(pensive classical music)
- America is too divided.
Republicans versus Democrats.
Billionaires versus billions
of the rest of us broke bastards.
Karens versus everybody.
That's why I'm reaching out to the other side
to see if I can't find common ground
with people I disagree with strongly.
For this story, I traveled to Idaho or Montana or Wyoming,
somewhere with no black people,
to meet anti-government extremist
and big hat enthusiast, Ammon Bundy,
and see if I could get him to disagree to disagree.
(grand music)
- Doesn't matter if they call it Republican or Democrat,
it is poison to liberty.
- [Roy] You might remember Bundy from a 2014 standoff
with the government over grazing rights.
- [Protestor] This is our land.
- [Roy] Or from a standoff with the government
at a nature preserve in 2016.
- Ammon Bundy, who pointed guns at law enforcement
in Arizona, now he's doing it in Oregon.
- [Roy] Or from his protest
against state COVID restrictions in Idaho.
This dude is in a lot of standoffs.
And now a guy who spent two years in prison
for fighting the federal government
before getting out on a mistrial
is running for governor of Idaho.
- [Ammon] As governor, I will keep Idaho Idaho.
- [Roy] What the hell does that mean,
besides growing potatoes?
I decided to talk to some of Bundy's supporters.
- Ammon is definitely a threat
to the old boy network in Idaho.
Why?
You know, I don't need the government to tell me how to act.
- So, Ammon Bundy for less governor.
- Yes.
- Our rights don't come from the government,
our rights come from God, okay?
And certain people have said, you know what?
The buck has to stop somewhere.
- Okay, but you are black and in Idaho.
How did that happen?
- So I'm like third generation here, yeah.
- Okay.
- Ammon Bundy is willing to do what it takes
to defend liberty, just like Rosa Parks did on the bus.
- I had to meet with this white male version of sister Rosa.
Okay, so you've been called a militia leader.
You have been called the T word.
- Domestic.
- [Roy] Domestic terrorist, yeah.
- Domestic terrorist.
- How do you not come across as an anti-government person
who's now becoming part of the government?
- Well, I want people to use the land as God intended
and for the government just to leave 'em alone
other than to protect 'em.
- You know, like when you were a child,
your daddy be all in your business,
come in your room, go through your toys.
That's government now.
What we really want is a step-daddy government
that comes in and just goes,
hey, don't kill each other, I'll be outside drinking.
- Well, yeah, unless one of them tries to
infringe upon another person's right.
- [Roy] Clearly finding common ground would not be easy.
And sure enough, Bundy and I disagreed
on a range of issues from taxes.
- I don't believe that property tax is a moral tax.
- [Roy] To the social safety net.
- Never should I say, look, Joe over here is needing help
and I'm gonna force you with the barrel of the gun
to give me $150 so I can give it to Joe.
- [Roy] That's right. - It's immoral.
- (beep) you, Joe.
And the definition of slavery.
- And then pretty soon you end up with 30% of the people
providing for the other 70%, that's slavery.
- [Roy] And that's all before we got to
the King Kong of divisive issues today, COVID.
- Government will go as far as the people allow them to go
which is all the way to genocide.
- Explain genocide.
- Well, let's look at the 1930s.
What was the Nazis claiming?
What was their excuse?
It was a national health emergency
that the Jews and the blacks, that their genes were inferior
and ultimately decided that they needed
even put 'em to death, so.
- There weren't like Jews and blacks dying in droves
before Hitler came in and did what he did.
He chose to start doing that.
Whereas at least with COVID, there was,
oh, there's a bunch of dead people.
How do we stop this?
People are dying.
- So you're saying you believe
what the government is saying.
You believe the reports because they're so honest, right?
And they're so good.
- How do I get the information you got?
- You can get it.
- Because anytime people go, I've done the research.
They never say where.
- It's everywhere.
- No, that's not an answer.
Where the (beep) is it?
- Well, I can give it to you. - Mr. Bundy, I need to know.
- I can give it to you if you want.
I mean, do you wanna go over it right here on my phone?
- Everybody said they'd done the research,
but they had never give me a www.
And I hadn't even asked Bundy
about his history of armed standoffs against the government.
- Well, so these accusations of me
associating with violent groups.
Never once have we ever done anything violent.
- You're like a Gandhi of the Rocky Mountains.
I just can't get down with armed occupations,
especially when they end with death and prison.
Seemed like finding common ground was just too hard.
But then Bundy surprised me.
- I was in prison for two years, federal prison.
And you got the whites are always over here,
and you got the Mexicans and the Native Americans.
- Everybody sticks with their own kind.
- Yes, I know I didn't feel that way.
Next thing I know, I'm out playing basketball
with black guys and no problem, right?
The white guys might have a little bit of a problem with it.
So I go back there and I talk to them,
say, hey, look, I'm sorry, this is just the way I roll.
- I'm not a racist, but we're playing basketball.
- [Ammon] That's right. - And I really wanna win.
- Now, the guards in the prison gets all concerned
because the way they can keep us in the prison
is keep us divided.
And that's what's happening in society.
- As someone who also felt abused
by the criminal justice system,
Bundy was even supportive of a movement
on the opposite side of the spectrum.
- You must have a problem in your mind if you think
that somehow the Black Lives Matter
is more dangerous than the police.
- What?
This cowboy headed, beef sweating constitutionalist
was siding with Black Lives Matter and not the police.
What I'm hearing is, a brother who some of his views
kind of line up with Black Lives Matter.
- Well, I think they might line up with black people
and I think they might line up with white people too.
And I guarantee that if I was to be able to
communicate openly with the majority of the people
in Black Lives Matter that probably 95% of our beliefs
would align with each other.
- I think that's some common ground.
Maybe America is headed towards a civil war.
But for a moment, two Americans who vehemently disagree
found a way to be civil.
Okay, it was a brief moment.
You know, we don't agree on everything.
I just think it's okay.
And I just wanted to shake your hand.
- [Ammon] Okay.
- Good talking to you.
And there's something else we agree on.
I look damn good in a cowboy hat.
(upbeat music)