reason I want to create nor link was primarily as an offset to the
existential risk associated with artificial intelligence I think we will
hear intelligence will be not I mean will not be able to beat AI so then if
you know the saying goes we can't beat em join em kind of thing so they having
some there's some basic weight up to link you know human will on mass to the
outcome of AI having AI be an extension of individual human well that's really
the point of neural link now along the way I think they'll be a lot of good
that's in addressing any brain damage that's you know as a result of a stroke
or lesion or something congenital or just loss of memory when you get old
that kind of thing and you know that'll be hell to happen well before it it
becomes a sort of you know brain AI some buyout situation so if we play it you'll
see it coming okay everyone or what happened all of a
sudden Betty I do you think it increases the long-term relevance of human
exploration and yeah and yeah I think I think it's for me it increased my
motivation long-term that that it doesn't just need to be done by robots
working on AI and making sure it's great future that's that's the most important
thing I think right now the most pressing item so then obviously I think
Institute with genetics if you can actually solve genetic diseases if you
can prevent dementia or Alzheimer's or something like that that was genetic
reprogramming that would be wonderful so I think this
genetics it might be a sort of second most important item I think having a
high bandwidth interface to the brain like we're currently bandwidth-limited
we have a digital tertiary self in the form of our email capabilities like
computers phones applications we're effectively superhuman but we're
extremely bandwidth constrained in that interface between the cortex and you're
sort of that the tertiary digital form of yourself and having solve that
bandwidth constraint would would be I think very important for the future as
well what is the world that would we would like to be in where there is this
digital super intelligence I think the and another point that I think is really
important to appreciate is that we are all of us already our sidewalks so you
have a machine extension of yourself in the form of your your phone and your
computer and all your applications you are already superhuman but by far you
have a more powerful capability then press the United States had you know 30
years ago if you have an internet link you have an article of wisdom you can
communicate to millions of people you communicate to the rest of earth
instantly I mean these are magical powers
that didn't exist not that long ago so everyone is already superhuman and a
sidewalk the limitation is one of bandwidth so we're bandwidth constrained
particularly on output so our input is much better but our output is extremely
slow and if you want to be generous you could say maybe it's a few hundred bits
per second or a kilobyte or something like that output a bit you know the way
we output is like about little meat sticks that we move spray slowly and and
push buttons or tap tap a little screen and that's just extremely slow and
you know compare that to a computer which can communicate at the terabit
level it's a very big orders 92 differences that our input is much
better because of vision but even that could be enhanced significantly I think
I think the the two things that are needed for look for a good future that
we would look at and concluded is good most likely is we we have to solve that
bandwidth constraint with it with a direct neural interface I think a high
bandwidth interface to the cortex so that we can have a digital tertiary
layer that's more full of more fully symbiotic with with the rest of us like
we've got we got the cortex and the limbic system which seem to work
together pretty well they've got good bandwidth whereas the bandwidth to a
digital toshi layer is is weak so I think it's extremely important that it
be widespread and that we solve the bandwidth issue and if we do those
things then then it will be tied to our consciousness tied to our will tied to
the sum of individual human will and and everyone would have it so it would be
sort of still a relatively even playing field in fact it would be probably more
egalitarian than today one of the solutions is to have an AI layer if you
think of like you've got your limbic system your cortex and then digital
layer a sort of third layer above the cortex that could work well and
symbiotically with with you of course turning humans into cyborgs may sound
like the stuff of science fiction but then again that is Elon Musk's forte so
would he develop this kind of technology himself somebody's got to do it I'm not
saying that I will but I'm somebody's gonna do it I mean III mean I somebody
should do it and I mean if somebody doesn't do it then I then I think I
should probably do it we do know that it's called neural link and for more we
are joined by science journalist and futurist George divorce key who has been
covering this for Gizmodo George divorce key is in Oakville Ontario hello hello
thanks for having me this morning so what are you expecting Elon Musk to
announce later this week well I certainly expect some more details right
now the so called neural link is quite vague in terms of what this is what this
is supposed to look like what it's even supposed to do the site of course from
some of the comments that musk has made in recent months specifically though
what I am expecting to hear though will be I guess the initial approach towards
achieving this you know this these you know chips that will be implanted in our
brain and what we hope to accomplish with them initially it's it's quite
conceivable that nearly who will be working not to enhance or to even you
know add AI to our brains initially but you actually become therapeutic these
these same technologies can be used to treat say Alzheimer's or Parkinson's or
even seizures for example and I think that's a good pathway into this
particular area but knowing musk of course and knowing them the kinds of
visions that he has he's not going to be content to stop there and with the same
sorts of technologies you can now start to perhaps modify other aspects of
cognition things like memory and intelligence even for example
transmitting thoughts to and from a computer just with you know with your
with just thinking about it you could transmit your you know your memories and
your thoughts to a computer it's difficult to say if musk will get to
that level of specificity in his comments later this week but that's
certainly what I would probably looking out for this week well George that he
has ventures to develop something called neuro lace can you help us picture what
that is because he used the word lace there I'm imagining that it is going to
be a kind of mesh that will be overlaid over certain parts of the brain as we
know the brain isn't just this big piece of much that that does everything and
anything everywhere we our brains are broken down into different modules so
for example if you put this mesh array area around the motor cortex the area
that controls movement then this lace would pick up those signals when we say
for example I want to move my finger or I'd like to move my leg the lace will
pick up those signals and it will then transmit those signals I would hope
wirelessly because no one wants to have wires sticking out of their heads and we
already do have chips and animal models for
well that can transmit a wireless signals to a receiving device namely a
computer hence the list which is why we're using the word into interface here
so basically it would look like that kind of a mesh if not a mesh or the lace
could also conceivably be a literal chip a literal brain chip that's set again
rests at a specific area of the brain what we're talking about something
surgically implanted though eventually absolutely in order to get the kind of
fidelity the kind of you know this is the power of this of the signals to you
know move let's say an artificial arm or to even transmit our thoughts we're
gonna have to get right there into the brain I mean we do have what are called
EEG technologies today which is like a cap you can wear on your head but the
amount of information that can be extracted just through your electrical
signals externally is extremely minimal very I mean you might be able to make a
gesture like you're thinking of moving to the left or thinking of moving to the
right but no no if you if you want to get down to the to the levels that musk
is talking about we've got to get right into the brain itself well you know
we've got somebody waiting in the wings who's already using technology where the
brain can control a limb through you or the brain can control movement of a
machine so what would be different with this technology what would he really
want to use it for well I mean he wants to save the world apparently and I mean
right now he as I mentioned earlier there's going to be a therapeutic aspect
to it that's gonna be wonderful and he has listed this company as a it is
listed as a medical firm so they are going to be producing medical devices at
first and of course there this is a multi-million dollar industry so he
knows what he's doing by you know becoming one of the first to market here
but s musk has said you know artificial intelligence is progressing rapidly and
we're getting to the day maybe 20 years from now maybe 50 years from now but we
will get there eventually when artificial intelligence exceeds human
capacities in virtually every way and musk solution is an interesting one he's
not the first to suggest this other futurist have also suggested this is
that the best way for us to for us to be able to control and contain our
artificial intelligence is that if you can't beat them join them mentality and
we will merge with our machines so the idea here
that he literally believes that we can kind of save ourselves from perhaps
subjugation or some kind of an artificial intelligence disaster by
augmenting ourselves along with our artificial intelligence and that way we
kind of keep up with them should anything go askew in the future
do you see any resistance to this as most forward I most certainly I mean as
I'm sure that your listeners are aware that this issue is fraught with ethical
difficulties everything from how do you find test subjects who are willing to
have chips implanted into their brain or these meshes implanted into their brain
what kind of levels of consent can you get I mean at this point are humans
being treated as a means to an end in order to let's say stave off that the
threats posed by artificial intelligence what kind of animal motley at testing
would be required you know through these kinds of experiments and of course
there's the broader more philosophical question as to what this means to our
humanity what does it means to us as as humans you know for example this these
sorts of technologies don't just stand to improve our intelligence to let's say
Einsteinian levels where we are these mathematical logical geniuses these
technologies they they have the potential to utterly transform what we
are as humans in enter into the realm of the so-called posthuman in other words
this kind of entity that exists after humans and at this point we're talking
thousands if not even millions of times you know greater levels of capacity than
current humans so we have to ask ourselves right now how will these
technologies alter who we are as humans in what ways could that be a benefit in
what ways could that be detrimental so it opens up a whole you know whole area
of discussion