( APPLAUSE )
WELCOME BACK.
FOLKS, MY NEXT GUEST IS A PROFESSOR OF AFRICAN AMERICAN
STUDIES AT VANDERBILT UNIVERSITY AND THE AUTHOR OF THE NEW BOOK,
"ENTERTAINING RACE: PERFORMING BLACKNESS IN AMERICA."
PLEASE WELCOME BACK TO "THE LATE SHOW," MICHAEL ERIC DYSON.
♪ ♪ ♪
( APPLAUSE )
ALWAYS NICE.
>> JON BATISTE.
>> Stephen: ALWAYS NICE TO HAVE YOU ON.
>> THAT BUBBLE GUM IS LOOKING HOT OVER THERE.
>> Stephen: ISN'T THAT GOOD?
ISN'T THAT GOOD?
NOW, SIR.
>> YES, SIR.
>> Stephen: WELCOME BACK.
>> THANK YOU, MY MAN.
>> Stephen: THE BOOK IS "ENTERTAINING RACE: PERFORMING
BLACKNESS IN AMERICA."
>> RIGHT.
>> Stephen: CONGRATULATIONS ON IT.
>> THANK YOU, MY FRIEND.
>> Stephen: YOU SAY--
>> THANK YOU.
>> Stephen: IT'S HEFTY.
IT'S HEFTY.
IT'S A BIG SUBJECT.
>> EXACTLY.
>> Stephen: YOU SAY THAT ENTERTAINING RACE IS A TRIPLE
ENTENDRE.
>> RIGHT.
>> Stephen: WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?
>> FIRST OF ALL, IT MEANS BLACK PEOPLE HAVE BEEN FORCED TO
ENTERTAIN FOR THE DOMINANT SOCIETY FROM THE TIME OF.
AT THE BEHEST OF SLAVE OWNERS.
SECOND, PEOPLE HAVE HAD TO ENTERTAIN THE IDEA OF RACE, TALK
ABOUT IT, SELLING WATER ON THE STREET OR LEMONADE OR BARB COUG
IN THE PARK AND BEING FORCED TO BE ACCOUNTABLE FOR THEIR
PRESENCE IN A WAY THAT IS UNRULY AND, YET, DEMANDED.
SO WE'VE HAD TO ENTERTAIN THE IDEAL OF RACE CONSTANTLY, EVEN
WHEN WE DIDN'T WANT TO.
AND THIRDLY, WE'VE HAD TO BE ENTERTAINING ABOUT HOW WE TALK
ABOUT RACE.
THERE'S A GREAT SUBJECT.
IT'S VERY COMPLICATED.
IT'S GOT A LOT OF NUANCE, AND IT'S GOT A LOT OF CONTROVERSY.
SO WE HAVE TO FIND WAYS TO GET BEYOND IT, THROUGH HUMOR,
THROUGH SELF-DEPRECATION, EXPLORATION TO GET TO THE ISSUES
THAT ARE THERE.
>> Stephen: WHAT DO YOU MEAN "PERFORMING BLACKNESS?"
HOW IS BLACKNESS PERFORMED?
>> IN MANY WAYS.
YOU HAVE ONE OF THE GREAT PERFORMERS OVER HERE, JON
BATISTE.
>> Stephen: AND THE WHOLE BAND.
>> AND THE ENTIRE BAND.
AND THE THING IS THAT PERFORMING BLACKNESS IS BOTH ABOUT
PROFESSIONAL ENTERTAINMENT, ABOUT SINGING AND DANCE, BUT
IT'S ALSO ABOUT THINKING AND ENGAGING IN A SOCIETY THAT
DOESN'T SEE YOU AS NECESSARILY EQUAL.
WHEN YOU GO TO WORK EVERY DAY, YOU HAVE TO PERFORM A SORT OF,
KIND OF BLACKNESS.
IN SPACES THAT ARE FOREIGN TO YOU AS A BLACK PERSON, HOW DO
YOU MAKE PEOPLE FEEL COMFORTABLE?
HOW DO YOU GET COMFORTABLE?
HOW DO YOU ADJUST YOURSELF TO THEM?
AND HOW DO YOU BRING THE TO TALGT OF WHYURE BEING INTO THAT
EXPERIENCE WITHOUT EITHER SAVAGING YOUR ANCESTRY, BUT ALSO
HONORING THE TRADITIONS TO WHICH YOU SPEAK?
>> Stephen: YOU PUT YOURSELF ON THE COVER THERE I NOTICED
( LAUGHS ) >> YOU WEREN'T AVAILABLE, SO I
HAD TO DO MYSELF, YOU KNOW.
>> Stephen: "ENTERTAINING RACE."
AND YOU'RE ON THE COVER.
DO YOU SEE YOURSELF AS-- WELL, FIRST OF ALL, HOW DO YOU DEFINED
"ENTERTAINER" AND ARE YOU AN ENTERTAINER IN A SENSE?
I KNOW YOU'RE AN ACADEMIC.
I KNOW YOU'RE A SCHOLAR.
YOU'RE A PUBLIC PHILOSOPHER IN A WAY.
IS THAT ALSO A FORM OF ENTERTAINMENT.
>> ABSOLUTELY.
WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE WORD "ENTERTAINMENT," ENTER, AND
TAINER," TO HOLD TOGETHER, INTERTWINE --
>> Stephen: WAS WHAT THE ROOT OF IT, BRINGING PEOPLE TOGETHER?
>> YES AND TO ENGAGE IN A DIALOGUE OR THINKING OF A
PARTICULAR SUBJECT.
THE YES, AS A SCHOLAR, MY STUDENTS CAN'T FALL ASLEEP.
I HAVE TO GO IN THERE AND SAY SOMETHING THAT'S INTERESTING AND
ENGAGING.
I CAN SAY WE TALKED ABOUT THE INSURRECTION OF SUBJUGATED..."
THAT'S GOLD.
BUT IF J.B.A. Z.SAY I REMEMBER VIVIDLY WHAT THESE TREES DID TO
ME,.
>> Stephen: IN YOUR NEW BOOK-- AND THIS IS WHERE IT'S GOING TO
GET CONTROVERSIAL FOR US.
>> OKAY.
>> Stephen: IN YOUR NEW BOOK YOU SAID, "BEYONCE IS THE
GREATEST ENTERTAINER THIS GLOBE HAS EVER SEEN."
I WILL-- I WILL-- WHY BEYONCE, AND THEN MY RESPONSE.
>> WELL, I MEAN, THINK ABOUT IT.
BEYONCE IS AN INCREDIBLE SINGER.
SHE'S AN INCREDIBLE PERFORMER.
SHE CHANNELS EFFORTLESSLY THE ANCESTRAL GRACE THAT HAS CLAIMED
HER BODY.
THE MAGIC OF BLACKNESS THAT SHE IS CONSTANTLY PUTTING FORTH.
THE PIPES ARE INCREDIBLE.
THE DANCING ON STAGE.
LOOK, I SAW MICHAEL JACKSON AT HIS HEIGHT, AN EXTRAORDINARY
PERFORMER.
MICHAEL WOULD DO HIS THING, YOU KNOW, AND HE WOULD AFTER TWO,
THREE SONGS, GO BACK, COME BACK.
SHE'S PERFORMING TWO HOURS NONSTOP.
SHE CAN SING.
SHE CAN DANCE.
MICHAEL'S VOCAL HEIGHT WAS FROM, SAY, 10 TO ABOUT 21.
BEYONCE'S IS NOW STRONG AT 40 AS IT EVER HAS BEEN AT 20.
SO WHEN I THINK ABOUT THE WAYS IN WHICH SHE CHANNELS BLACK
IDEAS, WHEN SHE CHANNELS AMERICAN IDEAS, WHEN SHE
CHANNELS WHAT IT MEANS TO BE A HUMAN BEING IN CONTEXT OF
HARMONY AND MELODY, GIRL GROUPS-- CHANNELING ALL OF THAT
BEAUTY AND POWER IN ONE BODY, AND THEN MAKING US BE RIVETTED
BY HER PERFORMANCE, I THINK SHE DOES SHE IS AN EXTRAORDINARY
PERSON.
( APPLAUSE ).
>> Stephen: I'M NOT GOING FIGHT YOU.
I'M NOT GOING TO FIGHT YOU.
THERE IS NO GREATER FAN OF BEYONCE THAN YOURS TRULY.
SHE'S A DEAR FRIEND AND I HOPE TO MEET HER SOME DAY.
PLEASE COME ON THE SHOW.
PLEASE, COME ON THE SHOW.
JON, YOU GUYS IN THE BAND, DO YOU HAVE ANY OPINION WHO THE IS
GREATEST ENTERTAINER OF ALL TIME OVER THERE?
>> Jon: YEAH, YEAH.
>> I'M GOING TO GO FOR PRINCE MYSELF.
( APPLAUSE ).
>> Stephen: OH, ALL RIGHT.
DEFEND YOURSELF.
>> PRINCE WAS AN EXTRAORDINARY ARTIST.
I WAS ON STAGE WITH PRINCE ONCE.
HE SAID, "I KNOW MR. DYSON CAN TALK, BUT CAN HE DANCE?"
I SAID, "SIR, YOU'RE TALKING TO ME?"
I GOT ON STAGE AND DANCED, ALONG WITH CEDRIC THE ENTERTAINER.
I LOVE PRINCE.
BUT WHEN YOU PUT IT ALL TOGETHER, SINCING, DANCING,
COMPOSING, EMBODYING LYRICS, BEYONCE IS UNCHALLENGED.
>> I SAY JAMES BROWN.
>> LOOK, JAMES BROWN WAS AMAZING.
THE FLUIDITY OF HIS MOVEMENT.
WAIT IN WHICH HE WAS ABLE TO EMBODY, THE BLACK ESTHETIC.
THE DRUM BECAME CENTRAL, THE PERCUSSIVE ELEMENT.
HE WAS AMAZING.
BUT, AGAIN, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE ABILITY TO SUSTAIN --
>> Stephen: GOT YOU, GOT YOU, GOT YOU.
ANYBODY ELSE?
LAMPLEY.
>> I LIKE LOUIS ARMSTRONG ♪ I SEE GREEN TREE ♪
LOOK, LOUIE ARMSTRONG WAS AMAZING.
>> Stephen: TRANSFORMATIONAL.
>> TRANSFORMATIONAL.
CHOSE, WHAT, JULY 4, 1900 TO BE BORN.
HE WASN'T REALLY BORN THAT DAY, BUT HE CHOSE THAT DAY BECAUSE
AMERICAN DEMOCRACY WAS BLOWN THROUGH HIS TRUMPET.
HE WAS A MAN OF EPIC CREATIVITY WHO WAS ABLE TO ARTICULATE THE
BLUES SENSIBILITY OF BLACK PEOPLE.
BUT BEYONCE...
( LAUGHTER ).
>> Stephen: WE'RE GOOD.
WE'RE GOOD.
LOOK, I'M NOT GOING TO-- INDIA YOU GOT ONE.
>> DUKE ELLINGTON.
>> I MEAN, DUKE, WITH THAT...
( LAUGHTER )
TAKING "A" TRAIN.
HE WAS ABLE TO COMPOSE THE INCREDIBLE VITALITY OF BLACK
ART.
HE WAS ABLE TO PULL IN JOHNNY HODGES OPT SAXOPHONE.
HE WAS ABLE TO GIVE A VOICE TO MANY SINGERS, INCLUDING SARAH
VAUGHN.
BUT, BEYONCE.
>> Stephen: NOW, LISTEN, I ONLY GOT TWO RESPONSES, I ONLY
GOT TWO RESPONSES TO THIS.
AND, AGAIN, BEYONCE, SHE'S MY SOUL CYCLE EMERGENCY CONTACT.
WE'RE SUPER TIGHT.
DOES THE WORD-- DO THE WORDS "SAMMY DAVIS JR." MEAN NOTHING
IN THIS TOWN ANYMORE?
>> I MEAN, SAMMY DAVIS JR. WAS A GENIUS SINCE FIVE YEARS OLD.
>> Stephen: SING, DANCE, ACT.
>> EVERYTHING.
HE WAS CAPABLE OF DOING THAT.
BUT WHEN I PUT BEYONCE NEXT TO SEAM DAVIS I THINK SHE'S CAPABLE
-- >> Stephen: DIANA ROSS, DIANA
ROSS.
IS THERE ANYONE TODAY WITH THE IMPACT OF DIANA ROSS?
COME ON, MY FRIEND, DIANA ROSS-- BEYONCE WAS FANTASTIC IN "DREAM
GIRLS."
WHAT A WONDERFUL PERFORMANCE.
YOU KNOW WHO SHE'S TRYING TO PLAY?
DIANA ROSS!
>> WAIT, I HAVE NO DOUBT DIANA ROSS-- DIANA ROSS, A--
( LAUGHTER )
EXQUISITE, FUSING WITH BARRY GORDIE'S MOTOWN.
I AM FROM DETROIT, MOTOWN FOUNDED IN 1959, DIANA ROSS
CLAIMING THE SWEET NUBILE TENDENCY OF BLACK FEMINIST AND
ARTICULATING THEM IN A POSTMODERN SPACE, BUT BEYONCE.
IS ABLE -- >> Stephen: JON, DO YOU HAVE
ANYTHING TO ADD?
>> LET'S LEAVE IT WITH JON.
JON WHAT DO YOU HAVE?
>> BEYONCE, THE COCHELLA PERFORMANCE.
SHE IS ONE OF MY HEROES.
AND ERAS ARE LIKE BASKETBALL.
THERE ARE GREATS IN EACH ERA, BUT IN THE NEXT 20 YEARS, I'M
COMING FOR ALL OF THEM.
( CHEERS AND APPLAUSE ).
( LAUGHING )
>> STEPHEN: "ENTERTAINING RACE" IS ON SALE NOW.
MICHAEL ERIC DYSON, EVERYBODY WE'LL BE RIGHT BACK.
♪ ♪ ♪