I'm Dr. Paul Jenkins. A professional psychologist. Many of the psychologists
and therapists we see in the movies are not real. They're just pretending to
be. I'm going to take a look today at a therapy scene from monk and let you know
what I think about it as a real psychologist.
Monk is one of my favorite television shows about a police detective. He's an
investigator who is really amazingly good at solving crimes partially because
of his pathology. Monk has a condition that would probably qualify for
obsessive-compulsive disorder as a diagnosis. Maybe obsessive-compulsive
personality disorder. He's got a lot of funny things going on. And that's part of
the fun of the show. It also gets in his Lane causes some problems. And so, he
attends therapy sessions with a doctor who has known him for quite some time. In
this clip, we'll see an interaction between monk and his therapist. Let's
take a look.
-So, going with the flow? Good. -Already, I'm seeing things that are catching my
attention. I did a video not too long ago where I reacted to a therapy scene from
the movie What About Bob? Which is a hilarious show starring Bill Murray and
Richard Dreyfuss. And in that particular video, I commented about the formal stiff
kind of a setting that therapist was using. He was sitting behind a desk and
he had his secretary bring the patient in and introduce him and set him down.
And he was very cold and aloof. Already I'm seeing in this clip an entirely
different energy. You'll notice that they are sitting next to each other or in a
way that there's not a physical barrier between them like a desk or a table. It's
much more open. I also love the setting of this particular therapist space.
There's a very zen kind of a feel to it. You'll see that there's a fountain in
the background and there are plants around and in greenery. It's very
comfortable very soothing kind of a setting. I'm already liking this. As a
clinician this feels more therapeutic. And you'll also see in the interaction.
There's nothing cold or aloof about it. it's very friendly. They obviously know each
other and have worked together for quite some time as the banter would imply.
Let's see how this plays out.
-Good for you. You, you've been what....
Doing some consulting? -Yeah, in Santa Clara. I have an old friend there. -Notice
right here they have both glanced over to the side. First monk, then the
therapist. And I love that this therapist is tracking monk. He's watching him.
He's seen what he's tuned into. Now remember, they've been working together
for quite some time. He knows his patient very well. And so, when he saw monk look
over, you see then the therapists look over.
This is something also in the industry we call mirroring. Mirroring is basically
what we just talked about. You're observing and watching what's going on
with your client or patient and mirroring that on your side. So, in this
case, it's looking over to whatever's on this side of the office. We're going to see
what it is in just a minute. But it could also be posture. So, there are times when
a client will lean back in their chair and the therapist will lean back in
their chair. Or when they they leaned forward and then the therapist leans
forward. That's what we call mirroring and it's a way of showing empathy and
tracking that client. It usually happens very naturally. And experienced
clinicians will do this in a very skilled sort of a way. You see it all the
time. This is a good example. -I have an old friend there who's a second
lieutenant and called me in. -How that make you feel? I mean... You know, being
called in. -Interesting. How did that make you feel?
Classic. Probably stereotypical. In fact, that's what some of the jokes come from
in the therapy industry. And I think that's... We see this a lot in TV and movie
therapy scenes. "How did that make you feel?" And because it's almost a
stereotypical thing that a therapist would use. Instead of just leaving it
with how did that make you feel, he jumps in and clarifies. You know, the thing
that happened. And so, he gave him a little more context to work off of. It
made it feel a little less stiff or stereotypical. It's a way that we can
draw out the emotional experience. In therapy, a lot of times people get into
their head. They're up here, they're thinking about things. It's ideas
and concepts and philosophies. And a therapist very often wants to draw
people down to the core to the feeling level. And that's why that
question comes up a lot. So, it doesn't surprise me that it came up here. And
it's pretty indicative of what therapists are trying to do in a session.
Feels like old times.
-Again. There you see both of them look off to the side. And then the producers
of the show decided to show us here what they're looking at. And it's the pillows
on the couch. Now, what did you notice about the pillows? You may not have got a
good enough look at it. But this is distracting monk. Remember, he's got an
obsessive-compulsive personality. He's got some anxieties around everything
being in order and in place and where it needs to be. And one of the pillows is
not in place. You may not have noticed that. The therapist knows what he's
noticing because he knows monk. So, as he looks to the side again. It's an example
of the mirroring tracking where monk is with it. He's not going to just push
forward with the agenda because he knows that there's something going on. I love
that. Let's continue. -Back in the saddle.
-Well, do you think you're ready to go back full-time? No, I don't mean
consulting. You know, I mean, back on the force. -Yeah. -Now, they're continuing with
the topic of conversation. But I'm sure that this therapist has not ignored the
fact that monk is totally distracted with the pillow. So, they're talking about
getting back in the saddle, going back on the force. This is the
content. Now, something that happens in a therapeutic interaction, any interaction
really. There's a primary conversation and there's a secondary conversation. The
primary conversation is what we're talking about. So, in this case, it's
returning to work on the force or getting involved in that police work
again. The secondary conversation is the one that's there that everybody's aware
of but nobody's actually talking about. And that secondary conversation is
usually where the meat of things is happening. I'm guessing, I think we're
going to see soon that we're going to get to that secondary conversation. Because
that has to do with the processes that are driving the primary conversation as
well. Let's see where it goes. -Absolutely. Do you think I'm ready? -You
know, that's the question. -Are you okay? -I'm fine.
-You keep looking at that pillow. I mean, if you want to fix the pillow, it's okay.
You could fix it. -I was just saying about... No, I'm fine. -How are you sleeping? -Okay.
They've addressed the subject now. This obviously is the purpose for this
particular scene. To reflect that monk is still very tied into those obsessive-
compulsive patterns. That's not lost on the therapist. He sees it and he's
testing. I believe he's testing monk at this
point. Because he's telling, "Look, you can go fix the pillow if you want to."
It's like he's acknowledging that monk has seen it. But remember, they've got
some history together. So, they've worked on this before. Monk has tried to let go
of some of those obsessive-compulsive patterns. And so, he's like, "No." He's
insisting that he's okay. I think the therapist knows otherwise. I wonder if
the therapist set that up knowing who was coming to see him, knowing that he
would notice. Maybe putting it out of place just to test this dynamic and to
give an opportunity for the conversation. And therapists do this sometimes. Which
is totally fine. It's not some kind of a cruel practice that therapists have. They
simply want to make the the secondary conversation primary. Let's bring it up
so that we can actually talk about it. Now, I don't know and I can't remember
from the first time I saw this episode whether they actually get into a
discussion about that. But let's see what happens next and how this plays out.
-Well, Trudy and I were married for 7 years. It would be weird if I never
dreamt about her, right? You're testing me, aren't you? You...
-Okay, right there. Did you
notice that? Monk had the same thought that I just shared with you that this
therapist is testing him. He's trying to talk about the dreams in
his relationship with his life. But his mind is totally distracted by that
pillow. And everybody knows it. And now monk is wondering, "Oh, you're
testing me, aren't you?" -You left it like that on purpose. -Did I? -Okay. -So, the
therapist, "Did I?" He's not even going to admit it right now probably because he's
still testing monk. He could have just admitted it at that point if he did. But
he wants to see how monk is processing this. It can be kind of a game sometimes
in therapy. And again, I want to put this in the context of a relationship that's
already been established over quite a period of time between monk and this
therapist. They know each other. They've talked about these things before. I think
if this were happening in a first visit or in an early phase of therapy, it would
not be nearly as effective as what we're seeing here couched in the relationship.
-Okay. So, anyway, I've been feeling... Excuse me.
Okay, no big deal. I get a chuckle out of that. A couple of things that I noticed
there. Monk tried to go on. He can't. It's just in his personality. He has to do
something about it. He finally says, "Excuse me." He gets up and he goes and
takes care of the pillow. On his way back just for good measure he straightens out
some of the plants or the decorations there on the table.
And did you notice the therapist? Therapist is just looking at him like,
"Yeah, we're still in it, aren't we?" I mean, it's such a knowing look that
he's dealing with the same things that he has before. I've seen a couple of
other therapy scenes from this particular series. He acknowledges his
clients progress --the things that he's learned, the ground that he's covered. And
that is something that is very clear in the relationship too. But in this
particular scene, there's just that knowing look of, "Yeah, we're kind of still
there, aren't we?" I'm guessing that he did set it up that
he put that pillow out of place on purpose just to see how monk would
handle it. Monk did okay with it. But he's still got the issues like we all do. It's
fun to see depictions of what I do professionally in the media in
television and movies. If you have seen some things that you'd like me to react
to, send me a message or put something in the comments. I'd be happy to take a look.
And we've got a whole playlist here on how a psychologist reacts to things like
this. I hope you enjoy that as well.