND NATIONAL SECURITY SPACE FOR
THIS COUNTRY HAVE BEEN
SCRAMBLING TO ADAPT TO CHANGE
THEIR STORY TOO, EVOLVE TOO,
MATCH WHAT THE PRESIDENT HAS
BEEN SAYING PUBLICLY.
HIS NARRATIVE OF WHY HE DECIDED
TO ORDER THE DRONE STRIKE THAT
KILLED A TOP IRANIAN GENERAL HAS
BEEN EVOLVING DAY AFTER DAY
AFTER DAY AND NOW YOU HAVE AN
ADMINISTRATION WITH A
CREDIBILITY PROBLEM IN PART
BECAUSE OF THE PRESIDENT’S LONG
HISTORY OF FALSE HOODS AND
MISSTATEMENTS AND BECAUSE THE
PRESIDENT HAS BEEN IMPRECISE
WITH HIS LANGUAGE.
YOU SAW WHERE HE TALKED ABOUT
THE EMBASSIES FOR THE FIRST
TIME.
TIME. THE PRESIDENT SAYS I BELIEVE IT
WAS FOUR EMBASSIES.
IT’S UNCLEAR WHETHER HE’S SAYING
HE SAW INTELLIGENCE TO SUGGEST
FOUR EMBASSIES, WHICH BY THE
WAY, THE DEFENSE SECRETARY SAYS
HE NEVER SAW.
OR IS THE PRESIDENT JUST
SPECULATING WHAT HE PERSONALLY
THINKS MIGHT HAVE BEEN
HAPPENING?
HAPPENING? VERY UNCLEAR, IMPRECISE AND
LEAVES THE ADMINISTRATION WITH
NOT A LOT OF CREDIBILITY TRYING
TO CONVINCE THE AMERICAN PUBLIC
ABOUT WHY HE DID IT.
>> THAT PUTS THIS PRESIDENT,
THIS ADMINISTRATION IN A BIND.
NOT NEW ONE, MIND YOU.
HE SAID TO FOX NEWS, I THINK
THEY WERE PROBABLY GOING TO --
THEY GENERALLY BELIEVE THAT’S A
DECLARATION OF FACT.
OBVIOUSLY, CIRCUMSTANCES HAVE
CHANGED IN THIS ADMINISTRATION.
EVEN THIS PRESIDENT, HE SAID
THESE MEDIA POSTS WILL SERVE AS
NOTIFICATION TO THE UNITED
STATES CONGRESS THAT SHOULD IRAN
STRIKE ANY U.S. PERSON OR
TARGET, THE UNITED STATES WILL
FULLY STRIKE BACK.
THAT WAS A FORMAL DECLARATION.
BUT WHEN HE WAS SPEAKING
PUBLICLY, HE’S RIFFING.
WHAT DOES THAT DO TO THE
CREDIBILITY ON THE ISSUE?
>> IT GIVES CONGRESSIONAL
REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS REASON
TO ASK FOR JUSTIFICATION.
AND IF HE SAYS WE’RE GOING TO BE
STRIKE, WE’LL STRIKE BACK,
THAT’S WITHIN THE POWERS OF HIS
OFFICE AND WOULD BE SUPPORTED BY
CONGRESS.
CONGRESS. THE JUSTIFICATION RESOLVES
AROUND THE QUESTION OF WHETHER
AN ATTACK WAS IMMINENT.
AS FAR BACK AS SEVEN MONTHS AGO
THAT DONALD TRUMP HAD AUTHORIZED
THE KILLING, THAT LETS US KNOW
THIS IS A CHANGE IN NATIONAL
SECURITY POLICY.
SECURITY POLICY. NOT NECESSARILY A REFLEXIVE
CHANGE OF DECISION ON JANUARY
3rd.
3rd. BUT THE DECISION TO EXECUTE THAT
COMMAND IF YOU WILL.
THE QUESTION WAS, WAS IT JUST
BECAUSE HE’S A BAD GUY WITH A
HORRIBLE PAST AS DONALD TRUMP
SAYS IN THIS TWEET THAT WOULD
JUSTIFY IT OR BECAUSE OF AN
IMMINENT THREAT TO FOUR
EMBASSIES?
EMBASSIES? WHEN HE DROPPED THE FOUR EMBAEGS
LINE, PEOPLE CAUGHT THAT BECAUSE
IT WAS INCONSISTENT WITH THE
MESSAGING THAT CAME OUT
INITIALLY AND NOW THE WHITE
HOUSE HAS LOST THE BENEFIT OF
THE DOUBT.
THE DOUBT. CONGRESSIONAL DEMOCRATS ARE NOT
SAYING THEY NEED PERMISSION, BUT
THEY ARE DUE JUSTIFICATION.
AND THAT JUSTIFICATION IS
BECOMING INCREASINGLY ILLUSIVE.
>> SO THE REPORTING THIS GOES
BACK AS FAR AS SEVEN MONTHS,
THEY WERE CONSIDERING KILLING
SOLEIMANI, CAME FROM OUR FRIEND,
CAROLLEE AND COURTNEY AT THE
PENTAGON AS WELL.
WALK US THROUGH YOUR REPORTING
AND WHY IT’S SO SIGNIFICANT
AGAINST THE BACK DROP WE’VE BEEN
TALKING ABOUT.
TALKING ABOUT. >> WE SPOKE TO FIVE FORMER AND
SENIOR OFFICIAL WHOSE SAID LAST
SUMMER WHEN, AS YOU’LL RECALL,
IRAN WAS REALLY RATCHETING UP
ITS AGGRESSION, DOING VARIOUS
NEFARIOUS ACTIVITIES AND THEN
NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR JOHN
BOLTON URGED THE PRESIDENT TO
RESPOND TO IRAN’S STRIKE,
SHOOTING DOWN A U.S. DRONE BY
KILLING SOLEIMANI, WHICH HAS
COME UP HERE AND THERE OVER THE
COURSE OF THE PRESIDENCY.
THE PRESIDENT SAID NO, OBVIOUSLY
AND SAID THAT’S NOT SOMETHING
THAT’S PROPORTIONAL TO SHOOTING
DOWN A DRONE, BUT IF THEY KILL
AN AMERICAN, HE AGREED HE WOULD
TAKE THAT STEP.
AND THERE WERE CONDITIONS.
AND ONE OF THEM WAS THIS WASN’T
THE KIND OF ORDER WHERE THE
MILITARY JUST HAD YOU FIND THEM,
GET THEM.
GET THEM. IF THEY TAKE THIS STEP AND CROSS
A RED LINE .
AND IF THAT DOES COME TO PASS,
YOU HAVE TO COME BACK WITH A
SPECIFIC OPERATION, WHICH IS
WHAT WE SAW LAST WEEK.
THE POINT IS THAT UNDERMINES THE
ARGUMENT THIS WAS DONE BECAUSE
OF AN IMMINENT THREAT, THIS WAS
IN THE MOMENT.
THIS HAS BEEN THOUGHT OUT FOR
MONTHS.
MONTHS. >> AND THE WHITE HOUSE AS WE
HEARD LAST WEEK.
THEY SAID IT ON THE SUNDAY SHOWS
AND AS WE HEAR FROM OFFICIALS IS
IT DOESN’T MATTER.
WE’VE GOT BAD GUY.
LET’S ALL RALLY AROUND THE IDEA
WE HAVE A BAD GUY.
BUT IT DOES MATTER WHEN IT COMES
TO LAW THAT DICTATES --
>> BUT IT’S NOT THE FIRST TIME
HE’S DISGUARDED WHAT THE
CONSTITUTION SAYS ON THE
LIMITATIONS ON EXECUTIVE POWER.
YOU’RE RIGHT.
YOU’RE RIGHT. IT IS CONSEQUENTIAL, OBVIOUSLY.
AND IF THE PRESIDENT PERHAPS HAD
STARTED THERE AND SAID WE HAVE A
BAD GUY, END OF THE STORY,
THAT’S AN ARGUMENT YOU CAN
MAINTAIN.
MAINTAIN. TRYING TO REVERSE ENGINEER THIS
IDEA THERE WAS AN IMMINENT
THREAT, WHEN YOU’RE GOING TO
BRIEF CONGRESS, YOU DON’T HAVE
EVIDENCE TO PRESENT TO CONGRESS
AND YOU SEND YOUR SURROGATES TO
ENTERTAIN THAT.
ENTERTAIN THAT. WASN’T JUST THE FOX INTERVIEW
AND WHEN HE WAS TALKING ABOUT
INVOKING THIS -- ANOTHER
BENGHAZI, SAYING YOU SAW WHAT
WAS HAPPENING TO THAT EMBASSY,
REFERRING TO THE TELEVISION
IMAGES OF THE PROTESTS OUTSIDE
THAT HE SAW AND SAW ANOTHER
BENGHAZI ON HIS WATCH.
HE SAID, YOU KNOW IF WE LET THAT
GO THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN
HUNDREDS OF PEOPLE KILLED.
SITING THE PRESIDENT BEING
SPECULATIVE AND IMPRECISE.
HE’S PAINTING A PICTURE TRYING
TO RATIONALIZE.
TO RATIONALIZE. THAT’S ANOTHER EXPLANATION AND
WHETHER SOMETHING IS IMMINENT,
THAT’S JUST BEEN IN THE EYE OF
THE BEHOLDER.
THE BEHOLDER. YOU HAD POMPEO GETTING UP.