LYDIC: As the Black Lives Matter movement spreads
across the world,
many of us white people are wondering,
"Okay, I've watched all the Netflix documentaries.
How else can I fight racism?"
Luckily for us, there's Dr. David Campt,
a racial dialogue expert who teaches white people
how to be more effective anti-racists.
David's basically the white people whisperer,
and I was once his most prized student.
So, what are some things that white people
-tend to do wrong when... -Oh!
-Uh, sure. -Crocs with socks.
So, the method...
LYDIC: And I knew he'd be thrilled to hear from me.
Hey, Desi.
Hi, Dr. Campt. How are you?
What are you wearing?
Oh, this. Oh, this is a, um,
an indigenous Ghanaian textile.
It looks like kente cloth.
-Is this kente cloth? -Mm-hmm.
Uh-huh. So, I'm just telling you,
uh, I'm not offended by it,
but some people might feel like you're just wearing that
to, you know, cultural appropriation.
Done. It's off. It...
Consider it like it never even...
never even happened.
-Now it's on the floor. I should pick that up. -On the floor?
-That's disrespectful. So sorry. -Yeah.
-Where were we? -Well, we were just checking in
since it's been 18, 19 months since I talked to you last.
I think that the good thing
is we just have one of those friendships
where we just pick right up where we left off, you know?
Uh, well, I'm not sure we have one of those,
but how have you been?
I'm doing... I'm doing okay.
I have been, uh, checking in on all my black friends.
Do you have a lot of black friends?
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, I've never counted.
But, uh, I mean, there's Trevor,
Roy, Dulcé, Jaboukie.
You work with all them, right?
Yes, they're friends who I also work with.
How many black friends do you have outside of work?
-Well, there's you. -Well, I would be careful,
because you're not the only white friend
that might be calling.
A lot of what some people are doing,
they're going to their black friends,
expecting them to do all the education,
and people are tired of doing that.
Yeah, I would... I would never...
I would never do that.
Or they're kind of overconcerned
and are expecting people
to really have a traumatic experience
because they're having one.
Don't start out by you showing emotion
and trying to get them to join you in that emotion,
because they're not holding it the same way you are,
and that feels weird.
-Just feels... -Yeah, that would be weird.
(sobbing)
It's just so...
It's just so sad.
It's just like...
Oh, my God, I can't even imagine.
I guess I didn't think about it this way before,
-and now... -Oh, my God.
Listen, we're gonna let you have this moment by yourself.
By yourself, girl.
Don't-don't call your black friends crying.
Yeah, I-I see your point now.
I love your commitment to being an ally,
but how are you dealing with people in your family
who don't think racism is real?
Well, um...
Okay, so, start off with, um,
"Why are you so (bleep) racist?"
That is a question.
Um, what you want to try to do is to ask a question
that is less judgmental than that
about some experience they had.
Like, "What happened in your life
to make you see it that way?"
Okay. So, like,
"What happened in your life
to make you such a (bleep) racist?"
Okay.
First of all, the f-bomb thing
is probably, again, not as useful.
-But... -What if I don't agree with what they're saying?
Because I do have one extremely racist relative,
and I'm not gonna say his name.
But if there's one thing that I know about my cousin Biff,
it's that he's just not gonna change.
I think the most important
is talking to Biff
or whoever else in your family
has racist views,
because I can't talk to them.
Hold on, how'd you know his name was Biff?
I think it's important that we make efforts
at using good methods before we give up on people.
One of the ways that people alienate
is they do... they do mic drops.
They make some sort of profiling statement
that they think sounds good, and then they're like,
boom, drop the mic. Voilà.
And expect the person to just, like, crumble
in their brilliance.
That doesn't keep things open for more conversations.
What can we do to make sure
people continue to do this work
and that these conversations continue to happen?
Well, start talking
to your problematic friends and neighbors.
So, what we need y'all to do is to keep the channel open.
-Mm-hmm. -To really try to move somebody
might take a series of conversations,
so you want to engage them.
You want to ask questions.
You want to find some agreement
before you try to invite them to new thinking.
People don't like being corrected,
but they don't mind learning.
Great advice.
Dr. Campt, this has been so helpful.
I-I... Actually, I have a white friend
that I think could really benefit from your help.
-I'm gonna see if he can join us. -(ringing)
Hey! Oh, no.
Hey, Desi. Thanks for reaching out.
LYDIC: Yeah. Um...
I cannot do this again.
(mouthing)