- So let's go to New Orleans.
Louise.
- [Louise] Hi, Katie.
- Hi.
There she is, hi.
- Hi there.
(laughs)
- So Louise, read your email please.
- Sure, sure.
My Mom's best friend's son sexually assaulted me
and beat me up when we were kids.
I brought this to my Mom's attention when it happened
and she declined to believe me at that time.
Since then, he's been jailed for rape
and the issue came up again between us
about eight years ago,
after he had served his jail time.
When it did, she told me
that she wished to remain friends with him
and wanted to keep him in her life.
I'm struggling to come to grips
with this betrayal I feel.
I've done the work as stuff comes up around this issue,
but it seems like I'm still missing the key
to unlock the issue.
- Yeah, yeah.
Well, thank you for that
and for that email.
And let's start just simply.
Just simple, okay.
Whose business is it who you want to be friends with?
- It's mine and no one else's (laughs).
- And imagine if your mother tried to convince you
to be with someone you didn't want to be with?
Or befriend them?
- Yeah, okay.
- Would not be pretty.
- No. - It would be unjust, unfair.
- Yeah.
- And impossible (laughs)
in that state of mind.
Okay, so whose business is it who your mother
wants to be friends with?
- It's hers.
- Yeah, and notice how you react
when you try to control your mother.
- Yeah, it doesn't work,
it never works (laughs). - No.
It doesn't
and then your mind has to continue to bring up that rape
over and over and over
in an effort to convince your mother.
Even if it's just in your head.
You have to keep it alive, defense is that way.
- Yeah.
- You have to keep injustice alive inside of you
and who is calling it up?
Who is using it as a defense?
You are.
It's alive and well so look what you're being friends with.
- Nothing pretty.
- Nothing pretty and so it's at your expense
and your mother is holding her own for whatever reason.
So I had the thought as I was reading your email
if you asked your mother specifically
why she wants to be friends with him,
what do you think she would say?
I mean, she's probably said it.
- So she values what he brings to her life.
I know that that's true.
She's said that in the past.
- But you don't want that for her.
- Yeah, okay, that's not fair.
Yeah, okay.
- Well, it's definitely not loving.
He brings value to my life.
Well, Mom, I don't want that for you.
- Yeah, okay (laughs).
- He brings value to her life.
Now look at you, when you're arguing with her
and defending your position,
how much value is there?
- None (laughs).
- For either one of you, it's war.
Defense is the first act of war.
So he brings value to her life.
Did she say anything else, what did she say?
If you just said, specifically,
"Mom, why do you want to be friends with him?"
- Yeah, I'm not sure what else she would say.
In the eight years since this has happened,
he's no longer in her life
not because of any decision she made.
So it's kinda hard to say what, eight years ago,
what he brought to her life
and what else she would say.
- And he's fallen out of her life for whatever reason,
and you're still holding the resentment.
You got what you wanted and how happy are you?
- Yeah, no, still not.
- So it's not that you wanted him out of her life,
you have that now.
And it's not doing that much for you.
It's that feeling of betrayal.
- Yeah.
- And look how you're betraying your mother all along.
- Okay, I don't see that.
- Okay, he brings value to her life
so you betray her by not wanting that value.
And then we saw something else important.
So what I'd suggest is a Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet
and on statement one, my Mom wants to keep him in her life.
And I would find that situation
when you first had that discussion eight years ago,
and really be present in that moment in time
as you fill in the rest of the worksheet.
For example, I want her to drop him from her life.
That could be statement two.
She should stop talking to him.
That would be statement three
on the Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet.
And these are just me sitting in that same experience.
So you would find your own,
and they pretty much look like this,
'cause there are no new stressful thoughts.
But I have to be in that situation
to fill out a Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet,
which is what I did.
I have to be there visually
in that time, in that place
with my mother sitting there
when she's saying he wants her in his life.
She wants him in her life.
And then feel that.
And as I fill in the worksheet,
just identify what were the thoughts I was thinking
in that moment?
Because those thoughts, as you identify them,
you are gathering the thoughts that caused the resentment.
That for some of us, that hate, that rage, that betrayal,
because we get that small in it,
and he gets that big and he raped me.
The injustice
and as we're experiencing that,
as we fill in Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet,
it's worth it because everything that made us feel that way
is what we were thinking and believing
so we're going back to collect it.
So when we question it, we are questioning
what caused all those emotions and separation from mother.
It's huge to finally understand the cause,
not only the cause of all of our pain, our suffering,
but how to find it.
Where to go for it.
How to collect it, such a gift.
And then, for statement three,
she should stop speaking to him.
And then I had for statement four,
what do I need to be happy in that situation?
I need her to see how badly he hurt me.
Big one.
'Cause if she really knew she would understand,
but how can someone,
if I'm raped, how can my mother understand that?
It didn't happen to her.
But if I want her to hold me I'm going to ask.
If I'm going to, you know,
I could get childlike and just ask for what I want.
"Mom, tell me you love me more than him."
I mean, that just sounds ridiculous
but that's where I'm at.
"And Mom, I want you to hold me,
"I want you to tell me you understand.
"I want you to tell me you understand
"how badly he hurt me."
Now even if they're saying that without your prompting
you won't believe her as long as you're believing
those thoughts on the Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet.
So we may as well be honest, do a worksheet,
and say, "Mom, would you hold me?
"Mom, just tell me you understand."
And then they'll say the words
and there's a connection there
where she's not being forced.
You're asking for what you want.
It's kind
and it's healing and the people in our life,
we can ask.
I'm kind of getting from you that she would say those things
and do that.
- Yeah, she would.
But when we're believing these thoughts
on the worksheet for example,
we want no piece of that mother.
She sold us down the river.
So then on
she is,
in statement five,
she is insensitive and a traitor,
and on the last one,
I don't ever want to see her throw me away for him again.
So you sit and collect thoughts like this
and then when you're turning it around it's like,
I want me to drop him from my life and this is your life.
I mean, she hasn't even seen him for eight years.
But he's living rent-free in your head as they say.
- Yes, he is.
- And it hurts with those images.
And she should stop speaking to him.
I should speaking to her in that way.
Expecting her to, and I'll let you fill
in the blanks with that.
Expecting her to feel what I feel.
To understand what I went through.
It's not possible.
So to sit in that and to see, you know,
I need her to see how badly he hurt me.
I don't need her to see how badly he hurt me.
So give me an example.
- I don't want her to feel that pain.
- As, was his name, some comedian,
he says, "Boo!"
That's it.
I don't want anyone to feel that pain again.
And every time you use him as a defense with your mother,
and in your mind with your mother,
that's what's going on.
So you're seeing how badly he hurt you.
But he's not hurting you anymore.
You're seeing how badly you're hurting you.
- Yeah (laughs).
- I mean, he raped you how many times and here you are.
You're just doing it over and over
and once we wake up to that,
you see him raping you as we're talking about it?
You see an image of that?
Of him beating you?
Hurting you?
- Yeah, hurting me
and, I've done a lot of work on that.
So that's not as immediate.
- But still do you see an image of him hurting you?
- Yeah, yeah.
- You see that?
Is that him?
- No (laughs).
- That's not even him.
Is that you being hurt?
- It is me doing it to myself.
- Yes, but that image in your head of him and you,
is that you?
That image in your head?
- Yeah.
- Really, is that imagination or is that you?
You know, you believe yourself to be this physical body.
I mean look at the little girl in that image.
You probably can't even see what she's wearing clearly.
Her face isn't even clear.
But the ego will claim that as I.
- Oh, okay.
- It's an image like you're reading a newspaper.
Like you're going through photographs of someone else.
It's how you react when you believe the thought,
these images come, you see them, you witness that movie.
That movie of not him, not you, but you witness that movie
and you just become sick with resentments
and lack of fairness and immediately you're the victim
but that's not you.
Okay, so to sit in it as not I and witness,
and in that fourth question, as I'm witnessing that,
it becomes so impersonal.
I mean, it has to be impersonal because that's not I.
And that's not he.
- Okay.
- When I look at how do I react when I believe the thought,
when I believe that's him, that's me, that past,
resentful, hurt,
and without the thought,
we just sit and we watch and there's so much
as we witness that.
It shows us so much, like the mind would exaggerate
and when we sit fearlessly without fear
and the real thing, like the real image that's happening,
that not I,
we see that what we thought was there
wasn't necessarily there.
Like it could cost us about,
depending on what we're working,
like 80 or 90% of what we thought happened,
just as we witness without fear.
But it takes a lot of courage
because we're losing identity here.
And who am I without that,
if I'm not a victim, who am I?
My God, I'd have to love and be happy.
(laughs)
Until finally, you know
you notice all the years you've spent with him
in your head, that apparent him in your head.
What did your mother say?
She gets a lot of value from it.
That's when you finally start getting value from it
as you're mediating on this Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet
and those four questions and turnarounds.
And then I don't ever want to see her throw me away
for him again is the last one on the worksheet.
So I'm willing to want to see her throw me away for him.
I look forward to wanting her
to throw me away for him again.
In my head 'cause it shows me what work I have,
what work isn't done yet.
That's why people are raped, or hurt, or attacked.
You know what I love about the past, it's over.
In this moment, all the pain that has ever been,
that has ever happened in the world in this moment,
it's over.
It's in the past and it appears in images
as though it were real
and it gives us, as we experience these emotions,
it gives us what to write
on a Judge-Your-Neighbor Worksheet next.
And it's not done until it's done.
We're not awake til we're awake.
Awake to the dream, that one in our head,
but to be thorough with is, it's not enough.
To say, "That's not me, that's not I, that's not he."
And it's like these things need to be worked through.
It's not I, it's not he, that's the truth.
It's got to all go,
until it's gone, we're not free.
That's how we know there's more to look at.
And then this experience
can be the only thing you work on a worksheet
because these thoughts will go everywhere.
It's like if someone, if that last new year's cleanse,
the woman that, it's gone now.
Anyway, I think that you're a very brave woman
and hopefully our conversation today
has helped a lot of us with mother issues.
(laughs)
Issues, issues!
And in this moment right now, you know,
right here, right now, isn't this amazing?
Isn't this amazing?
It is so, it's so amazing.
- Yeah.
- Thank you, precious.
- Thank you.
- You're welcome.