The Grand Seiko, I mean, it's this, the 'Snowflake.' I've always loved this watch. The Spring Drive
is something that really fascinated me because I was reading about how many years
into development it was before they were actually comfortable releasing it. And the movement of that
second hand, so smooth. It's, you know, only if you're into watches,
- you can understand the feeling [laughs]. - Totally.
[upbeat music]
Massimo Frascella, thank you for joining us, first off.
It's a pleasure.
Can you tell us a little bit about where we are and what you do here?
Right, so, we are in um, in the heart of the Jaguar Land Rover design studio.
So, here is where we design all Land Rover and all Jaguar vehicles.
We just very recently, in the last year, we have introduced two major vehicles --
the new Range Rover and the new Range Rover Sport.
We also introduced very recently the latest addition to the Defender family, the 130.
So you're the man responsible for bringing back an icon -- the Land Rover Defender.
Something that old with so much legacy and history tied up, it's so close to people's hearts.
And, really, it hadn't changed in quite a long time.
Exactly. But that's, that's the thing, you know? It is about acknowledging the past, but it is about looking forward all the time,
you know, evolving what we're doing and staying true to our DNA, but, you know, evolving to become relevant and to stay relevant
in a world that is changing fast.
So, this is an interesting jumping off point. And I'll pivot to watches.
Watches on the table, like the Royal Oak, the Daytona, the GMT Master -- we love them because they haven't changed.
But yet, we're talking about, we need to stay relevant. Do you think the same sort of philosophy from the car world
can apply to the watch world, or is it the opposite?
No, I think you can apply, if you think, you know, let's look at the Submariner. Um,
- you know, it's clear, the lineage, the evolution of the Submariner as a true Submariner. - Right.
You can see from the first generation of Submariner, but now, you have ceramic bezel, you know.
It's that level of implementation of technologies and material that makes it more relevant to a world today.
So, that's a perfect example, but it is the parallel with the automotive, you know, mechanical devices, you know,
there's the human genius in creating, you know, different scale, different size. Something that can work for a long time, you know,
watches, if you look after them, they can work.
Yeah, they'll outlive us.
Yeah. So, there is that parallel and I like the fact that um, they're both there to do a job, right?
There's a function behind, but ultimately, they become object of desire right? You just see them and you just,
you just want to have them.
So, let's actually jump right off and talk about uh, the watch that started it all.
Oh okay, so, my first watch was the TAG Heuer Kirium which I bought like over 20 years ago and at that point I was actually a bit like,
- gosh, why, why would I spend 600 dollars on a watch? - Right, yeah.
- I was at that level. - Yeah, of course.
And I wore that watch every single day for like uh, about 10 years, maybe a bit longer?
In the beginning of your career?
- Yes. - Wow.
Until I went to the watch that actually started everything that you seen today.
Um, so this watch was uh, I did like that watch, the design, the proportion of it, I know, and now,
it's a little bit particular given the, today's standard. But I like the integration of the rubber
into the the casing and the lugs. And I believe, um, the designer of this watch -- his name is
Jorg Hysek -- he's a German designer, I think is the same designer who designed the Vacheron Constantin 222.
- Mm, the 222, okay. - And you know if I stretch my imagination,
I can almost see some similarities in the, in the execution of the bezel, at least.
But this was a jumping off point to the next watch that kind of, you took the plunge.
Yes, right. So, that's the Panerai, the titanium Luminor.
- We're talking about eight years ago now. - Yeah.
My wife said, "Oh, when you get your promotion, I'll-," you know. I am from
Marina di Massa, a small village in Tuscany, not far from Florence, about an hour from Florence --
and she said, "Once you get your promotion at work, we'll go to Florence, the Panerai boutique, and
we'll get a Panerai," right? To celebrate the occasion. Ultimately, I wanted something very simple.
The Luminor is very iconic with a crown guard, and I remember in the end, I had to decide between the
one that I went for and the very simple one, the, the base one. And I remember one of the lady at
the store said "I would get this one because you know, you have the second hands and it
- gives you a sense of movement. You can see the watch moving." - Right, in motion, yeah.
And that's why I went for that, and this is a watch that I am particularly attached.
- And it's, it's fitting for uh, for an Italian to start with. - Of course. I, you know, I had to start
with an Italian watch, right? [laughs]
So, you started with the Panerai. And there's also another Italian watch on the table here --
- this Unimatic. - [chuckling]
What's the story behind this one?
This particular Unimatic has a really strong connection with me because I had been in the army
- for almost two years, just over two years in uh... - Wow.
back in the days, early in, early '90s now. And I was in a division of the army that is called "Alpini"
that uh, basically, has a service along the the Alps.
- Wow. So in Northern Italy. Okay. Yeah. - Protecting the border, yes.
So, this watch is celebrating that division, Alpini, you know, they're very famous in Italy for wearing this hat with the feather.
And, for me, that- when this came out, you know, being a collector of Unimatic in some form,
I said, I can't believe this is just the perfect match for me so I, I...
- So, you served in that division. - I served that, yeah. I was an officer.
Wow.
It's a long story, but that helped me to uh, you know,
- because you would get paid not, not just like a normal soldier. - Right.
And that was a mean for me to afford, later on, the design school.
So it's not like I necessarily wanted to be in the army,
- although I really enjoy every minute of it. - Of course. Yeah.
It was just a great experience, so this watch kind of celebrates that.
[upbeat acoustic music]
The first watch that really caught my attention as I was, you know, researching it was the, the Mark XI.
- For me, the Mark XI, - Yeah.
has a quality to it that is um, you know, it's just unique. That simplicity, uh, the clarity, the lack of ornament here,
it's just, you know, the raw finish and, you know, the way the hands are and
it's, there's something about this watch that really caught my attention.
So, I was able to find one through an auction, uh, this particular Mark XI has uh, what is called the "Hooked 7"
which is a particular version of that dial. This is from 1952.
And the condition is incredible. I do like, there is you can still see some sign of, you know,
- Use. Right. - past experiences, but you know,
it's, it's in a wonderful condition. So, this one led, actually, to another- this watch has the famous Caliber 89.
- Yeah. - This led to the next watch that I purchased which is
- a very different character. - Yeah.
Still IWC and, for me, the execution of the dial with that sort of gray bluish color, it gives that enough edge that you can wear in any occasion.
Yeah.
And again, it's got that wonderful caliber.
Yeah, if you look at it from that point that they both share the Caliber 89,
but the design expression is very different, but ultimately,
similar in the fact that they're very simple.
- Yes. - Yeah.
And simplicity is, is a theme that is very recurrent. Um, but then, there are a few watches here that actually are connected to
event -- work, personal, and you know, like, for instance,
this Royal Oak which has always been a holy grail for me. It stands for everything that, you know, what
design should be. You know, it's got that very sort of robust sophisticated approach.
There's uh, honesty incredible character, so distinctive, so simple at the same time. It's, it's about the
proportion, but it's about the details. I mean, this is just a, a piece of art before it is a watch.
Yeah.
And the story here, we went to Geneva to launch the Range Rover Velar in 2017
and I remember I was with a friend. I said, well, since we are in Geneva I would love to go to the Audemars Piguet boutique
and see if I can put a deposit on a Royal Oak. And then, as I was walking around the store, I recognized that reference
because of the AP at six o'clock so I called
the lady. I said, "Is this for sale?" and she looked at me and said, "Uh, well, if it's here, it is for sale."
So... [laughs] So, from going there to put a deposit, I ended up
- Walking out with a watch. - walking, yeah, walking out with it.
- And this one is also tied to a car launch. - Correct.
The Big Pilot is the watch that celebrate the Defender and clearly, the similarities in, in spirit...
This is a 110 or 130. This is not a 90 on the wrist that's for sure.
No, actually, the Mark XI, that's the 90.
- Yeah, yeah, that's right. The 90 here, and this is the extended wheel base. - Correct.
So, that's the 110, but yeah, the spirit of Defender you know, is there. This sort of a very honest, purposeful watch.
Um, you know, I love the proportion. Love the crown. I mean, how can you not love this watch? This is
something that, again, it really caught my attention in the early days of start looking at watches and
pairing it with Defender was just perfect.
And there's one Grand Seiko on the table, but it's not the Grand Seiko that most people know, the most modern iteration of Grand Seiko.
This is one that's signed Grand Seiko at six o'clock and Seiko at 12.
Yeah. The Grand Seiko, I mean, it's, this, the "Snowflake" -- I've always loved this watch. But when I found out that there was a new one
coming out removing the Seiko wording at the top and just having Grand Seiko, I initially felt, hmm,
the dial feels a bit unbalanced. So, I need to find a way to source one from the earlier generation. So,
I start calling around pretty much everywhere and eventually, through a colleague who works in
Tokyo, I managed to found probably what is the last one from the boutique in Ginza.
Wow.
And then, incidentally, this colleague was flying over to England two weeks later for a convention,
- so I said, well, it's a sign. [chuckles] It's a sign, you know? - Yeah. Gotta do it.
So, uh, yeah. I just think that this is a phenomenal watch. The finish, you know, titanium.
The level of details on the hands, the sharpness, the reflection, the dial itself -- I'm reading it's like six layers of paint to
achieve the texture the simulates the snow and the Spring Drive is something that really fascinate me because I was reading about
how many years into development it was before they were actually comfortable releasing it.
And the movement of that second hand, so smooth. It's, you know, only if you're into watches, can you understand the feeling.
Totally. I think that's almost a universal appeal, to watch something so precise and almost so perfect.
What I think is most interesting that you said is that you prefer the balance that this uh, being signed Seiko and Grand Seiko.
Because, obviously, they're moving away from that direction right? So, this is a very specific era.
- And to hear from a designer's perspective, - Yeah.
that there's a certain balance that's achieved.
That was the first thing that, I have to say, that I learned to like the new one as well.
Sure.
But I think, at first, for me, it was something missing. So, it did feel unbalanced and that's why I wanted to go try to find the, uh, the older one.
Speaking of balance, the 1016 Explorer. This is, I mean, you can put this thing on a scale and it'll balance, right? [laughing]
Yeah, I mean, this is the watch. You know, it's Rolex essence, talking again about the simplicity.
I love all Explorers, I love the new ones, but this just happened, again, I was in, on holidays
in my hometown in Tuscany and I met this person, Mauricio De Angeles who was a friend. He found this watch for me
and I just had to have it.
Yeah, totally.
And this is a watch that I truly enjoy wearing. Again, it's that, I love the fact that it's
so straightforward, you know? It's about being authentic, it's not about being with
ornaments or giving something that is superfluous. It's about this is what it does, it's a tool watch.
[steady piano beat]
So, there is a watch that I found on Instagram. Some, don't remember the name of the person, but
posted this watch for sale. I got in touch with him. Um, then, I found out about the history and
the link with the Olympic Games in Tokyo and I just love the mono-pusher
concept of the of the chronograph. Again, it's a testament to how many beautiful Seikos there are
and particularly, from this era -- the '60s and the '70s -- there is so much to, you know, to fall in love with, really.
And this is one of them.
And there is another watch that we can't ignore. We didn't talk about this one yet.
We didn't. Well, first of all, this is a gift from my wife for my 50th.
And it was also, let's say, wrapped it together with the launch of the new Range Rover that happened
uh within a couple of months. And it's a watch that I absolutely adore. I love the Aquanaut,
but this particular reference, I love the symmetry, the balance, again, in the design of the casing.
I love the quirkiness of some of the details of the textures on the dial. And I just love the
functionality of it. I think it's very clever, you know, the hour hand, when you when you travel, and
disappearing under the home.
- And I think it's- - Yeah. A little magic trick.
Yeah.
[steady piano beat]
And, lastly, there's a watch that I wanted to save for the end to ask you about, and that's
the watch on your wrist.
Oh, yes. The watch on my wrist is, actually, the last, the latest addition.
Um, so, this is a weekly calendar, Patek Philippe. It was brought to my attention a few months ago and
I really liked it, but when I first saw in person I had a very different perception of the watch and I
loved the handwriting. I love the Bohemian sort of touch to something that is so classy, right? So, this
is a Calatrava, but the handwriting takes an edge off the formality of a Calatrava. The two hands
that point at the day of the week, or the week of the year with the, you know, the hammerhead in red,
it just pops into the dial. There's something quite magical about this watch.
Yeah.
Massimo, it's been an honor and a pleasure. I've learned so much about the Defender,
which I'm personally interested in, and your incredible collection. You've amassed a crazy amount of watches in such a short amount of time
and I'm very excited to see what's next.
Thank you for having me here. It has been a pleasure talking to you and sharing my passion about watches
and where it's going next, we'll see. We'll see what's coming next and we'll see what will be out there to celebrate those events.
[upbeat music]