DOCUMENTING THE WAR IS OUT NOW
FEATURED WITH TWO SPECIAL COVERS
THIS WEEK.
COLONEL VINDMAN, THE BRUTALITY,
THE UNSPARING NATURE OF
INTENTIONAL BOMBING A THEE TEMPA
WHERE WOMEN AND CHILDREN ARE
INSIDE, IT FEELS LIKE THE
JUNCTURE OF THE WAR.
IS THAT FAIR?
>> IT IS.
RUSSIANS -- RUSSIAN ARMED FORCES
NOTORIOUS TO STRIKE HOSPITALS,
SCHOOLS, THEATERS.
THIS IS UNFORTUNATELY WHAT I
REFER TO AS MORALE TARGETS.
LOOKING TO CRUSH THE WILL OF THE
PEOPLE AND THE WILL TO RESIST.
THIS IS THE WAY THEY FIGHT THE
WAR.
FROM THEIR STAND POINT THERE'S A
LOGIC TO IT.
THE LOGIC IS WAR, A PROLONGED
WAR IS MORE DISASTROUS THAN A
SHORT, SHARP WAR.
FOR THEM GOING TO THESE EXTREME
LENGTHS WE DON'T RECOGNIZE -- SO
OUT OF CONTEXT IN THE WEST WE
WOULDN'T THINK ABOUT STRIKING
AND DO THIS ACCIDENTALLY.
MAYBE COLOT -- COLLATERAL DAMAGE
BUT THIS IS THE WAY THEY FIGHT
AND A FEATURE OF THE REST OF THE
WAR IN UKRAINE.
>> CONTROL KNELL VINDMAN, IT IS
FOR THE U.S. STATE DEPARTMENT,
WE HEARD FROM SECRETARY OF STATE
BLINKEN, THE CIA DIRECTOR, DIA
DIRECTOR AND OTHERS THE
INTELLIGENCE ABOUT RUSSIA AND
CHEMICAL WEAPONS IS WHAT HAS SO
FAR BEEN A PLAN TO THROW THEM
OFF KEY.
THAT SAID YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT
HOW MUCH WE KNEW ABOUT THE PLAN
TO INVADE AND WE DIDN'T
FORESTALL THAT.
HOW ARE WE PROCESS TALKING ABOUT
THIS INTELLIGENCE THAT SUGGESTS
THAT THE RUSSIANS MAY BE
DANGLING LOOSE LANGUAGE ABOUT
CHEMICAL WEAPONS IN UKRAINE AS A
PRETEXT FOR THEIR OWN CHEMICAL
WEAPON ATTACK IN THAT COUNTRY?
>> I THINK THE OBJECTIVES ARE TO
INTIMIDATE THE POPULATION IN
UKRAINE.
THE UKRAINE LEADERSHIP TO COMPEL
THEM TO CAPITULATE AND TO SIGNAL
TO THE U.S. THAT UNLESS IT PLAYS
A CONSTRUCTIVE ROLE IN PUTTING
PRESSURE ON UKRAINE TO END THE
WAR IT COULD GO TO WEAPONS OF
MASS DESTRUCTION.
IN REALITY I THINK THIS IS THE
SAME POLICY OF EXPOSING RUSSIA'S
PROVOCATIONS TO CLOSE OFF THOSE
AS LEGITIMATE DENIABLE
ACTIVITIES BY THE RUSSIAN
GOVERNMENT WHEN A -- UNDERTAKING
THE ATTACKS.
I THINK UNFORTUNATELY THAT'S NOT
GOING TO -- WE DIDN'T FORESTALL
THE WAR AND WON'T FORESTALL A
CHEMICAL STRIKE IF THE RUSSIANS
CHOOSE TO GO IN THAT DIRECTION.
WE NEED TO SIGNAL THAT THIS
WOULD BE AN ESCALATION THAT
COULD FRANKLY COMPEL NATO AND
THE WEST TO ESTABLISH A NO-FLY
ZONE OR TO STRIKE RUSSIAN
TARGETS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE
CHEMICAL WEAPONS.
SIMILAR TO THE PREVIOUS
ADMINISTRATION DID.
IT IS NOT ENOUGH TO EXPOSE THE
RUSSIAN WRONGDOING AND NOT
PREROGATIVE TOWARDS A BROADER
WORLD WAR OR A BROADER
CONFRONTATION BETWEEN RUSSIA AND
NATO.
THIS CAN BE JUST INDICATING THAT
WE ARE SERIOUS.
THIS IS A THRESHOLD THAT WE
CAN'T TOLERATE.
BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS OR NUCLEAR
WEAPONS AGAINST ANOTHER COUNTRY
ESPECIALLY BY RUSSIA AGAINST
AGREEMENT WHEN UKRAINE GAVE UP
THE NUCLEAR WEAPONS.
RUSSIA WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A
GUARANTOR OF SECURITY AND THAT
THE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION
WOULDN'T BE USED AGAINST
UKRAINE.
THERE IS BASIS SO IT DOESN'T
SPISHL
SPIRAL INTO A BROADER
CONFRONTATION.
IT IS A RED LINE AND A REALISTIC
RED LINE TO NOT ALLOW TO PASS
UNCONTESTED.
>> LET ME SHOW YOU MY COLLEAGUE
LESTER HOLT PUT THESE QUESTIONS
TO PRESIDENT ZELENSKYY IN THE
INTERVIEW YESTERDAY.
LET ME SHOW YOU SOME OF HIS
ANSWERS ON THESE TOPICS.
>> THE U.S. ADMINISTRATION
RAISED CONCERNS THAT RUSSIA
MIGHT LAUNCH A CHEMICAL ATTACK.
DO YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE A RED
LINE THAT THE U.S. WOULD MOVE
FORWARD TO BE ACTIVE INVOLVED IN
COMBAT?
>> Translator: IF THEY LAUNCH
THE MISSILES AGAINST SCHOOLS,
UNIVERSITIES, NOW THAT IS A
CROSS OF EVERY SINGLE LINE.
WHAT ELSE SHOULD WE WAIT FOR?
>> I JUST LIKE TO BE CAUTIOUS
WHEN -- I KNOW YOU ARE MORE
CAUTIOUS AND THOUGHTFUL THAN
JUST ABOUT ANYONE BUT FOR OUR
CONSUMPTION TALKING ABOUT RED
LINE AS THE PRESIDENT SAID
BABIES ARE TARGETED AND CAL
PERRY REPORTED AT THE BEGINNING
OF THE WEEK FROM DEHYDRATION AND
STARVATION.
WHAT CONCERNS YOU OR WHAT
COUNSEL DO YOU HAVE AS THE WEST
ENGAGES IN WITH THE DEFINITION
OF A RED LINE IS AND IS NOT?
>> YEAH.
I THINK THERE'S STILL SOME
WISHFUL THINKING ABOUT HOW THIS
INFOLDS.
WE CAUGHT UP WITH THE REALITY
THAT THIS IS HEADED TO A
PROTRACTED WAR AND THE UKRAINES
CONTINUE TO RESIST, CONTINUE TO
DESTROY LARGE PORTIONS OF THE
RUSSIAN MILITARY AND RUSSIA
BACKED INTO A CORP.ER TO.
WE'RE STILL IN THIS MINDSET THAT
IT'S GOING TO CONTINUE ON THE
WAY WE SIGHEE IT RIGHT NOW.
THIS IS FRANKLY BEEN AN AREA OF
CRITICISM FROM ME IS TOO
SHORTSIGHTED.
OUR APPROACH TO SUPPORTING
UKRAINE IS INCREMENTAL.
WE SHOULD GIVE THE SYSTEMS IN
THE LAST 24 HOURS IS EXCELLENT.
EXACTLY WHAT THEY NEED AND NEED
MORE.
MORE CAPABLE SYSTEMS.
AND WE ARE GOING TO GET TO THE
POINT TO OPEN UP THE FLOOD GATES
AND GOING TO TAKE ANOTHER
CATASTROPHE BEFORE WE GET THERE.
I THINK WE NEED TO BE MORE
THOUGHTFUL ABOUT HOW THIS IS
GOING TO UNFOLD BASED ON WHAT WE
KNOW RIGHT NOW AND TAKE MORE
RISK INFORMED ACTIONS THAT ARE
NOT PROVOCATIVE BUT ARE METERED
TO UNDERSTAND THAT THE RUSSIANS
ARE NOT SUICIDAL.