prince harry has said racism from the
tabloid press in this country that
filtered into the rest of society was a
large part of why he
and his wife left the uk he told oprah
winfrey that the uk tabloid media is
bigoted and creates a toxic environment
of control and fear he said he thought
the prince of wales had been forced
to make peace with it last night's
interview on itv by the way was watched
by more than 11
million people here in the uk let's talk
now to
ian murray the executive director of the
society of editors an organization which
is was set up to fight to protect press
freedoms
hello to you mr murray good morning are
some
british tabloid newspapers bigoted
no no um they're not and what we're
seeing here is
the tragic story of the family at war as
we know
and your heart goes out to the duchess
in particular talking about
mental health problems that's there but
the accusation
that harry and megan said that they left
britain in part because of
racism towards them the accusation that
this was caused by
sections of the british media who are
racist i'm
afraid it's just not true and it's not
worn out by the evidence of
the coverage can i give you some
evidence mr murray
daley star ran a headline asking whether
harry would be marrying
into gangster royalty uh the mail online
mail online had a headline which
declared megan
was almost straight out of compton
well i mean content i'm not oh fake
completely with
with areas of
do you think those two headlines are
racist victoria if you're not going to
let me even answer you when you've asked
the question please thank you
so the question we raised there
basically is saying look here is a
i hate to use the same rags to riches
story and it was it was the same
uh with anyone that comes in from
outside into the royal family
loyal or mobility uh that they raised up
in that way
i think you've got to look at this whole
thing in the context
is is this saying that that um the
coverages have been given to
megan in particular but uh to the
duchess duke and duchess of sussex
then any perceived negative coverage
that has come about and
this is this follows a huge groundswell
of positive coverage
that came when megan was first started
dating and then engaged and then married
and married to prince harry amazing
amount of positive coverage which
reflected the warmth of the british
people
towards towards uh towards this couple
but then there were some negative
coverage that came in when the couple
began to
set out their stall i'm not going to use
the word preach and talk about things
close to their heart
environment cetera and questions being
asked of are they living up to are they
living up to
the ideals that they are they're putting
forward to say that
that that negative uh that sorry that
say that that is racist
and particularly targeted because megan
is
is a woman of color i'm not i'm afraid
that's not worn out by the truth you
just have to look at
uh the way that the world family has
been covered covered for decades
it's not as though uh the world family
haven't been given an easy ride by the
and you cannot say that the coverage and
the investigations into
prince philip princess anne edward and
sophie
harry and megan were just talking about
the coverage of themselves can i ask you
about
those headlines again the star asked
whether harry
would be marrying into gangster royalty
one headline sorry mr murray you just
told you just told me excuse me
please may i speak please ask your
questions huge amount of coverage
mr murray you can continue talking over
me but i know answer examples and say oh
look here's something that
someone might point to and say so
therefore that means that
no you told me you told me mr murray you
told me the british tabloid press was
not bigoted i've just given you some
examples
you're denying that those examples are
racist and i'm asking
why are you denying that well and i'm
making the
plaintiff victoria but what we're saying
i'm not defending individual things here
and there i'm looking at the whole thing
when you say that someone
might make one comment about something
and i'm not saying whether those were
bigoted or racist to talk well
let me ask you as the society of
actually finish enemies my point when
you actually label someone as
bigoted because of one example that that
is disputed
and actually say and not taking the
whole thing into context and saying look
at the way that they have covered it
i'm afraid that's the you know if you
keep on looking you will find that
needle in the haystack
but you just told me that the british
press isn't isn't racist and now you're
saying if you keep on looking you will
find
a racist needle in the haystack so let
me ask you again are those headlines
racist
simple yes i'm not going to stand to
defend and say whether they are not
what the context is society of editors
sorry victoria you know full well
because you are a journalist you've got
to see
the context well let me give you some
context please
things and i'm not saying let me give
you some context then
the headline which suggested that
megan was almost straight out of compton
underneath says
prince harry's new girl suit star meghan
markle is from crenshaw la
crenshaw has endured 47 crimes in the
past week
including murder gangs including the
bloods
count the neighborhood as their
territory markle's social worker mum
dora ragland lives in the rundown area
and the actress's ant
is in a nearby gang afflicted inglewood
is that racist is that are they racist
that is racist it's a straightforward
ranks to richie's story about saying
factually if it is factually correct
actually correct that it is
that's that's the background to jamaica
mark like i don't know whether it's
factually correct or not
in 2016 a report by the european
commission against racism and
intolerance found that hate speech
amongst traditional media
particularly tabloid newspapers in this
country
continues to be a problem do you not see
that at all
do i not see what is or do i not see do
i agree with their findings
that i have not read that report
recently i i'm not going to say that i
completely agree with that with their
findings i need to look further
into it but it's what they're actually
basing this on
do you think there's a difference
between someone like yourself
a white man society of editors
contemplating
racism on an intellectual level and
black people experiencing it on a daily
basis
i would say that i'm not bringing my
race or background into this
i would say that if i'm asked whether
the
section last sections of the british
media the tabloid press
are racist i would say no they are not
and
some extremely decent journalists many
of which you probably know who work
on the papers that are being pointed out
be horrified
shocked and disappointed to have that
leveled against them
a report by the reuters institute for
the study of journalism in 2016 found
that just
six percent of journalists across uk
newsrooms
don't identify as white that's a problem
isn't it
that is the problem there's a problem
throughout the whole of the industry
and do you think that could lead to
potentially racist coverage
you're going for cause cause and effect
the industry
i'm asking you realizes and recognizes
that has a challenge
and he's taking steps and the society of
editors has been working on that and has
been supporting and as an initiative
but it's working with others on that
matter no one is pretending that that is
not good enough
do you think the lack of diversity in
newsrooms might
contribute to racist coverage on
occasion
i know you're trying to trap me into
saying something i'm really not
it's very i'm not going to say i'm not
i'm not going to say because if i say
that it's a case of
therefore you're admitting that there is
there is that that we
do know it's not about admitting it's
about facing up to
issues that we've got in the mainstream
media in this country
um what issues that we don't have a
greater diversity with the newsrooms
absolutely
and that it could potentially lead to
racist coverage on occasion
i'm not going to go so far as to say
that because you're trying to put words
into my mouth with that
i'm not everyone would wish that the
media in this country
better reflects the diverse country that
we
are becoming okay i'd like to give you
some more headlines
and tell me what you think is going on
here
this is from the daily mail kate not
long ago now
pregnant kate tenderly cradles her baby
bump while wrapping up her royal duties
ahead of maternity leave
again from the daily mail why can't
meghan markle keep her hands off her
baby bump
is it price vanity acting or a new age
bonding technique
this from the daily express kate's
morning sickness cure
prince william gifted with an avocado
for pregnant duchess
again from the daily express meghan
markle's beloved avocado linked to human
rights abuses
and drought and one more again from the
daily mail
carol wins granny war duke and duchess
of cambridge will spend second
private christmas with the middleton
family rather than joining the queen at
sandringham
in the daily mail doesn't the queen
deserve better than this baffling
festive absence
richard k examines the impact of harry
and meghan's decision
not to spend christmas with the royal
family
what's going on there do you think
that's going on there reporting as
individual stories and i can't comment
and take them out of context
there but i don't see anything but what
we're discussing here is whether
there is racism in the coverage honestly
no evidence of racism in those coverages
not coverage and it's it's unfair it's
already beautiful be on the spot with
with bringing your headlines out of
context i don't know
what the stories are and i'm sorry
you're the society
you're the society of editors you
represent your members that's why i
thought you were coming on to talk to us
today
what if not insidious racism
are those headlines about one talking
about a white
woman one talking about a woman of mix
you're conflating those two issues and
i'm afraid that that's not that's not
the case at all these are
straightforward coverage
of news items some people say they
aren't really news items talking about
avocados
but they are talking about items there
is no racism involvement
could you be in complete denial
i think i've been in the industry long
enough to know
that i would not feel comfortable
sitting here if i believed
there was racism systemic throughout
sections of the industry it's simply not
the case
why do you think the white duchess is
written about in a positive way
but the woman of mixed heritage is
written about in a negative way
i think that kate's not always received
positive coverage
i don't that's the case and i think it's
quite a simple case as i
try to explain in the beginning but it
doesn't matter who it is
if someone in the royal family or anyone
in the public eye or push themselves
forward who actually
expo proposes uh to live certain
lifestyles and then
doesn't live up to those ideals uh then
they're going to find that they've got
negative press
thank you very much for talking to us
this morning thank you thank you
victoria