♪♪
>> Stephen: HEY, EVERYBODY, WELCOME BACK TO A LATE SHOW,
LET'S TALK TO A BAND LEADER, JON BATISTE.
WHAT IS GOING ON, HOW HAS YOUR DAY BEEN?
>> Jon: IT'S BEEN GOOD, YOU KNOW, IT'S RAINING A LITTLE BIT
OUT THERE BUT I GOT SOME HOOPS IN RIGHT BEFORE.
>> Stephen: HOW YOU CAN POSSIBLY, AREN'T YOU EVER AFRAID
YOU'RE GOING TO JAM A FINGER AND THEN THAT'S IT, CURTAIN, BACK
TO.
>> I ALWAYS PLAY WITH MYSELF, THAT IS WHY.
>> Stephen: OH, NOBODY PASSES TO YOU.
>> Stephen: NO, YOU KNOW, JUST SHOOTING, JUST PRACTICING GETS
ME SO HAPPY.
IT IS NICE, TO CONCENTRATE.
>> Stephen: ST LIKE A MEDITATION.
>> Jon: YH.
>> Stephen: I DO THE SAME THING, DO I THIS MEDITATION
WHERE I CLOSE MY EYES AND I DON'T GET UP FOR EIGHT HOURS.
IT IS JUST, OH-- DELIGHTFUL.
>> Jon: YOU GET EIGHT, I DIDN'T IMAGINE THAT YOU GOT
EIGHT IN.
>> Stephen: I DID, LAST NIGHT WHEN I WOKE UP AT 5, SOMETHING
LIKE, THAT YOU KNOW, GENERALIZED ANXIETY, JON.
>> Jon: OH YEAH, YEAH, I MEAN YOU DON'T HAVE TOO MUCH ON YOUR
PLATE.
>> Stephen: COULD YOU PLAY A LITTLE SOMETHING THAT MAYBE
WOULD RELIEVE MY GENERALIZED ANXIETY, COULD I ASK THAT OF
YOU, MY FRIEND.
>> Jon: OH, OF COURSE.
♪ >> Jon: YOU SEE THAT ALWAYS
LIFTS ME.
>> Stephen: THE FIRST SIX MONTHS OF THE SHOW WHEN WE WERE
TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW THO DO, I'M NOT SURE HOW WE'RE GOING TO
LIKE HIT THIS CLEANLY EVERY NIGHT, JON WOULD FINISH EVERY
SHOW WITH THAT SONG.
AND EVERY SHOW I WOULD SING IT WITH HIM AND EVERY NIGHT IT MADE
ME FEEL BETTER.
LIKE THAT WAS, THAT WAS LIKE A LIFE RAFT STO ME AT THE END OF
EVERY NIGHT.
AND TO HEAR THE AUDIENCE SING ALONG WITH IT MADE ALL THE
DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD, I WILL BE GRATEFUL FOREVER THAT YOU
GAVE THAT TO ALL OF US AT THE END OF EVERY SHOW.
THANK YOU.
>> Jon: OH MY GOODNESS.
I LOVE THAT.
>> Stephen: JON BATISTE, EVERYBODY, THE HONOR IS ALL
OURS.
JOINING ME NOW ■SAN AUTHOR, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST AND NIECE
OF PRESIDENT TRUMP WHO HAS WRITTEN A BOOK ABOUT THEIR
FAMILY CALLED "TOO MUCH AND NEVER ENOUGH" PLEASE WELCOME
MARY TRUMP.
MARY, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.
>> OH, IT'S SUCH A PLEASURE, STEPHEN, THANK YOU FOR HAVING
ME.
>> Stephen: NOW BEFORE WE GET STARTED, HAVE YOU SEEN MY SHOW?
BECAUSE I TALK ABOUT YOUR UNCLE A LOT.
>> I HAVE INDEED SEEN YOUR SHOW.
> Stephen: OKAY, GOOD.
THEN ARE YOU, DO YOU ENJO I IT?
ARE YOU OKAY WITH MY SHOW?
>> I THINK IT'S AMAZING, ACTUALLY.
>> Stephen: I NEVER THOUGHT I WOULD HEAR THAT, A TRUMP ENJOYS
MY SHOW.
THANK YOU SO MUCH.
I WAS DEFINITELY FISHING BUT THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
OKAY.
NOW YOU'VE GOT A Ph.D IN PSYCHOLOGY.
>> YEAH.
>> Stephen: IS THERE ANY IDEA THAT THE LAST FOUR YEARS ARE
SOME SORT OF FEVER DREAM THAT WE ARE ALL JUST GOING TO WAKE UP
FROM?
>> I HOPE THAT'S THE CASE EVERY DAY.
BUT UNFORTUNATELY, I DON'T THINK SO, SORRY.
SO YEAH, WE HAVE OUR WORK CUT OUT FROM US, I'M AFRAID.
>> Stephen: YOUR BOOK ABOUT YOUR UNCLE, YOUR GRANDFATHER,
YOUR FATHER AND THE ENTIRE FAMILY IS CALLED "TOO MUCH AND
NEVER ENOUGH."
WHAT DOES THAT TITLE REFER TO?
>> WHEN I STARTED FORM LATING THIS BOOK IT WAS REALLY
IMPORTANT TO ME TO LOOK BACK.
AND TRY TO MAKE SENSE OF HOW WE GOT TO WHERE WE ARE TODAY.
AND IN LOOKING AT THE DYNAMICS THAT EXISTED BETWEEN DONALD AND
HIS FATHER, MY DAD AND HIS FATHER AND DONALD AND MY FATHER,
I SAW SOME PATTERNS.
AND I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT THEY HAD HAD AN EXTREMELY
DIFFICULT-- CHILDHOOD, IN THE CONTEXT OF CHILD ABUSE THERE ARE
TWO WAYS IT CAN FUNCTION.
EITHER YOU GET TOO MUCH OF SOMETHING, TOO MUCH
ENCROACHMENT, TOO MUCH NEGATIVE ATTENTION, TOO.
UNREALISTIC EXPECT AND THAT IS WHAT MY FATHER AS THE OLDEST
SON, NAME SAKE AND HEIR APPARENT SUFFERED FROM MY GRANDFATHER.
AND THEN ON THE OTHER END OF THE SPECTRUM THERE IS THE NOT
ENOUGH.
NOT ENOUGH ATTENTION.
NOT ENOUGH MIRRORING, NOT ENOUGH AFFECTION, NOT ENOUGH LOVE.
SO IT STARTED FROM THERE.
BUT THEN IN SPEAKING OF MY FAMILY AS BE ENTITY, YOU KNOW,
AND AS MY GRANDFATHER AS THE HEAD OF IT WHO SEEMED TO BE ONLY
INTERESTED IN MONEY, THESE ARE PEOPLE WHO HAD TOO MUCH OF THAT
BECAUSE IT DOESN'T SEEM TO HAVE DONE THEM MUCH GOOD.
AND BECAUSE OF THE VAST WEALTH THEY PO TES-- POSSESSED STRKS
ALMOST AS IF, CERTAINLY FOR DONALD, HE DIDN'T HAVE TO TRY
VERY HARD.
AND THE OTHER PROBLEM IS WHEN MONEY IS THE ONLY CURRENCY IN
YOUR FAMILY, THERE'S NEVER ENOUGH OF IT.
BECAUSE IT CAN NEVER TAKE THE PLACE OF THINGS THAT REALLY
MATTER LIKE LOVE AND AFFECTION.
>> Stephen: YOU GET THAT SENSE FROM THE PRESIDENT, AND AGAIN I
DON'T KNOW THE MAN, I HAVE MET HIM A FEW TIMES AND I HAVE
STUDIED HIS BEHAVIOR.
BUT IS HE ALWAYS SEEKING VALIDATION.
AND NO MATTER WHAT IT IS, WHEN HE OPENS THE WRAPPER OF IT, IT
IS ALWAYS EMPTY, NEVER SATISFYING FOR HIM, WHETHER ST
THE PRESIDENCY HIMSELF OR A MILITARY PARADE OR THE PRAISE
FROM EVERY PERSON HE MEETS.
HOW AS SOMEONE WHO HAS STUDIED CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGY AND
CHILDHOOD TRAUMA, HOW WOULD YOU, I DON'T WANT TO SAY TREAT BUT
HOW WOULD YOU ADDRESS SOMEONE LIKE THAT, IS THERE ANYTHING
THAT COULD BE DONE FOR THE PRESIDENT TO GIVE HIM SOME SORT
OF SOLACE WHICH IN SOME WAYS WOULD BE BETTER FOR THE REST OF
IT?
>> IT IS AN OLD-- AND I HATE SAYING IT BUT I THINK THE ANSWER
IS NO.
PARTIALLY BECAUSE IT'S EXTREMELY DIFFICULT TO HELP SOMEBODY WHO
IS NOT AWARE HE NEEDS HELP.
I THINK AT THIS POINT IT IS LIKE, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE FOR
DONALD TO ADMIT TO ANY KIND OF WEAKNESS OR INCAPACITY THAT
NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED.
YOU HE ALSO UNFORTUNATELY SEEMS TO BE SURROUNDED BY PEOPLE WHO
ARE PERFECTLY HAPPY HAVING HIM BEHAVE THE WAY HE BEHAVESES NOW,
FOR WHATEVER THEIR AGENDAS MAY BE.
THEY'RE NOT THAT INTERESTED IN MAKING DONALD A BETTER PERSON.
>> I SPOKE TO AMBASSADOR BOLTON A FEW WEEKS AGO WHO SAID THAT HE
HAD NEVER SEEN A HEAD OF STATE WHO WAS SO EASILY MANIPULATED BY
OTHER HEADS OF STATE, BY STRONG MEN WHO PLAYED HIM, LIKE YOU
SAID, LIKE A FIDDLE.
IS THERE SOMETHING ABOUT YOUR UNCLE, THE MAKEUP OF HIS
PERSONALITY THAT MAKES HIM MANIPULATABLE.
>> SURE, AND THAT IS ALSO SOMETHING THAT IS-- FROM MY
GRANDFATHER, BECAUSE DONALD REALIZE THE AT A FAIRLY YOUNG
AGE THAT THE ONLY WAY TO SUCCEED WHERE MY FATHER FAILED WAS TO BE
THE KIND OF PERSON MY GRANDFATHER NEEDED HIM TO BE.
THE PILLAR, THE TOUGH GUY, SOMEBODY WHO WOULD NEVER ADMIT
OR NEVER ADMIT BEING WRONG.
HE BASICALLY FIND OURSELVES NOW WITH A PERSON WHO JUST NEEDS TO
HAVE THE THINGS HE HAS TO BELIEVE ABOUT HIMSELF.
HE'S THE GREATEST, THE BEST, REPEATED OR TOLD HIM BY SOMEBODY
ELSE IN ORDER TO MAKE HIM MALL EEBL.
AND I THINK I WRITE IN THE BOOK THAT THAT IS ONE OF THE THINGS
MY GRANDFATHER DOES-- DID.
HE MADE DONALD EMINENTLY USEFUL TO SMARTER, MORE POWERFUL MEN.
AND THAT IS ANG EXTREMELY DANGEROUS SITUATION FOR US TO BE
IN CONSIDERING THE POWER THAT DONALD HAS.
>> Stephen: WHEN YOU SAY THAT YOUR FATHER FAILED, I ASSUME YOU
MEAN IN THE EYES OF YOUR GRANDFATHER.
AND IN WHAT WAYS, WHAT IS THAT QUOTE UNQUOTE FAILURE IN THE
EYES OF YOUR GRANDFATHER THAT YOUR UNCLE, DONALD TRUMP SAW.
LIKE WHAT WAS THE THING THAT HE DIDN'T DO FOR HIS FAMILY THAT
DONALD TRUMP HAD TO STEP UP AND OVERCOME IN HIS OWN LIFE, OUT OF
FEAR I ASSUME.
>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
I THINK FEAR IS THE MOST POWERFUL FACTOR THAT RUNS
THROUGHOUT THE FAMILY.
>> Stephen: I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING THE PRESIDENT USES, HE
IS USING IT NOW, FALLING BACK ON THE CRUTCH OF FEAR SAYING THAT
JOE BIDEN IS GOING TO ELIMINATE THE SUBURBS.
>> YEAH.
WHICH I GUESS IS A THING THAT WE DIDN'T KNOW EXISTED.
>> Stephen: YOU DID NOT KNOW, EXACTLY.
>> YEAH.
BUT YES, FEAR AND FEAR OF HUM IL YAITION BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY HUM IL
YAITION IS A WEAPON QUITE FREQUENTLY AS WELL.
SO BECAUSE DONALD TRUMP HAD, BEING SEVEN AND A HALF YEARS
YOUNGER THAN MY DAD, HE WAS ABLE TO SEE WHAT HE SHOULD NOT DO IF
HE WANTED TO AVOID THE KINDS OF PUNISHMENT MY GRANDFATHER
SUBJECTED MY DAD TO.
PIE DAD WHO HAD EVERY INTENTION OF FULFILLING HIS ROLE AS HEIR
APPARENT AND TAKING OVER PIE GRANDFATHER'S BUSINESS ALSO
HAPPENED TO BE A VERY KIND, GENEROUS PERSON.
HE DARED HAVE INTEREST OUTSIDE OF BUSINESS.
HE LOVED BOATS AND FISHING AND WATER-SKIING AND FLYING,
OBVIOUSLY.
HIS FRIENDS ADORED HIM.
SO BECAUSE MY GRANDFATHER DIDN'T VALUE ANY OF THAT, AND BELIEVED
THAT THAT JUST TOOK AWAY FROM MY DAD'S, WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN MY
DAD'S SOLE PURPOSE WHICH WAS WORKING AT TRUMP MANAGEMENT,
DONALD LEARNED THE LESSON THAT IF YOU WANT TO SURVIVE AND
SUCCEED IN THIS FAMILY, YOU SHOULDN'T BE KIND, YOU SHOULDN'T
BE GENEROUS, AND YOU SHOULDN'T CARE ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE, AND
YOU CERTAINLY SHOULDN'T BE INTERESTED IN WHETHER OR NOT
PEOPLE LOVED YOU.
>> Stephen: WE HAVE TO TAKE A QUICK BREAK, BUT STICK AROUND,
EVERYBODY, WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK WITH MORE MARY TRUMP.
♪♪