>>> WELCOME BACK TO A SPECIAL
EXTENDED INDEPENDENCE DAY THEMED
EDITION OF "ALL IN."
IM CHRIS HAYES.
THE CASE AGAINST THE TRUMP
ORGANIZATION AND HIS CHIEF
FINANCIAL OFFICER ALLEN
WEISSELBERG AT THIS POINT JUST
CHARGES AND INDICTMENT.
THEYRE ALLEGATIONS.
ITS NOT THE SUM TOTAL OF WHAT
PROSECUTORS KNOW AND WE HAVENT
READ THE DEFENSE RESPONSE.
BUT IF THE ALLEGATIONS ARE TRUE
IN THE CONTEXT THEY ARE
PRESENTED, IT SURE SEEMS LOOK A
PRETTY BLACK AND WHITE PICTURE
OF TAX FRAUD, NOT SOME
INCIDENTAL BOOKKEEPING ERROR,
BUT A PLAN THAT WAS
SYSTEMATICALLY ENGINEERED OVER
THE YEARS TO CREATE A MEANS OF
EVADING TAXES.
THE SMOKING GUN OF TAX FRAUD IS
THE CLASSIC TWO SETS OF BOOKS,
RIGHT?
ANY TIME A BUSINESS OR
INDIVIDUAL HAS FINANCIAL RECORDS
YOU HAVE FOUND FRAUD BECAUSE WHY
WOULD YOU NEED TWO.
THE CORNERSTONE OF FRAUD IS
TELLING ONE SET OF PEOPLE LIKE
TAX COLLECTORS LIES ABOUT YOUR
FINANCES WHILE YOU WERE KEEPING
AN ACCURATE SET OF RECORDS
HIDDEN.
AND YOU NEED TO TWO SETS OF
BOOKS.
THAT IS WHAT PROSECUTORS ALLEGE
THEY HAVE EVIDENCE OF HERE, JUST
ONE EXAMPLE OF MANY.
PROSECUTORS SAY, QUOTE, THE
PAYMENT OF TUITION EXPENSES FOR
WEISSELBERGS FAMILY.
WAS TREATED AS PART OF
WEISSELBERGS ANNUAL
COMPENSATION IN INTERNAL
RECORDS.
HOWEVER, THE INDIRECT
COMPENSATION IN THE FORM OF
TUITION PAYMENTS WAS NOT
INCLUDED ON WEISSELBERGS W-2 OR
OTHERWISE REPORTED TO STATE OR
LOCAL OR FEDERAL TAX ATTORNEYS.
SO, THE TRUMP BOARD HAVE THEIR
OWN RECORDS HOW MUCH ARE WE
PAYING ALLEN WEISSELBERG.
THEY SAID ONE THING, PART OF
THAT PAYMENT OR TUITION PAYMENT.
WHILE WEISSELBERG AND THE
COMPANY TELLS THE TAX ATTORNEYS
SOMETHING ELSE.
THESE CHARGES WERE ANNOUNCED
LAST WEEK.
AND SINCE THEN DONALD TRUMP HAS
BEEN OUT DOING THE THING THAT HE
REALLY BENEFITTED FROM
THROUGHOUT THE YEARS,
PARTICULARLY IN THE PRESIDENCY,
WHICH IS PUBLICLY SAVING HIS
CRIMES SO THEY WOULD NOT BE
SECRET SCANDALS THAT WERE
UNCOVERED.
2016 IN FRONT OF CAMERAS ASKED
FOR RUSSIA TO HURT HIS POLITICAL
OPPONENT.
RUSSIA, IF YOURE LISTENING, I
HOPE YOURE ABLE TO FIND THE
30,000 EMAILS THAT ARE MISSING.
RUSSIA, PLEASE HACK MY OPPONENT.
RUSSIA DID DO THAT.
AFTER HIS CALL PRESSURING
UKRAINE
UKRAINE TO INVESTIGATE THE
BIDENINGBIDEN
WENT PUBLIC.
HES DOING IT AGAIN IN A RALLY
IN FLORIDA ADMIT LG, LOOK, MAYBE
HE COMMITTED SOME CRIMES BUT
PEOPLE LIKE US ARE NOT SUPPOSED
TO BE PROSECUTED.
>> THEY GO AFTER GOOD,
HARDWORKING PEOPLE FOR NOT
PAYING TAXES ON A COMPANY CAR.
COMPANY CAR.
YOU DIDNT PAY TAXES ON THE CAR
OR A COMPANY APARTMENT.
YOU USED AN APARTMENT BECAUSE
YOU NEED AN APARTMENT BECAUSE
YOU HAVE TO TRAVEL TOO FAR WHERE
YOUR HOUSE IS.
YOU DIDNT PAY TAX.
OR EDUCATION FOR YOUR
GRANDCHILDREN.
I DONT EVEN KNOW, DO YOU HAVE
TO -- DOES ANYBODY KNOW THE
ANSWER TO THAT STUFF?
BUT THEY INDICT PEOPLE FOR THAT.
>> WEIRD HOW USING THE COMPANY
APARTMENT BECAUSE YOU LIVE SO
FAR AWAY FROM THE OFFICE DOESNT
QUITE LAND WITH THE CROWD.
MEANWHILE HIS COMPANY WAS LYING
ABOUT THE CASE SAYING IT WAS
ABOUT FRINGE BENEFITS.
>> THEYLL GO AFTER SOMEONE FOR
FRINGE EMPLOYMENT BENEFITS.
THATS WHAT THEYRE FOCUSED ON?
THEYLL GO AFTER A CORPORATE
VEHICLE AND A CORPORATE
APARTMENT.
>> THEY WANT TO GO AFTER THE CFO
OF TRUMP ORGANIZATION FOR FREE
PARKING OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
>> THE BEST THEY COULD COME UP
WITH WAS A CORPORATE CAR FOR THE
CFO OF THE TRUMP ORGANIZATION.
>> THEY SPENT MILLIONS OF
DOLLARS, THEY REVIEWED 3 MILLION
DOCUMENTS, COUNTLESS NUMBER OF
GRAND JURY HOURS, COUNTLESS
NUMBER OF WITNESSES AND THEY GOT
A GUY BECAUSE HE GOT A CORPORATE
CAR AND DIDNT DECLARE IT ON HIS
TAX RETURN.
>> OKAY.
KEEP IN MIND HERE AMIDST ALL
THIS, RIGHT, THEYRE NOT SAYING
YOU HAVE IT ALL WRONG AT ALL.
THIS IS SAYING HOW DARE YOU
PROSECUTE SOMEONE WHO IS EVADING
TAXES ON MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN
INCOME.
THATS NOTHING TO US.
PEOPLE GET PROSECUTED AND GO TO
JAIL FOR THIS ALL THE TIME, I
HAVE NEWS FOR YOU.
YOU CAN ASK PETE ROSE WHO SPENT
FIVE MONTHS IN PRISON AFTER
FAILING TO REPORT INCOME FOR
MEMORABILIA SELLS.
SINGER LAUREN HILL SPENT THREE
MONTHS IN PRISON FOR FAILING TO
PAY TAXES.
MICHAEL GRIM WENT TO PRISON
AFTER GOING TO PRISON, KEEPING
TWO SETS OF RECORDS.
THAT SOUND FAMILIAR?
NOW, LOOK, THERE IS AN
INESCAPABLE POLITICAL CONTEXT TO
ALL THIS.
PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES OF THE
PROSECUTION ARE POLITICIANS.
EVERYONE KNOWS WHO DONALD TRUMP
IS.
BUT ITS ALSO THE CASE THAT IF
WHAT IS ALLEGED IS TRUE, THE
POLITICS SHOULD NOT MAT TORE THE
PROSECUTION.
LAW PROFESSOR DANIEL WROTE ABOUT
THIS WHEN HE WROTE BEING
CONNECTED TO A TO A
CONTROVERSIAL SHOULDNT GET YOU
OUT OF JAIL.
HIS LATEST COLUMN ON THE
PROSECUTION OF THE TRUMP BOARD
IS TITLE LD "TRUMP ONE LAW FOR
HUNGRY PIZZA THIEVES, ANOTHER
FOR ME" AND HE JOINS ME NOW.
DAVID, LETS START WITH THIS
IDEA OF THE BACKGROUND CONTEXT.
YOU KNOW, I THINK THE ARGUMENT
THAT TRUMP AND HIS LIKE ARE
TRYING TO MAKE IT LIKE THIS IS
RIDICULOUS, NO ONE EVER GETS
NAILED FOR THIS.
IVE COVERED PEOPLE GETTING
NAILED FOR LESS THAN THIS.
WHAT SAY YOU?
>> WE DONT PROSECUTE VERY MANY
TAX CRIMES IN THIS COUNTRY.
440 CASES WERE ACTUALLY ACCEPTED
FOR PROSECUTION BY THE JUSTICE
DEPARTMENT LAST YEAR.
A COUNTRY OF 330 MILLION PEOPLE,
THATS NOT MANY CASES.
THESE ARE LEGAL SOURCE CASES,
WHICH IS WHAT APPLIES HERE.
THIS IS NOT ABOUT DRUG DEALING
OR BRIBERY.
HAVING SAID THAT, THE ARGUMENT
THAT, GEE, THIS IS NOTHING,
$1.76 MILLION IS 34 YEAR OF
INCOME TO THE TYPICAL AMERICAN
WORKER, ACCORDING TO THE LATEST
DATA FROM SOCIAL SECURITY.
THATS 34 YEARS OF WORKING.
BUT YOU DONT HAVE TO REPORT
INCOME ON IT.
GEE, YOU WISH I HADNT HAD TO
REPORT FOR THE LAST 34 YEARS
WHEN I MADE.
>> EXACTLY.
THERES ALSO -- I MEAN, THE SORT
OF TWO SETS OF BOOKS PART OF THIS IS INTRIGUING TO ME BECAUSE
THIS IS INTRIGUING TO ME BECAUSE
IT SPEAKS TO SOME -- THEY HAVE
TANGIBLE EVIDENCE.
IT ALSO MAKES YOU WONDER WHAT
ELSE THEY HAVE ACCESS TO.
>> INTERESTINGLY ALLEN
WEISSELBERG DIDNT GET A RAISE
FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS, KM SAYS A
LOT ABOUT DONALD TRUMP, THAT HE
DOESNT TAKE GOOD CARE OF HIS
CFO.
BUT KEEPING TWO SET OF BOOKS, AS
YOU SAID, IS THE CLASSIC
INDICATION OF A FRAUD.
AND IVE SAID FROM THE VERY
BEGINNING, THIS IS A GARDEN
VARIETY TAX FRAUD CASE.
AND YOULL NOTICE THERES NO
DENYING WHATS GOING ON.
I DO THINK THE MOST INTERESTING
THING THATS BEEN SAID SO FAR IS
WHAT DONALD SAID AT HIS RALLY
SATURDAY NIGHT.
DOES ANYBODY THE LAW HERE?
DONALD TRUMP CLAIMS TO BE THE
GREATEST EXPERT ON TAXES IN THE
HISTORY OF THE WORLD.
>> ITS ALSO THE CASE, SRI TO
SAY, THAT EVERYONE KNOWS --
EVERYONE KNOWS.
YOU MEAN, IF YOU ARE COMPENSATED
BY YOUR EMPLOYER WITH PERKS LIKE
THAT, YOU HAVE TO REPORT IT AS
INCOME.
THIS IS A VERY OBVIOUS AND BASIC
THING, AND OBVIOUSLY ALLEN
WEISSELBERG KNEW THAT, OBVIOUSLY
THE TRUMP PEOPLE KNEW THAT,
OBVIOUSLY EVERYONE IN THE
ORGANIZATION KNEW IT.
OTHERWISE THEY WOULDNT HAVE
GONE TO SUCH LINKS TO HIDE IT,
AS ALLEGED.
>> THE NEXT QUESTION TO ASK IS,
OKAY, WHO ELSE HAS NOT YET BEEN
INDICTED WHO COULD BE INDICTED?
THERES AN UNINDICTED
COCONSPIRATOR IN THE INDICTMENT.
HE VERY LIKELY IS JEFF CONNIE,
WHO WAS BROUGHT BEFORE THE GRAND
JURY AND TESTIFIED.
AND UNDER NEW YORK STATE LAW, IF
YOU COME BEFORE A GRAND JURY,
YOU HAVE IMMUNITY, TRANSACTIONAL
IMMUNITY FOR WHATEVER YOU
TESTIFY ABOUT.
HES THE CONTROLLER OF THE
ORGANIZATION, AND LOGICALLY
WOULD BE A PERSON INVOLVED IN
THIS CRIMINAL SCHEME.
>> WHAT DO YOU THINK THE STAKES
ARE HERE ZOOMING OUT PAST THIS.
WE STARTRD WITH YOU TALKING
ABOUT HOW FEW TAX CRIMES GET
PROSECUTED.
AND ONE OF THE THEMES OF THE
TRUMP ERA TO ME IS HOW MUCH
WRONG DOING HAS GONE UNDETERRED
AND UNINVESTIGATED AND
UNPROSECUTED AT THE HIGHEST
LEVELS OF AMERICAN LIFE FOR SO
LONG, AND TRUMP BEING THE KIND
OF ULTIMATE MANIFESTATION OF
THAT IF YOU JUST LET PEOPLE GET
AWAY WITH THINGS FOREVER.
>> WELL, WE JUST REPORTED THAT
YOUR ODDS IF YOU MAKE
$10 MILLION OR MORE OF HAVING A
COMPLETED AUDIT IN 2019 WERE 1
IN 700 DOWN FROM 1 IN 20 I THINK
IT WAS UNDER OBAMA IN HIS FIRST
FULL YEAR AS PRESIDENT.
>> WOW.
>> THE ENTIRE AMOUNT OF EXTRA
TAXES FOUND TO BE OWED BY THIS
CLASS OF PEOPLE WHO MAKE A
TRILLION DOLLARS IS
$5.4 MILLION.
BASICALLY UNDER DONALD TRUMP,
ENFORCEMENT AT THE TAX LAW AT
THE TOP HAS LARGELY STOPPED.
AND AT THE SAME TIME, AS I WRITE
IN MY PIECE, THERES A MAN
SERVING -- WHO WAS SENTENCED TO
50 YEARS -- A HUNGRY, HOMELESS
MAN, 50 YEARS FOR STEALING A
SLICE OF PIZZA, AND U.S. SUPREME
COURT HAS SAID SENTENCES LIKE
THAT ARE REASONABLE.
DONALD IS PART OF A GROUP OF
PEOPLE WHO THINK THEYRE
SPECIAL. THEYRE ABOVE THE LAW.
THEYRE ABOVE THE LAW.
THEY DONT HAVE TO PLAY BY THESE
RULES.
>> "THE NEW YORK TIMES" POINTS
OUT THERE ARE ECHOS OF HIS
FATHERS TACTICS ON TAXES.
THE FIRST CRIMINAL PROSECUTION
HARKENS BACK TO FRED TRUMPS
PURCHASE OF BOILERS IN THE 1990s
WHICH HE HAD ALLOWED OTHER
PEOPLE TO TAKE A CUT OF AS
UNTAXED COMPENSATION AND A WHOLE
BUNCH OF CORNER CUTTING THAT WAS
LAID BEAR IN THE "TIMES"
INVESTIGATION THAT APPEARS TO
HAVE BEEN STARTED LONG BEFORE
DONALD TRUMP TOOK OVER THE
COMPANY.
>> WELL, THATS WHY ITS
IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE THIS IS
THE FIRST INDICTMENT.
IT IS NOT THE LAST INDICTMENT.
AND THERE ARE LIKELY GOING TO BE
OTHERS.
AND IF ALLEN WAS GETTING THESE
DEALS, THEN WHAT KIND OF DEALS
WERE DON JR. AND ERIC AND IVANKA