- You know, it really wasn't that long ago
that mountain bike journalists
and brand managers worldwide
were applauding the benefits
of large volume tires.
But what happened to them?
What happened to the plus size?
Are they still fast?
Are they still relevant?
And what place do they have
on e-mountain bikes?
(upbeat music)
So what is plus size?
Well, it's a name that was dreamt up
by the mountain bike industry
to describe those larger volume tires.
It's most often associated with 27.5 inch wheel size,
although you can get plus in 29.
And it's not to be confused with fat tyres which are simply
ridiculous because plus actually makes a lot of sense.
So here's a selection of tires.
As you can see,
the plus, this is a three inch plus tire
for a 2016 specialized Levo.
And as you can see,
it's actually not too dissimilar to a 2.3 tire
on a 29 inch wheel if you have a look at the heights there.
And over on the right hand side here,
is a modern day 2.8 tire
or 27.5.
Now, if you compare that to a 29 inch wheel
with a 2.5 tire
and aggressive tread pattern,
you can see it's actually significantly higher.
So what then was a great characteristics
of these plus sized tires?
Well, they rolled faster,
and they offered more grip even with harder compounds
and lower profile tread patterns.
They're more comfortable
and also gave an element of bounce
their own micro suspension,
which is actually quite handy on the heavier bike.
(upbeat music)
They did, I suppose have their downsides
and some tires due to the thinner side walls,
have more punctures
and have less support in cornering,
but the quicker time, smoother riding
and increased grip was simply not enough
to focus people's attention.
And within a few years plus size was all but forgotten.
But let's not forget plus was really, really good.
In the words of one UK journalist,
"The best plus size bikes deliver more traction,
"more control and more comfort."
So I'm kind of wondering why did plus lose this popularity?
Was it because mountain bike journalists
and the mountain bike industry in general
had moved on to other things.
More gears, mixed wheel size, electric gears
and of course electric bikes.
That leaves me thinking,
are they still as fast
and as comfortable as grippy as ever before?
And is there a place for them?
(upbeat music)
So, to answer that question
and begin to understand
why plus size lost some of it's popularity?
We need to set a context because three or four years ago,
it was actually a lot of misunderstanding of wheel size
people are scared of wheel size change.
If you look at World Cup downhillers
from say 2015, 2016.
Many of them said that they would simply leave the sport
if it came to change a of wheel size
but today cross country racers,
even Enduro World Series winner, Sam Hill,
is on 29 inch wheels.
So even the professionals then took some time to adjust
to the changes in wheel size
for the mountain bike population as a whole,
27.5 plus was actually seen as a stepping stone to 29.
Today 29 inch wheels have become
much more widely accepted.
And part of the reason for that
is down to the plus size,
which is actually quite strange
because a 2.3, 29 inch wheel
is quite similar in height to 27.5
by three plus tire.
(upbeat music)
So question is, will the sun shine once more
on 27.5 plus wheel size?
Well, I think it will
I think the mountain bike industry
left that wheel size a little bit too soon.
We know that they are still as comfortable
and offers more as much grip as ever before.
But of course many people will be saying
are they still as fast?
Well, yes, I think they are
because the facts simply do not change.
The tests that many mountain bike journalists worldwide
did still hold true.
And even the one that my colleagues done
on GMBN ended on 27.5+ versus 27.5.
Those results still hold true.
The plus is still faster.
And another reason
I hope they make a come back is because
when my favorite tires, and one I use quite a lot
is actually the Maxxis High Roller 2.8
which can be considered as a plus size tire.
And let's face it,
many of the brands whether it be Schwalbe, Michelin or Maxxis
still make large volume tires.
Which is why most tire manufacturers
make different tread compounds
and tread patterns for certain conditions,
whether it be fire, road, smooth, single track
or technical downhill.
And in many ways, some of the testers
and brand managers were being a little bit unfair
because they were using specific tires
against a 27.5+ tire,
which at the time was merely an all around tire.
Now at this point,
for those who want to geek out,
we're going to take a deep dive and examine the numbers,
the weights and measures.
So if you're not that fussed about the numbers,
you might want to fast forward.
However, if you're after some facts
and maybe a performance advantage,
then keep on watching.
So let's begin again then
and look at some of the facts surrounding 27.5 plus
in terms of the weights
and the rim widths and the tyre compounds.
It's actually quite important to know these
because you might be wanting to swap
your 29 inch wheel
e-biked 27.5 plus because of all the benefits,
which we've already spoken about.
It's actually quite interesting to see,
where the specialized Levo has been in recent years.
In 2016, the bike had a 27.5 plus wheel
on there with three inch tires.
And then in 2017,
it moved to a 27.5 plus in 2.8.
Now, my current Levo
has actually moved up to 29 inch wheels
and I actually use a 2.5 Assegai on there
because of its incredibly aggressive tread pattern,
soft compound and sturdy sidewalls.
(upbeat music)
Let's begin them with a look at the different heights
of different wheel and tire combinations.
Now first of all,
if you compare,
a 27.5 wheel with a 2.8 tire
and an aggressive tread pattern,
to a three inch tire
with a shallow tread pattern,
you'll actually see this actually quite similar.
And then if you compare that same three inch 27.5 wheel
to a 29 inch wheel with a 2.3 inch tire,
you'll actually see that's quite similar as well.
However, when you go from a 29 inch 2.3,
up to a 2.5
the height is actually quite different.
So whereas the heights were similar in many respects,
it was the weight
that was the sticking point of 27.5 plus tires.
And many brands decided to make thinner side walls
for fear of making tires that were too heavy.
Of course, what I mentioned earlier,
what this led to was tires
that punctured quite easily,
and also had very little support
when leaned over in corners.
But really,
what they should have been thinking about
was the system weight
and not the weight of the tire in isolation.
So let's take a look then at some facts
because the system is the wheels,
the rotors, disks and tires.
Just out of interest I've weighed
the system weight of rear wheels from specialized Levo
from 2016 to 2017, to the current day Levo
Now, it's worth noting
that the Butcher tire from 2016
weighed 1045 grams,
so actually quite a lightweight three inch tire.
But when you weigh the systems
that incorporates the 200mm rotors,
the cassette, obviously of the wheels and tires combined,
all with tube setup
quite different now,
the 2016 system
weighs 2.9 kilograms.
The 2017 system
weighs 3.2.
However,
the modern-day version of the Levo wheel
with this setup and these rims,
remember, we've got 30 mil rim here
compared to the 38 mil rim previously,
weighs in at 2.7 kilos,
so it's actually the lightest system.
Even though this Maxxis Assegai tire
here weighs 1344 grams,
which puts it as the heaviest tire.
Let's now focus on the weight of different wheels.
(upbeat music)
Well, a pair of wheels without tires
can weigh anything from 1500 grams
for a set of trail wheels
to over two kilograms for a downhill set.
You also have the cassette and rotors
to take into account
which will be either about 360 grams
for a Shimano XTR or SRAM Eagle
to over 600 grams for a lower price cassette.
Now, compare that with tires
and you will see that a parent wheels
and a pair of tires can actually be about the same weight.
So what about if we compare the same wheel type
but in different sizes?
Well, a pair of Mavic Deemax Downhill
in 27.5 weighs in at 1990 grams,
whereas a set in 29 inch
only actually weighs 100 grams more.
If you look at some lightweight carbon
or trail wheels,
you could be looking at about 1500 grams for a pair.
But what about tires?
(upbeat music)
Now many people actually worry about the weight
of plus size tires.
But what are the facts?
Well, I've got a tire here.
It's the Maxxis Minion DHR II.
I've got in 2.3 and 2.8 in exactly
the same compound and tread pattern
and the weight differences while 804 grams with 2.3
and 980 grams
for the 2.8 version.
Now, that's actually under kilos.
So quite likely compare it to a tire,
which we use quite a lot of on the NBN
and that is the Maxxis Assegai
29 by 2.5.
And this weighs in at 1334 grams.
So as you can see quite a difference.
Now it shouldn't really be any surprise
that the Assegai is a heavier tire
because he's actually got a heavier duty sidewall to it.
This is a full on World Cup Downhill tire.
But what I've done now
is actually mount both tires
to a similar Mavic wheels,
although the Mavic on my right to the 29
is a Mavic Deemax Elite,
whereas the 27.5 Minion
is mounted to a Mavic Deemax Downhill.
And when you weigh these systems together,
they actually weigh exactly the same weight.
(upbeat music)
Now, what I didn't mention there
actually was that the 29 inch wheel
is actually mounted tubeless
whereas the Minion 27.5 was a tube version.
So there's obviously that take into account as well.
But here's where it gets really, really quite interesting.
Now the 29 inch wheel,
the outside diameter is 750 millimeters,
the 28 is actually 725.
Now that's going to make a huge, huge difference
to the handling of your bike
in terms of the bottom bracket height,
but I'm not going to bring out a 2016 Levo
which is got a 2.8 tire.
This is a 38 mil internal room weight
and as you can see, it's lower again
So, we've actually gone down to 715 here
or 715, 725 and 750 outside diameters.
(upbeat music)
It is important to take a look
at the weight of different types of tire.
Now a pair of Schwalbe Eddy Current
and soft compound weighs in at three kilos
and ask the guy 29, 2.6 for my Downhill versions,
and as I mentioned,
and the two kilos for a pair of Minion 2.8
which brings us back
to what many people found to be the characteristics
with bigger volume 2.83 inch tires,
and that was that a wider tire,
even in the hard compound provided more traction
and stronger braking,
than a narrow tire in a softer compound.
And of course,
with the added benefit of less rolling resistance,
plus harder wearing.
The problem was that even with all those benefits
many brand managers and journalists
did find plus tires to be less precise.
And part of the reason for that is because
they were doing that testing on tracks that they knew.
Now this is where I do believe
that plus still has a place,
because if you're doing general riding on tracks
that you don't know,
plus can significantly hide rider error.
Plus the cost, all those other factors
which I've discussed before,
such as comfort, speed, and grip.
Okay, a few final things to discuss about plus,
one thing is the tire pressures now.
Three or four years ago,
many brands are actually telling riders
to run less than 20 psi
if you got large maybe 2.8 or three tire,
which is actually quite ludicrous
because obviously the tire is going to squirm the corners.
I'm looking at this Minion
and exactly recommend 17 to 35
which is about right.
Now what about if you're thinking of switching to Plus size?
Well, the first thing to take into account
is will your frame be able to accommodate
that large capacity tire.
Secondly, don't forget that
there is going to be a significant change
in the geometry of your bike.
If you go from 29 to 27.5 plus, like I said,
there's a 25 millimeter difference in height of these tires.
Now, some bikes have actually got a flip chip on them,
which lets you switch between different wheel sizes,
but you need to check that out.
So I think that's about it.
It's quite obviously a complex subject
but let's know your thoughts on plus size
in the comments down below.
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