Next up is Holmfirth-based tech entrepreneur Martyn Gould,
who has a lot riding on his trip to the Den.
Today is huge for us and our company because we've worked really hard
for the last two years, to build something that's great
but we've recognised that we need some help.
Martyn's decided that to win the Dragons over, honesty is the best policy.
I'm going to be transparent, I'm going to be friendly,
and, hopefully, when I get back in that lift,
I'll have a big smile on my face!
Hi, Dragons. My name's Martyn Gould, I'm the CEO of Yboo.
I'm here today to ask for an investment of £250,000
for a 2.5% equity share in our business,
Yboo Limited.
Dragons, did you know that in the UK every single year,
consumers overpay for mobile phone contracts?
They don't know what they use, so they don't know what to buy
and the market is deliberately complicated.
We made Yboo to solve that problem.
One, download Yboo.
Two, use your smartphone as normal.
Three, sit back and wait for Yboo to match you to a deal
that's best for you.
Not only do we match you on price, but we also match you on
signal strength and we're ideally placed to scale in the UK
and internationally, but we need you guys onboard
to help us do that quicker.
Look forward to receiving any comments about the product.
An app that tracks your call and data usage to recommend the best
mobile phone deals is the offering from Yorkshireman Martyn Gould.
He's asking for a sizeable £250,000 for a 2.5% share
in his business.
Sara Davies is keen to know more about Martyn's experience
in the mobile phone zone.
Martyn. Hello.
You are from the industry? Absolutely.
We've been in the telecommunications industry for 20 years.
I was one of the first employees at Cellnet when it was analogue,
and the networks know us.
And do they love our team and our people?
Absolutely.
You've just gone in, found a few of the best people,
put the super-duper, awesome team together?
We've built a team to solve a real problem for consumers
and mobile networks, and we've got the foundation to grow.
And I do believe in it because I've spent 14 months with no salary,
no income, spending my savings to launch this service.
That's how much I believe in it.
Martyn's passion and his impressive credentials seem to be going
down well with Sara Davies.
Peter Jones made his first millions in mobiles.
How will Martyn fare being quizzed by an expert?
Martyn, hi. Hi, Peter.
You said the selling point is the fact that it will tell you
the coverage where you live... Yeah.
..and the best network for you. Yeah.
How do you get that information?
So, we crowdsource it from users and we know that people
have their mobile phone with them all the time.
This is from our own systems and our own algorithms.
And how many users do you have?
So, to date, we've had 40,000 people that have downloaded our app.
And how many people in the UK have a mobile phone?
So, there's 60 million people that have a consumer connection.
60 million people have a connection?
Yes.
And yet 40,000 people tell you where the coverage is?
So, I'm going to go on your site.
I bet, and I put my postcode in, you're not going to know
whether the coverage is good for me or not.
So, if we don't know, we'll tell you that we don't know.
We're completely transparent and we'll tell you...
So, I get a message back to say, "I'm sorry, I just don't know it"?
As we scale in the UK, we'll have more detailed crowdsourcing
information and, hopefully...
Well, you won't get it - that is my point.
You'd be far better to utilise...
..an average network coverage map.
I... I think we've made the right decision in not using operator maps
and being independent of every single mobile network.
The operator maps are static, they take no account of population.
I totally agree with you, but you've got 40,000 people
out of a population of 60 million.
Martyn's failure to embrace all the data available
to improve his service signals trouble with Peter Jones.
Will he get a better reception from Deborah Meaden
on the subject of the company's finances?
How much money have you spent so far?
So, we've spent about...
..£1.1 million.
And that's across the whole of our business.
So, that's on technology development, patents, operations,
sales, people, premises.
OK, and marketing?
£300,000.
You see, I think £300,000...
..I'd have expected, possibly, to have heard of you.
OK.
And £300,000 for 40,000 sign-ups.
Does that sound like a good return to you?
No.
The reason we're here today is because we need your experience
to grow quicker.
So, tell me what happens on day two.
Here's £250,000, what are you going to do with it?
So, we're going to use that money to launch internationally.
What is the rush to go internationally,
when you haven't even tested the market fully here?
I think there's a huge desire to go internationally
because the product's portable.
One of our key target areas is Australia.
Because of the geographic landmass, there's a real problem
with signal strength out there.
So, Martyn...
..you know, sometimes people can't get right what's in front of them.
Yeah. They've got expectations to go somewhere else.
We think that our app has the potential to scale internationally,
and, you know, that's the return for investors.
I mean, it's like saying, you know, you can't get UK right,
maybe there's a softer target elsewhere.
I think you're delusional.
OK.
Martyn's plans for world domination haven't gone down well
with a wound-up Touker Suleyman.
And it looks like he's not off the hook yet,
as Peter Jones wants more information on the company coffers.
What has been your last year's turnover?
I'm assuming this is going to be a very, very big number
because you valued your business today at ten million.
It's not as big as we want it to be but we're well-placed to scale.
In the millions, what's your turnover been?
So, for the financial year '18-19, we're going to post revenue
of around £50-60,000.
£50-60,000?
Absolutely.
..sitting on my chair. OK...
OK, well, that's... I wasn't sort of expecting that.
Wow, how do you go from there?
Do you want to know why we've arrived at the valuation,
would that help?
No, I don't think you could put any level of common sense
to that valuation.
Martyn?
Peter might not want to know, but I do...
..because I'm fascinated!
I think the other thing, Deborah, that supports our valuation -
less than 12 months ago, one of the major price comparison sites
tried to buy us.
The valuation that they gave us at that time was £5 million.
Is it possible to see that offer?
Yeah, I've got it here. Oh, right. Would you like to see it?
All right. Yeah, please, love to see that.
Thank you.
You said that you received an offer for £5 million for the company.
Yep.
Here's the reality.
You raised...
..£2.1 million...
..1.5 million of debt, 650 of equity,
only to receive an offer from this company... Yep.
..of two million, and they would have invested two million
on the basis of the fact that the company's already got
£650,000 of cash.
So, the offer that you really had was not five million.
To be clear, sorry, I probably misrepresented
what happened, by accident. Well, I'm not sure...
The debt facility was after that offer arrived.
We did not have that £1.5 million debt facility on the table
when that offer arrived.
But you can't use that as a suggestion that your company,
a year ago, was worth five million.
Your company was worth significantly less than that,
and the offer shows that in writing.
OK.
So sadly, I'm not going to invest today,
and say that I'm out.
Tech tycoon Peter Jones dismisses Martyn's valuation of his company
and is the first to exit proceedings.
And the flaws in Martyn's finances haven't gone down well
with Deborah Meaden either.
I'm not happy about somebody standing in the Den,
who is misrepresenting an offer to the level at which this offer
has been misrepresented.
So, to get that letter, I presented to their board,
their complete UK operating board.
There's things and conversations behind that letter
which makes me believe it's completely genuine.
That makes it worse.
This is clearly just an indicative proposal.
You're either very naive or you think I'm very naive.
Well, it must be me.
It's me.
Well, either of those scenarios are not one
that I particularly want to be part of.
So, I won't be investing.
I'm out.
Martyn, I think you're in a very difficult position
but you're an optimist.
What would be even better is if you're a realist. OK.
And I think it's a good piece of technology, actually.
But really, the value of this technology only comes in
when you've got about five million users and you can get
the accurate data that you need.
For me, it's not an investment today.
Good luck. I'm out.
So, Martyn, you're not a big company.
You're doing £50,000 a year turnover.
A little market stall that does more than that.
So, you've got a valuation, £10 million,
which is probably worth no more than a million.
As it stands today, you think a Dragon will come along
and save you.
One thing's for sure - I'm not!
I'm out.
That thorny issue of Martyn's valuation just won't go away,
as Touker Suleyman becomes the fourth Dragon to hang up
on the investment proposition.
But does Sara Davies think she's spotted a kindred spirit
in the entrepreneur?
Do you know what's funny, Martyn, is I'm a salesperson.
That's what I do all day, every day, day in, day out.
I sell.
And I'm watching you and I'm trying to read your body language
as you're going because it takes one to know one.
OK.
I think you're a great sales guy. Thank you.
But I actually think you are believing a lot
of what's in that letter.
And that for me is what's worrying me.
And that's why I'm out.
Thank you.
Good luck. Cheers, Martyn. Thank you, thank you.
So, that's it for Martyn.
The confident entrepreneur remained cool under pressure,
but in the end, his company price tag
proved a hot spot he just couldn't get away from.
Thank goodness you asked for that!
So, that letter, in black and white, says...
..we'll buy your company for a lot of money,
and after two years after we've put more of our money into your company,
we'll give you more money.
He's a good salesman.
I think the Dragons have missed a trick.
I hope I bump into them all in a couple of years,
and I can buy them a drink.